Although I've flashed non-phone devices in the past (routers, PAP2, Ipod classic, etc.) This is the first time I'm going to be flashing a SmartPhone that I've ordered which I should be getting very soon.
I ordered a Samsung Galaxy S II and have been crawling the forum trying to learn all I can before I try rooting and unlocking my phone when I get it. But I'm having trouble deciding on a few things.
Hopefully my question can become a guide for other new people who are just starting off like me.
Rooting:
To begin, I'm trying to figure out what's best for rooting.
I've looked at a few different methods..
Chainfire's direct method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1103399
lyriquidperfection's one-click method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1125414
CLShortFuse's one-click method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=803682
LitePro's ROM and Root method all-in-one: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1095274
All of these have their own merits. But I'm trying to figure out the best approach for myself.
Although Lightn'ing (LitePro's) looks interesting and I may try that ROM later, for now I want to avoid changing the ROM till I know I like the phone. So I'm looking at the first three choices.
The one that I think I would be able to do easiest is either lyriquidperfection's or CLShortFuse's methods as they both are one-click solutions and I just need to grab the right kernels.
I don't know if there's any reason I would want to go with Chainfire's instead of the two previously mentioned. If there is please let me know.
I asked this question on the respective threads but as of posting haven't gotten an answer of if there's any reason to flash the original kernel back after rooting and if I keep root if I flash it back.
I also don't know much about the use of Jigs to avoid the flash counter going up. Is there any reason I need to worry about the flash counter going up? Is there a limit on number of flashes on a phone?
Unlocking:
For unlocking I looked at:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1092451
However it seems for my specific phone (Virgin/Bell) we use this method as posted in the same thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=16482293#post16482293
This seems pretty much straight-forward. I just got to root the phone then get and run the app mentioned. Phone will crash/reboot and then no SIM lock.
If there's anything that seems wrong with this let me know please.
Other stuff:
At some stage here I want to be able to back up the stuff on the phone and get other typical tools.
I keep hearing about ClockWorkMod constantly and it seems to be a tool for backing up the phone data and making it easier to flash stuff in without use of ODIN.
I haven't found clear documentation on how I would do this on the SGII specifically.
I also here Titanium backup (sp?) is also a good idea to install at some point.
Is there other apps or otherwise I should be looking into before I start this journey into the wonderful world of hacked smartphones?
-This is a place marker for me making amendments so that later this may be more or less a guide for other beginners-
Dav_Edward said:
Although I've flashed non-phone devices in the past (routers, PAP2, Ipod classic, etc.) This is the first time I'm going to be flashing a SmartPhone that I've ordered which I should be getting very soon.
I ordered a Samsung Galaxy S II and have been crawling the forum trying to learn all I can before I try rooting and unlocking my phone when I get it. But I'm having trouble deciding on a few things.
Hopefully my question can become a guide for other new people who are just starting off like me.
Rooting:
To begin, I'm trying to figure out what's best for rooting.
I've looked at a few different methods..
Chainfire's direct method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1103399
lyriquidperfection's one-click method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1125414
CLShortFuse's one-click method: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=803682
LitePro's ROM and Root method all-in-one: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1095274
All of these have their own merits. But I'm trying to figure out the best approach for myself.
Chainfires simplest method less problems for most .
Root + CWM .
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1103399
I also don't know much about the use of Jigs to avoid the flash counter going up. Is there any reason I need to worry about the flash counter going up? Is there a limit on number of flashes on a phone?
Zero as Samsung will invalidate warranty for custom roms or rooted phones .
Other stuff:
At some stage here I want to be able to back up the stuff on the phone and get other typical tools.
I keep hearing about ClockWorkMod constantly and it seems to be a tool for backing up the phone data and making it easier to flash stuff in without use of ODIN.
I haven't found clear documentation on how I would do this on the SGII specifically.
Their is no documentation its probably written up in the FAQ or Wip but is a relativity simple tool anyway .Backup restore phones rom install custom rom wipe data factory reset reset battery stats to zero .
FAQ
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1065995
Wip
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1125282
I also here Titanium backup (sp?) is also a good idea to install at some point.
