Ok guys, before you start flaming, bear with me:
First of all, to get it out of the way, with the advent of 2nd init, a locked bootloader no longer prevents custom roms (CM7 2.3.4 runs fine on Defy and Droid X even though they only come with 2.2).
However, by having a locked bootloader, it is impossible for the user to hard-brick their device as no matter how bad you screw up, you can still always flash an SBF to recover. This would not be the case with an unlocked bootloader where someone accidentally overwrote their bl.
Thoughts?
<FLAMESUITON>
I don't believe so. How would someone accidentaly overwrite their bootloader? The person flashing a new kernel will understand the risks involved with tweaking all this low level stuff.
How often do you ever see someone totally brick their device from flashing kernels?
no
never a good thnig
LOTS of bricks were produced because people trying to unlock this thing
Sinful Animosity said:
I don't believe so. How would someone accidentaly overwrite their bootloader? ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lsxrx7 said:
...
LOTS of bricks were produced because people trying to unlock this thing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's one way LOL
Sinful Animosity said:
The person flashing a new kernel will understand the risks involved with tweaking all this low level stuff.
How often do you ever see someone totally brick their device from flashing kernels?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't really believe that, do you?
The by and large majority of users on this forum have very little understanding of what they're doing and are merely following the instructions posted. And I have seen plenty of "somebody please help me - I can't boot my device" threads!
Granted, a locked bootloader posses some difficulties/challenges for the true developers, but I'm coming around to the opinion that it also serves as a much needed buffer to the type of community that has become the norm on here. Just look at what's been going on in the dev forum since the Atrix came out: an experienced dev will start a thread, then 1k noobs post "is it done yet", or better yet start "demanding" support/results. The dev gets frustrated/irritated, voices his opinion, gets flamed, and moves to a different device. This has nothing to do with the locked bootloader (Moto Defy with a locked bootloader is now in the top 10 most installed/used devices for cyanogenmod), but more to do with the community/attitude...
Over the last few days alone, I have seen/been involved with at least a dozen bricks where a locked bootloader has saved someone's but and helped keep end-user device costs down (warranty).
Arg! I just don't know what to think anymore...
dew.man said:
That's one way LOL
You don't really believe that, do you?
The by and large majority of users on this forum have very little understanding of what they're doing and are merely following the instructions posted. And I have seen plenty of "somebody please help me - I can't boot my device" threads!
Granted, a locked bootloader posses some difficulties/challenges for the true developers, but I'm coming around to the opinion that it also serves as a much needed buffer to the type of community that has become the norm on here. Just look at what's been going on in the dev forum since the Atrix came out: an experienced dev will start a thread, then 1k noobs post "is it done yet", or better yet start "demanding" support/results. The dev gets frustrated/irritated, voices his opinion, gets flamed, and moves to a different device. This has nothing to do with the locked bootloader (Moto Defy with a locked bootloader is now in the top 10 most installed/used devices for cyanogenmod), but more to do with the community/attitude...
Over the last few days alone, I have seen/been involved with at least a dozen bricks where a locked bootloader has saved someone's but and helped keep end-user device costs down (warranty).
Arg! I just don't know what to think anymore...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea but the only reason they were " saved by the boot loader" is because it's locked in the first place and they're trying to unlock it.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
Clienterror said:
Yea but the only reason they were " saved by the boot loader" is because it's locked in the first place and they're trying to unlock it.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No you misunderstood - the soft-bricks that I've dealt with this weekend were on different devices with inexperienced people trying to flash their devices and missing a step here or using a wrong file there...
dew.man said:
No you misunderstood - the soft-bricks that I've dealt with this weekend were on different devices with inexperienced people trying to flash their devices and missing a step here or using a wrong file there...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's their fault. The guidelines are there, and it's the persons responsibility to know if something is going to brick their device, and it's their responsibility to follow all the instructions completely. Now, sometimes, the devs post some crappy tutorial, and it's a possible brick.
If they're on XDA, they know the risks.
Signed bootloaders present nothing but problems.