On a rooted phone Titanium pro allows you to back up your apps and also to freeze apps .
jje
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thorough stuff, props to you sir - you know search so you'll get your first thanks...
I would advice you to go with Chainfire's method. It's the easiest and most versatile method IMO. Definitely the best for beginners because you keep your stock ROM yet still are rooted and get Clockwork Mod.
The installed CWM (Clockwork Mod) Manager app with Chainfire's work is an easy way to see what it does - basically you can backup and restore your whole system/device, plus flash custom ROM/kernels/themes etc. Look into the flashing part later - baby steps are good here!
Titanium Backup is an excellent backup app for backing up/restoring apps and data, as opposed to the whole system. Buy the Pro version, definitely worth it.
I also like My Backup (also on Market), excellent for backing up contacts/SMS/MMS. The free version is a 30 day trial.
Can't help with unlocking, never needed to - sure others can help.
Good luck
Edit - JJ beat me too it, hadn't seen his post. Must type faster...
@JJEgan & @B3311, thanks for the useful information.
I was going to try those one-click methods because I thought those were the more newbie friendly methods. Thanks for the information to try using Chainfire's instead.
I will try using Chainfire's method instead with your advice when I get the phone. Having the tools like his CWM hopefully will make things easier.
I am a bit concerned though about his mention that Rom Loader won't work with his version of the build. I'd still like the ability to use custom roms down the road once I learn how to properly back up the phone so I can experiment with various roms till I find the one I like most.
Any advice about using rom loader or other possible difficulties using Chainfire's kernel?
Dav_Edward said:
@JJEgan & @B3311, thanks for the useful information.
I was going to try those one-click methods because I thought those were the more newbie friendly methods. Thanks for the information to try using Chainfire's instead.
I will try using Chainfire's method instead with your advice when I get the phone. Having the tools like his CWM hopefully will make things easier.
I am a bit concerned though about his mention that Rom Loader won't work with his version of the build. I'd still like the ability to use custom roms down the road once I learn how to properly back up the phone so I can experiment with various roms till I find the one I like most.
Any advice about using rom loader or other possible difficulties using Chainfire's kernel?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most just put custom rom on sd card and flash via CWM .
Sorry no nothing about Rom Loader .
jje
I would also advice using CF-Root. I was scared of rooting my phone, but after using CF-Root, I don’t know why I was so scared. The process took a little over 30 seconds (I need practice). To me at lease I think it’s the easiest method, you just need to make sure to download the right kernel.
EDIT:
Get a UBS jig, After rooting, I had the "yellow triangle" I turned off phone, removed battery, inserted jig, put back battery, entered download mode, restarted phone and no more "yellow triangle"
Related
I have just gotten myself a SG2, my first Android device.
I probably wouldn't want to root, at least so early, if it weren't for Root Call Blocker Pro which I want/need to install.
So I wanted to ask a couple of related questions:
1. Is there a way of rooting without losing all the apps + settings? If not, can you recommend a could backup app?
2. Could someone please point me to the EASIEST step-by-step guide on how to root a SG2? I have found a couple of threads but am not sure if they are the most up-to-date/best/most appropriate for a novice.
3. Will I be able to apply the official SG2 updates from Samsung after rooting? (OK, so that was three questions....)
Thanks!
hduty said:
I have just gotten myself a SG2, my first Android device.
I probably wouldn't want to root, at least so early, if it weren't for Root Call Blocker Pro which I want/need to install.
So I wanted to ask a couple of related questions:
1. Is there a way of rooting without losing all the apps + settings?
Should not wipe
If not, can you recommend a could backup app?
Titanium backup Pro.
2. Could someone please point me to the EASIEST step-by-step guide on how to root a SG2? I have found a couple of threads but am not sure if they are the most up-to-date/best/most appropriate for a novice.
Root + CWM the one the majority use .
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1103399
3. Will I be able to apply the official SG2 updates from Samsung after rooting? (OK, so that was three questions....)
Possible usually .
jje
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hduty said:
2. Could someone please point me to the EASIEST step-by-step guide on how to root a SG2? I have found a couple of threads but am not sure if they are the most up-to-date/best/most appropriate for a novice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what you need - failsafe
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1126522
Hi everyone. I also have a question regarding stock rom. I know that you'll say I am an idiot but stock rom is deodexed, right?