PixoNova said:
That's their fault. The guidelines are there, and it's the persons responsibility to know if something is going to brick their device, and it's their responsibility to follow all the instructions completely. Now, sometimes, the devs post some crappy tutorial, and it's a possible brick.
If they're on XDA, they know the risks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not making excuses for them! Merely pointing out that the locked bootloader does not necessarily hamper customization, but does help keep device costs down.
dew.man said:
Not making excuses for them! Merely pointing out that the locked bootloader does not necessarily hamper customization, but does help keep device costs down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does hamper it down. Imagine a Samsung Captivate without the lagfix. I would've returned mine longggg ago if it hadn't been for that. That's not available with a locked bootloader.
PixoNova said:
It does hamper it down. Imagine a Samsung Captivate without the lagfix. I would've returned mine longggg ago if it hadn't been for that. That's not available with a locked bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not familiar with with Captivate, but I have a hard time believing that it could not have been fixed even with the locked bootloader. Why not? Heck, we can now overclock a locked kernel?
dew.man said:
Not familiar with with Captivate, but I have a hard time believing that it could not have been fixed even with the locked bootloader. Why not? Heck, we can now overclock a locked kernel?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Kernel modules. Ours isn't functional just yet though. Still interacts with the kernel, it just isn't native.
And I don't believe converting all partitions to ext4 is possible without low level access.
Yes I know there have been a million people asking about bootloader unlocking and that it can only be done by the official tool. If you have ever owned any HTC device released within the last year you would have heard the same thing until rEVOlutionary came along and discovered a way to come up with a tool that would allow locking and unlocking of the bootloaders in many HTC devices. I understand we are dealing with a different animal here, so rather than ask for the millionth time if there is a way to unlock it and relock it alternatively, I am asking we bring some of our best minds here and see if there is a way to modify the already provided tool for us, or to come up with an alternative way to achieve this.
"Yeah, you think that we havent thought of trying? This thread is a waste!"
some people might say, but I am trying to get an organized effort here. I am no way a dev for any platform, but I am a well experienced android user that would like to at least try to unify the great minds here and see what they can come up with if they put their heads together. If this is in the wrong section please move it. Thanks!
speedysilwady said:
Yes I know there have been a million people asking about bootloader unlocking and that it can only be done by the official tool. If you have ever owned any HTC device released within the last year you would have heard the same thing until rEVOlutionary came along and discovered a way to come up with a tool that would allow locking and unlocking of the bootloaders in many HTC devices. I understand we are dealing with a different animal here, so rather than ask for the millionth time if there is a way to unlock it and relock it alternatively, I am asking we bring some of our best minds here and see if there is a way to modify the already provided tool for us, or to come up with an alternative way to achieve this.
"Yeah, you think that we havent thought of trying? This thread is a waste!"
some people might say, but I am trying to get an organized effort here. I am no way a dev for any platform, but I am a well experienced android user that would like to at least try to unify the great minds here and see what they can come up with if they put their heads together. If this is in the wrong section please move it. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC Bootloaders were only signed, the tf201 bootloader seems to actually be encrypted this time around
Deltaechoe said:
HTC Bootloaders were only signed, the tf201 bootloader seems to actually be encrypted this time around
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasnt aware of that, but I think there were a few devices who had super tight security on their bootloaders as well, no sure about whether they were encrypted or signed but I will try to do some research and post and see if and how any encrypted bootloaders managed to be unlocked.
From what I've read, the bootloader is encrypted, not just signed. Also, its 128bit encryption. Tough sht to hack.
You guys should check out this thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1511195
There was a lot of discussion about this before but unfortunately it didn't seem to go anywhere
With all the new hacks coming out, I wanted to know, has the bootloader been successfully unlocked? Is sum1 working on it?
NOpe
Umm,how come? forgive me,i really dont understand what the complication is.
xyancompgeek said:
Umm,how come? forgive me,i really dont understand what the complication is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We've all been waiting patiently for you to come along and show us how it's done !!
he he he
+1
LOL........could sum1 give me a technical reason?
xyancompgeek said:
LOL........could sum1 give me a technical reason?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could I politely suggest that you have a browse through the forum, there are many references to the "unlock bootloader" issue. have a read - very educational I found.
sure. only thing I've known is that sony has somehow locked the bootloader and nobody knows how to get into fastboot. but what do these terms mean?
xyancompgeek said:
sure. only thing I've known is that sony has somehow locked the bootloader and nobody knows how to get into fastboot. but what do these terms mean?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IF you don't know what those terms mean then why are you complaining that someone hasn't done the work that you yourself can't do????
TLR summary
- sony have locked this thing down super tight. If you want to know more, read up.
- this device has a small install base
- small number of users = even smaller number of devs to throw at a very difficult problem (compared to say samsung or even HTC or motorola devices)
hence.....
If you want the technical reasons for why the bootloader is locked, you need to really read up and understand everything about bootloaders. They are very complex, and very device-specific and therefore very difficult to unlock when a manufacturer specifically protects them. I don't think we even have a proper partition dump for the Tablet, so it will be quite some time before we see any development in that.
It's worth elaborating that there is no magical unlock() function built in to the bootloader. They are complex, they are poorly documented (outside of Sony) and they are not made to be unlocked by users. In the past, I've found Samsung's slightly easier to work with at this level, but they're still fiendishly difficult.
You only have to check out the code used in ASUS's bootloader unlocking tool they released a while ago to see how complex this can be without manufacturer support.
I am under the impression that if you unlock your boot loader you can flash a custom rom without rooting....is that true?
Correct.
ok great. I have my prime insured through my insurance company and given that asus rma's have a terrible reputatation i'm going to unlock, know of a good tutorial or guidline anywhere? the couple video's i found under the developement thread weren't to clear....
vballrkc said:
ok great. I have my prime insured through my insurance company and given that asus rma's have a terrible reputatation i'm going to unlock, know of a good tutorial or guidline anywhere? the couple video's i found under the developement thread weren't to clear....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you don't need a video or tutorial because you run the official ASUS unlock (apk) and that's it. It takes a few second.
But be aware that there is no way back! And you're loosing your guarantee!
For my personal use rooting is much more important than unlocking.
By asking the question, you lead me to suspect you may not realise the meaning of the question. You don't need to root first before unlocking and flashing a ROM, but you will be rooted by the time you finish.
Also see http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1707955
Before anyone flames me for creating this thread and then closing it, I just want to let staff know that I did indeed read the sticky threads.
All the instructions for how to root a C6806 on this site seem a bit complex with many steps and quite risky if you are not a Linux and Android phone geek who knows exactly what they are doing. It seems way too easy to make a mistake and permanently brick a phone or lose Dram keys or simply not be able to completely unroot for warranty's sake.
I used to work in the IT field over a decade ago with some training in Network Technology before I got married and I find these instructions too risky for an expensive phone that is too vital for personal and business needs to take a moderate to strong risk of damaging the phone beyond warranty. I can only imagine how someone with little to no Linux or Android experience would fare trying to follow all these steps.
I was hoping that someone could develop a program or app that could do this a lot easier. Not necessarily one click root easy as ideal as that might be but at least simplifying enough so the less than geekworthy can root this phone. Not making rooting feasible for the general public does only encourages future phone makers to keep phones locked and unrooted.
I would really like to use the 64GB SD Card for apps and I would like to use Avast Security for rooted users but there is no way I can trust myself through all the steps of flash software download, system backup, boot unlock, system version rollback, pre-flash procedures, flash, post-flash inspection and probably a few other things I missed.
Unfortunately it's a bit more complex than that.. Unless you unlock your bootloader or have root you won't be able to run the app that you want to unlock the bootloader and/or root with.
Good news is you are wrong re "easy to hardbrick" - flashing stock firmware always an option to recover the device.