Sent from my GT-I9100
Thanks for the replies!
@B3311
Now THAT is detailed!
A follow up question though:
Exactly how does this rooting work under the hood? Why do we need to look for a compatible file that we then use to replace.... what?
Octavius69 said:
Hi everyone. I also have a question regarding stock rom. I know that you'll say I am an idiot but stock rom is deodexed, right?
Sent from my GT-I9100
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stock rom directly from samsung is odexed.
hduty said:
Thanks for the replies!
@B3311
Now THAT is detailed!
A follow up question though:
Exactly how does this rooting work under the hood? Why do we need to look for a compatible file that we then use to replace.... what?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rooting using CF-root replaces the phones kernel (core of the OS) with a modified one, with clockworkmod recovery (nandroid backup, etc), it also includes insecure adb (adb that can run as root not just standard user) and copy's the superuser apk to the system dir and sets permissions.
This is all done via a special initramfs attached to an otherwise stock kernel.
why would you want to root and then use OTA stock roms?
If you find you can't get OTA stock updates after a root (i.e. if Samsung decide to utilise some mad kernel reset counter ban hammer) then simply check XDA where I guarantee the OTA stcks will appear pretty quickly!
Things to consider:
1. Rooting is very very good for numerous reasons that can be found everywhere on XDA - and google.
2. You can replace the kernel for root but continue to use stock rom (and use a jig to replace the reset counters) for pretty much stock functionality.
3. If you root and don't like what you get (i.e. you're mental) then it is just as easy to replace all factory rom/kernel information (which are always available in the original development thread) but you should invest in a jig (from ebay) so you can reset the counters (you can do this via software but I find a jig far simpler).
What JJEgan said.
Rooting won't lose your apps. Titanium Backup Pro is the best way to go.
Install Kies, exit Kies, open Odin, phone in download mode + plug it in, don't touch any of the Odin settings, load "PDA" with chainfire's kernel -> go!
It's really straightforward, but it can be a little nerve wracking the first time.
Thanks a lot guys!
I just rooted, and it "only" took me about 15 min including the downloading of the various files (still way more though than the 30 sec. it should take according to the Chainfire post!! ).
@m4rshall's summary made it clear that the steps are really very few and simple, because when you read the other posts, it seems like a much more complex process due to their size, though they are absolutely necessary to get all the details.
Some follow up questions:
1. What would I need to do if I wanted to the original, factory state?
Not that I'm planning to, but in case I notice some issue that makes me decide to go back (I read in that loooong thread that some people noticed slower connections after rooting??)?
2. From what I've gathered, the yellow exclamation mark at boot is purely "cosmetic" and does not effect in any way at all the performance of the device. Correct?
3. The USB jig: exactly what does it do?? How does it do its magic?? How is it different from a normal cable? Are they only used for Android rooting?
Thanks again!
hduty said:
Thanks a lot guys!
1. What would I need to do if I wanted to the original, factory state?
flash your original rom via odin
Not that I'm planning to, but in case I notice some issue that makes me decide to go back (I read in that loooong thread that some people noticed slower connections after rooting??)?
nonsense
2. From what I've gathered, the yellow exclamation mark at boot is purely "cosmetic" and does not effect in any way at all the performance of the device. Correct?
Yes USB jig will remove it
3. The USB jig: exactly what does it do?? How does it do its magic?? How is it different from a normal cable? Are they only used for Android rooting?
Nothing to do with rooting it was developed to recover from failed download mode .
Details are
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1068522
jje
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks JJEgan!
One last question: I already figured out that superuser lists all apps that have root access. But what does CWM do?
hduty said:
Thanks JJEgan!
One last question: I already figured out that superuser lists all apps that have root access. But what does CWM do?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Clockworkmod recovery is a replacement recovery, it allows you to preform full device snapshot backups, to allow you to restore your phone to any point in time.
Allows you to flash CWM compatible zips.
Mount your SD to a computer while in recovery to copy things to it.