At the end of the day to get the benefits of what you call "risky" you will have to take a few "risks"
Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk
As buzzy said, there really is no risk in hard bricking the zu unless you really are inept. The steps are easy once you understand them:
1. Downgrade to 532 ftf (read my sticky)
2. Root with Bin4ry's or [NUT]'s tool (see my or lordmanhattan's threads)
3. Back up TA (see lord's thread)
4. Flash latest FTF
5. Unlock BL and flash a rootable kernel
The problem with a 'tool' is you never know what they have donr or not and how to recover.
Sent from CarbonROM on my Z-Ultra
It's already very easy to root the Ultra if you're either on .681 or .757 (latest firmware). All you have to do is to flash a kernel and then SuperSU. 2 minutes.
The real issue is what we have to do BEFORE rooting. The TA backup is a pain in the ass, and if Sony would've dropped the whole DRM thing, all we'd have to do would be to unlock the bootloader and flash a kernel.
It's not possible to make a "one click" solution that includes TA backup, so there really isn't any better way of doing it today. It's very easy once you've backed up the TA partition, and you'll only ever do it once per device.
Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk
blueether said:
As buzzy said, there really is no risk in hard bricking the zu unless you really are inept. The steps are easy once you understand them:
1. Downgrade to 532 ftf (read my sticky)
2. Root with Bin4ry's or [NUT]'s tool (see my or lordmanhattan's threads)
3. Back up TA (see lord's thread)
4. Flash latest FTF
5. Unlock BL and flash a rootable kernel
The problem with a 'tool' is you never know what they have donr or not and how to recover.
Sent from CarbonROM on my Z-Ultra
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is that the order to do them in? Each step seems to be its own sticky thread.
LordManhattan said:
It's already very easy to root the Ultra if you're either on .681 or .757 (latest firmware). All you have to do is to flash a kernel and then SuperSU. 2 minutes.
The real issue is what we have to do BEFORE rooting. The TA backup is a pain in the ass, and if Sony would've dropped the whole DRM thing, all we'd have to do would be to unlock the bootloader and flash a kernel.
It's not possible to make a "one click" solution that includes TA backup, so there really isn't any better way of doing it today. It's very easy once you've backed up the TA partition, and you'll only ever do it once per device.
Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Impossible? Why? Unless I read the thread wrong awhile back, it appears that the TA backup thread had a link to a program just for TA backup. It just didn't have everything else that is relatively easy. Why can't a one click root program be built as an extension of that program?
Are the DRM keys the same or unique for every device of a specific model? My husband and I each bought a C6806 directly from Sony's Play Store the very first day they went on sale.
Do I need to flash a kernel or even unlock the bootloader if I'd like to keep the stock OS?
polargirl said:
Is that the order to do them in? Each step seems to be its own sticky thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would I post them out of order?
There is really only one sticky thread that is needed, Lordmanhattan's one. The one I wrote (for the first step) is also covered in LordManhattan's guide, just that if you read my thread you wont temporarily lose your imei no.
polargirl said:
Impossible? Why? Unless I read the thread wrong awhile back, it appears that the TA backup thread had a link to a program just for TA backup. It just didn't have everything else that is relatively easy. Why can't a one click root program be built as an extension of that program?
Are the DRM keys the same or unique for every device of a specific model? My husband and I each bought a C6806 directly from Sony's Play Store the very first day they went on sale.
Do I need to flash a kernel or even unlock the bootloader if I'd like to keep the stock OS?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it's not impossible, but remember that all the dev work is done for free, in our spare time, and more often than not to itch a scratch the "we" have.
Yes the DRM keys are unique to each device
No you dont need to unlock the bootloader if you only want root, but it will make life alot easier in the longrun as you will then be able to flash a kernel that has recovery and is simple to install root on. As our phones get more secure you will have to run a custom kernel and recovery to have root
blueether said:
Why would I post them out of order?
There is really only one sticky thread that is needed, Lordmanhattan's one. The one I wrote (for the first step) is also covered in LordManhattan's guide, just that if you read my thread you wont temporarily lose your imei no.
No it's not impossible, but remember that all the dev work is done for free, in our spare time, and more often than not to itch a scratch the "we" have.
Yes the DRM keys are unique to each device
No you dont need to unlock the bootloader if you only want root, but it will make life alot easier in the longrun as you will then be able to flash a kernel that has recovery and is simple to install root on. As our phones get more secure you will have to run a custom kernel and recovery to have root
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please link me to that Lordmaahattan thread as he probably has quite a few.
I am quite happy and grateful that there are people like you guys who do this stuff even if it is just to "scratch the itch" and say "we have". I just wish some people would take the battle against the smartphone tyrants to a higher level as all. I have no right asking you guys to take it to a higher level but who else is more able and willing to do it? The need to render locking smartphones futile is a just and noble war.
Is there an Android equivalent to ghosting in Windows that copies everything on the phones' memory right down to the DRM keys or an other mirroring method? I'd feel a lot more comfortable making a clone image than just partial backups.
How can I tell if a TA backup is completely successful before I flash? I guess the Lordmanhattan thread should have info on how to relock and unroot?
polargirl said:
Please link me to that Lordmaahattan thread as he probably has quite a few.
I am quite happy and grateful that there are people like you guys who do this stuff even if it is just to "scratch the itch" and say "we have". I just wish some people would take the battle against the smartphone tyrants to a higher level as all. I have no right asking you guys to take it to a higher level but who else is more able and willing to do it? The need to render locking smartphones futile is a just and noble war.
Is there an Android equivalent to ghosting in Windows that copies everything on the phones' memory right down to the DRM keys or an other mirroring method? I'd feel a lot more comfortable making a clone image than just partial backups.
How can I tell if a TA backup is completely successful before I flash? I guess the Lordmanhattan thread should have info on how to relock and unroot?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The definitive thread is this one http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2569904, quite complex to read, but simple when you understand it. The problem is that it caters for all, ie locked and unlocked, 4.2 to 4.4 etc
This thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2593918 is how to first downgrade and keep the imei number, not strictly needed but might stop you from panicking when it vanishes.
I quite like the way sony do it, allowing you to unlock the bootloader from their dev site, although it does mean the loss of DRM keys.
You can back up the whole phone with dd (often called disk destroyer for how dangerous it can be), but you may need root first - never done it and I would not recommend doing it.
The TA partition is the only one that is really important to back up, and going back to 'factory' is as easy as using the same app to write the backup back then flashing a FTF
blueether said:
I quite like the way sony do it, allowing you to unlock the bootloader from their dev site, although it does mean the loss of DRM keys.
You can back up the whole phone with dd (often called disk destroyer for how dangerous it can be), but you may need root first - never done it and I would not recommend doing it.
The TA partition is the only one that is really important to back up, and going back to 'factory' is as easy as using the same app to write the backup back then flashing a FTF
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't say I agree. Although Sony has been generous with the unlocking process, I find myself wondering why it was necessary to lock it in the first place. Polargirl isn't off mark, I spent half a day in frustration (and losing my DRM keys) before I managed to unlock and root. Once I did of course it was sweet, but the path there was a bit perplexing (a myriad of threads here) and quite scary (what if I brick it because I misread one of the 9 different threads?).
That being said, I came from Note II which was a cakewalk - I might be a bit spoiled :cyclops:
Edit: Not to mention, my very first post here was because a rooting thread was obsolete so I, on LordManhattan's advice got in touch with the mods to have said thread un-stickied. This forum is in fact a bit of a mess.
polargirl said:
Is that the order to do them in? Each step seems to be its own sticky thread.
Impossible? Why? Unless I read the thread wrong awhile back, it appears that the TA backup thread had a link to a program just for TA backup. It just didn't have everything else that is relatively easy. Why can't a one click root program be built as an extension of that program?
Are the DRM keys the same or unique for every device of a specific model? My husband and I each bought a C6806 directly from Sony's Play Store the very first day they went on sale.
Do I need to flash a kernel or even unlock the bootloader if I'd like to keep the stock OS?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well okay then. Make a one-click solution that downgrades your device to a firmware that has the exploit that Bin4ry's root tool can root, then get a tool to backup the TA partition, while automatically granting it root access, and then unlock the bootloader without you having to enter your IMEI and unlock key, oh... and then update to the latest firmware and also automatically flash Jackie's kernel, boot into recovery, automatically flash SuperSU and reboot.