Okay so I checked it out and it looks easy to root this phone but I want to put clockworkmod on the phone so that I can make custom backups. I am a little confused it looks like this phone has a download mode where I can do my flashing without CWM is that correct? If I understand right I have to download or flash a custom kernel with temp root permissions in order to install CWM, then from there I can use superoneclick to root permanantly. So then do I go back to the original kernel or a custom one if I like? Do I need CWM to install custom ROMS or can I just use this download mode? I am sorry for all the questions this is only my second samart phone actually third but I dont really count the Blackberry curve 2g. I never rooted my g2x till after it got its gingerbread update so I never used superoneclick I just had to use nvflash to install CWM then flash a custom ROM so this is a little different to me. I see there is alot of dev stuff for this phone and I cant wait to get started but I want to make sure I do it right. I saw a few other methods for root but since I want cwm anyway I figure just use superoneclick. Also if I hold vol down+home+power then my phone will do a factory reset right? unless I install CWM then it will boot into cwm right? Sorry to ask all these questions I just need alittle bit more info before I start I am very nosy and I like to understand fully what I am doing and how it works. so anyone with any helpful advice on this phone please chime in I would like to know all the tips tricks and shorcuts that this phone has. Thanks in advance and again it is nice to join a new fourm.
Charlie
Tl;dr; there's a Q&A thread with your answers.
Have a look for cf-root, its got everything you need and easy to follow instructions
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
As per seanicca above, you need CF root which is both rooting and CWM in one flash (using Odin).
Look at the xda bookmarks in my sig for a link and just read the instructions in the thread. It's a couple of minutes and it's done.
So what is this flash counter I keep reading about? Samsung actually put a counter in the phone to see how much flashing goes on? I still cant belive this phone has its own flash mode basically. I dont know that much about phones maybe that is a normal feature but I dont think so.
mojorisin7178 said:
So what is this flash counter I keep reading about? Samsung actually put a counter in the phone to see how much flashing goes on? I still cant belive this phone has its own flash mode basically. I dont know that much about phones maybe that is a normal feature but I dont think so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right - it's not a normal feature. I've never had it on a phone before the S2, but I'm sure it must have been around before. I've heard of some suppliers refusing to repair or replace phones that have a flash count on them, but I've also heard of an equal amount that don't care and ignore or don't know about it.
As you'll see all over the place on this forum there's 2 ways to get rid of it. 1 reflash a stock kernel, or 2 use a usb jig. I've gone down the 2nd route as it was only a few quid and is just quick and easy.
Hey guys.
Getting my GSII in a few days and my first task is too root & flash a new rom.
As the bootloader is unlocked on this, can I just flash CWM onto it, make a nandroid backup and install a new rom. In this case Hyperdroid. Will this work fine and then I can use superoneclick to root it.
I am coming from a Wildfire S so I am assuming there is a different way to do all this. Just want to see if I have the main concept correct
Best way is to read all the How to Threads!
IMHO the easiest way is to flash a CWM Kernel then nandroid then flash your ROM of choice.
Try these two threads to get you started.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1134290
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1103399
Thanks for the help, I have knowledge in flashing etc, but coming from an entirely different phone I thought I would be safe and ask making sure I had the same idea of doing it.
I need advise on whether I should root my GS3 and thinking of flashing CM10.1 or just wait to see if the Sudden Death Syndrome (SDS) passes my device.
Thing is I'm afraid to void my warranty. Not a big deal but a warranty is always good to have. What's your advise on this matter?
Also, total noob question, what would be the easiest way to root and flash CM10.1? It isn't exactly a one click process like jailbreaking an iPhone and this is my first Android powered device so yeah.
What advise u need ?
Got my SIII yesterday open the box used this toolkit http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1703488 to root and flash CWM and then Omega Rom, All the process took me approx 30 Mins including the Rom DL.
if u want to return the phone for warranty u can always flash the Stock Rom.
Hope i helped.
rkkaranrk said:
What advise u need ?
Got my SIII yesterday open the box used this toolkit http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1703488 to root and flash CWM and then Omega Rom, All the process took me approx 30 Mins including the Rom DL.
if u want to return the phone for warranty u can always flash the Stock Rom.