Not only would it potentially take several hours for the tool to finish, but it will never ever happen. Ever.
Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk
Chima2 said:
I can't say I agree. Although Sony has been generous with the unlocking process, I find myself wondering why it was necessary to lock it in the first place. Polargirl isn't off mark, I spent half a day in frustration (and losing my DRM keys) before I managed to unlock and root. Once I did of course it was sweet, but the path there was a bit perplexing (a myriad of threads here) and quite scary (what if I brick it because I misread one of the 9 different threads?).
That being said, I came from Note II which was a cakewalk - I might be a bit spoiled :cyclops:
Edit: Not to mention, my very first post here was because a rooting thread was obsolete so I, on LordManhattan's advice got in touch with the mods to have said thread un-stickied. This forum is in fact a bit of a mess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for posting that you agree with me and for also seeing the problem: The instructions are indeed complex and chaotically spread out over nine different threads making it easy to miss a step.
LordManhattan said:
Well okay then. Make a one-click solution that downgrades your device to a firmware that has the exploit that Bin4ry's root tool can root, then get a tool to backup the TA partition, while automatically granting it root access, and then unlock the bootloader without you having to enter your IMEI and unlock key, oh... and then update to the latest firmware and also automatically flash Jackie's kernel, boot into recovery, automatically flash SuperSU and reboot.
Not only would it potentially take several hours for the tool to finish, but it will never ever happen. Ever.
Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't have to be all (one click root) or nothing. Even partial simplification would help. Anything better than the several different steps over nine different threads that Chima2 was referring to would help. 3 or even 4 steps in one thread is better than the "solution" currently available.
polargirl said:
Thank you for posting that you agree with me and for also seeing the problem: The instructions are indeed complex and chaotically spread out over nine different threads making it easy to miss a step.
It doesn't have to be all (one click root) or nothing. Even partial simplification would help. Anything better than the several different steps over nine different threads that Chima2 was referring to would help. 3 or even 4 steps in one thread is better than the "solution" currently available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Buy a ZTE if you want hard
Why should I or Lordmanhattan (or anyone) rewrite what has already been written. I, at least, have written the steps out more times than I care to remember. The process is not that hard, and the steps are well documented in well written english
blueether said:
Buy a ZTE if you want hard
Why should I or Lordmanhattan (or anyone) rewrite what has already been written. I, at least, have written the steps out more times than I care to remember. The process is not that hard, and the steps are well documented in well written english
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why? Because they aren't well written. They appear scattered and chaotic to everyone who isn't familiar with this site. Chima2 and I were just trying to give feedback is all. If more people just browsing for rooting solutions were to signup and post, they would probably agree as well. They just aren't here to give you even more feedback.
polargirl said:
Why? Because they aren't well written. They appear scattered and chaotic to everyone who isn't familiar with this site. Chima2 and I were just trying to give feedback is all. If more people just browsing for rooting solutions were to signup and post, they would probably agree as well. They just aren't here to give you even more feedback.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It took me about a week of reading in my spare time to get my bearings and feel confident that I could start to modify my phone. That is a small amount of effort to put forth for a device that I plan to have for at least the next year. Yes it was a little confusing but I managed and am certainly not gifted when it comes to intelligence. I feel that any average person that sets their mind to it can succeed, and any specific questions will generally be answered if possible.
adfurgerson said:
It took me about a week of reading in my spare time to get my bearings and feel confident that I could start to modify my phone. That is a small amount of effort to put forth for a device that I plan to have for at least the next year. Yes it was a little confusing but I managed and am certainly not gifted when it comes to intelligence. I feel that any average person that sets their mind to it can succeed, and any specific questions will generally be answered if possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Enough said! It might be worth it to you but probably not to most people.
polargirl said:
Enough said! It might be worth it to you but probably not to most people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2031989&postcount=45
polargirl said:
Enough said! It might be worth it to you but probably not to most people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If a week of reading is to much for some then that is good, they shouldn't root their phones.