Hope i helped.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well rooting and flashing custom rom doesn't seem to be as safe as jailbreaking an iPhone. I can't seem to find threads for CM10.1 and how stable that ROM is. I am still feeling insecure in rooting and all that.
The flashing stock rom is also a bit foreign to me! Where do I get stock rom? and if I root there will be that system modified thing on Samsung phones right? it's all these things that makes me think twice..
Well rooting and flashing custom rom doesn't seem to be as safe as jailbreaking an iPhone. I can't seem to find threads for CM10.1 and how stable that ROM is. I am still feeling insecure in rooting and all that.
The flashing stock rom is also a bit foreign to me! Where do I get stock rom? and if I root there will be that system modified thing on Samsung phones right? it's all these things that makes me think twice..
Read the BASICS before you start .
Flashing and root are not risk free its your choice .
Risk is vastly increased by refusing to read/follow instructions .Millions of safe flashes by XDA members .
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1927113
jje
JJEgan said:
Well rooting and flashing custom rom doesn't seem to be as safe as jailbreaking an iPhone. I can't seem to find threads for CM10.1 and how stable that ROM is. I am still feeling insecure in rooting and all that.
The flashing stock rom is also a bit foreign to me! Where do I get stock rom? and if I root there will be that system modified thing on Samsung phones right? it's all these things that makes me think twice..
Read the BASICS before you start .
Flashing and root are not risk free its your choice .
Risk is vastly increased by refusing to read/follow instructions .Millions of safe flashes by XDA members .
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1927113
jje
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've gotten myself into a bit of a problem now. I used ChainFire's exynos exploit patch a while back and I am unable to get root when trying to use heimdall. I'm on a Mac so that was the first thing that came up. Ideas?
PS. Heimdall says it worked perfectly but when I go into recovery, it's androids recovery with a red triangle thin in the centre. I'm now not rooted, and system says I'm modified. So I'm screwed left and right. No CWM Recovery, no SuperSU, and I'm flat out of ideas. I though turning on USB debugging would help but sadly didn't. I don't even know how to reverse the process to have my system status showing normal too!
Damn this...all because of stupid me patching
I have solved this problem I think last night by updating to XXEMB1 on Kies last night - I have of course lost root for the moment but will get back to that later when I have more time
I have an international galaxy gt19300
It had begun to restart itself a few times a day and then would run for days with no issues
I eventually decided to root it when I found the new toolkit on here which seemed to work a treat
I now had superuser installaed titanium back up and ROM Toolboxand paid for pro versions of this and toolkit
to be honest apart from doing one back up using the toolkit the only other thing I did was to disable the auto scanning on start up to speed up booting the phone. A day or two after this the problems started again but this time with it no rebooting but just freezing. Eventually I took out the sd card as I remembered I had an sd card problem with my old S2 - though this is a new samsung sd card. At first I thought that was it but then a bit later it froze while i was browsing the app store and has done so periodically, though today it ran all day without freezing onvce. Then suddenly it froze again for no reason - I was just swithcing screens and it froze part way through the process
As far as I can see I have three options
1) Flash a new ROM (for the moment I am still using the stock rom having only just rooted it using Toolkit.exe from here) but not sure which one I should use so need reccommendations
2) Use the toolkit to download a stock odin flashable rom (but dont I have this already?) and then 3 reset the flash counter using triangle away (seems risky to me) install the stock rom , undo root (if necessary) and then return the phone to Samsung
3) go to Kies and install the latest update in the hope that the problem will go away - though if S User pro doesnt manage to keep root I wiill presumably have to re-root all over again.
What attracted me to S3 Toolkit was that it packaged up all sorts of options into one easy package - on the other hand this may have made me a little over confident with rooting. If I hadnt rooted it the earlier problem, though not as bad, would still have been there but I could easily have sent it back to Amazon UK or Samsung UK for repair and replacement.
My biggest worry at the moment is that whichever process I go for - or even a third option suggested here - there must be a risk that the phone might lock up during flashing or upgrade - probably not likely as it didnt when I restored the back up I had done (didnt help either) and the touch wiz ui wont be running
Anyway would really appreciate some help guys - even if it is only what you would do in the same circumstances. I guess I should have tried to have the problem fixed but earlier I put that down to maybe having too many apps and crapware and thougth rooting would help me solve it. I have unintstalled every app that I dont regularly use but it is still happening
gbswales said:
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all you have to be aware of the fact that rooting & flashing ROMs is always a risk, toolkit or not.
The safest way is to stay un-rooted stock if you do not know why you need root in the first place. If you know you need root, and actually also before, read the guides & information in the stickies under the General section as they explain you in detail how to root, un-root, use triangle away etc.
As for your situation, I would try to 1) flash another kernel than the stock one, if this does not work, 2) flash the most up-to-date stock ROM (you can get it here on XDA or sammobile.com) via Odin or Mobile Odin, not the toolkit (Odin is as simple as the toolkit if you follow the how-to), if this also does not work 3) try a custom rom, and if it also does not work 4) return back to stock and give it to Samsung service centre.
I wish you good luck!
Thanks for your advice
chrismast said:
First of all you have to be aware of the fact that rooting & flashing ROMs is always a risk, toolkit or not.
The safest way is to stay un-rooted stock if you do not know why you need root in the first place. If you know you need root, and actually also before, read the guides & information in the stickies under the General section as they explain you in detail how to root, un-root, use triangle away etc.
As for your situation, I would try to 1) flash another kernel than the stock one, if this does not work, 2) flash the most up-to-date stock ROM (you can get it here on XDA or sammobile.com) via Odin or Mobile Odin, not the toolkit (Odin is as simple as the toolkit if you follow the how-to), if this also does not work 3) try a custom rom, and if it also does not work 4) return back to stock and give it to Samsung service centre.
I wish you good luck!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Firstly the good news is that it turned out to be a problem with the last XXELLA upgrade - I found a new one on KIES ran the update and it is fine
Of course I lost root access but expected that anyway.
I do enjoy tinkering with Systems and although I know my way around Windows I have not tried with Android until now - this is my second Galaxy so was naturally wary of bricking it if I rooted. Christmas time I bought myself a galaxy tab 2 10.1 with the express aim of rooting it and was prepared to take the risk - after a few false starts I got it rooted fine - was still wary of the phone but once the kit came out the benefit that has for me is the way you have to check things step by step systematically as you do things - my problem with doing stuff from instructions on line is that I find it is all to easy to skip a step (which I did with the tab first time around) Also with it being a system I haven't explored before I like having a step by step approach which is the same way that I learned DOS way back in time.
I do want to try some different ROMs on it to see what they offer and I would really have liked to have got some apps running from my external SD card and I also like having a complete image back up (as I have for Windows 8) so that in the event of a serious issue it is easy to wipe all and restore from new (I keep several images which I make on a weekly basis so that I don't have to re-install everything.
I confess to playing with computers and devices as a hobby - evidence of this was the 350 apps I had installed before I started purging them in case that was the cause of the problem. I pretty nearly try every new app I find just to see what it does and so there being a whole range of apps that I couldn't install without root access upset me. I am not going to rush to root again and will at least wait until the current version has been on the phone a while - just to make sure the XXEMB1 version is stable now - it has a lot of new admin features to keep me amused for a while!
Two things that disappointed me about root were that it looked as if I couldn't overclock the device to improve speed - the main CPU bar was already on max (though I didn't have time to explore more than that) and that it still seemed pretty hard , if possible at all on the hardware, to run apps from the external SD card -- as I do now with windows (using a smaller SSD ) I will have to be a bit more prudent about uninstalling the apps I find I don't really use.
I guess deep down the main reason why I want root is I don't like any manufacturer telling me what I can and cannot do with the device I paid for - one thing I did try was installing Linux but that didn't quite get finished before I lost root access.
Your advice however is very sound for people who don't like or enjoy tinkering or taking risks and I don't think I would recommend any normal phone user to root their device.
Thanks again
Just to add quickly....to overclock you need to flash a kernel that supports it.....And know what you are doing before doing it