When people have really 'simple' ways of doing things they tend to skip steps and blame people for it. When something seems hard and daunting they read carefully and completely before starting, then read step by step as they go.
Could the 9 stickies be updated to 1 thread with all information? Why yes they could, and if it is important to you that it be done the best solution would be to write the new thread yourself. It would be a great way to give back to the community. If you notice something you find wrong, and its in your power to fix it, then do so.
Sent from my C6806_GPe using Tapatalk
_Dennis_ said:
If a week of reading is to much for some then that is good, they shouldn't root their phones.
When people have really 'simple' ways of doing things they tend to skip steps and blame people for it. When something seems hard and daunting they read carefully and completely before starting, then read step by step as they go.
Could the 9 stickies be updated to 1 thread with all information? Why yes they could, and if it is important to you that it be done the best solution would be to write the new thread yourself. It would be a great way to give back to the community. If you notice something you find wrong, and its in your power to fix it, then do so.
Sent from my C6806_GPe using Tapatalk
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That is quite the cynical statement you posted and apparently contrary to even the spirit of this site let alone development and hacking in general. A better good for society is rending the need to root futile should be the goal and easily within reach of this site's members.
Another newbie, zxc1251, has indeed did just that and I have been helping that member with instruction simplification.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2769782
The only problem with that is newbies tend to be quite limited in their tech knowledge thus limited in their usefulness when it comes to simplifying instructions for the tech ignorant and semi-ignorant public but I guess some relatively tech ignorant people need to start this if a revolution against unrooted, jailed or otherwise restricted access phones is to happen.
I am trying my best with the knowledge and tools that I have to get this going.
polargirl said:
That is quite the cynical statement you posted and apparently contrary to even the spirit of this site let alone development and hacking in general. A better good for society is rending the need to root futile should be the goal and easily within reach of this site's members.
Another newbie, zxc1251, has indeed did just that and I have been helping that member with instruction simplification.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2769782
The only problem with that is newbies tend to be quite limited in their tech knowledge thus limited in their usefulness when it comes to simplifying instructions for the tech ignorant and semi-ignorant public but I guess some relatively tech ignorant people need to start this if a revolution against unrooted, jailed or otherwise restricted access phones is to happen.
I am trying my best with the knowledge and tools that I have to get this going.
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The reason I had the 'do it yourself' attitude is all the information to make a new thread is there, just needed presentation, something tech geeks aren't well known for.
There should always be a need to root. Average use case for a phone, having security is important since you store a lot of sensitive information. If phones came rooted or came so rooting was extremely easy imagine how many people would loose their bank account info or their contact info to the not so nice side of the Internet.
Edit:
Let me use this analogy. If you wanted to change the transmission in you car would you
A) search the internet for 15 minutes and the open your hood and start disconnecting things or
B) Spend at least a few hours looking at the specifics for your car (if you've change a few transmissions before) or as long as it takes for you to feel comfortable you won't destroy your car?
If you wanted Linux on your laptop would to research the drivers, installation procedures, and distros first or just download the first one and hope you know how to install it?
All I'm saying in researching is not a bad thing, if more people did it, less would brick their phones.
Sent from my C6806_GPe using Tapatalk
_Dennis_ said:
The reason I had the 'do it yourself' attitude is all the information to make a new thread is there, just needed presentation, something tech geeks aren't well known for.
There should always be a need to root. Average use case for a phone, having security is important since you store a lot of sensitive information. If phones came rooted or came so rooting was extremely easy imagine how many people would loose their bank account info or their contact info to the not so nice side of the Internet.
Edit:
Let me use this analogy. If you wanted to change the transmission in you car would you
A) search the internet for 15 minutes and the open your hood and start disconnecting things or
B) Spend at least a few hours looking at the specifics for your car (if you've change a few transmissions before) or as long as it takes for you to feel comfortable you won't destroy your car?
If you wanted Linux on your laptop would to research the drivers, installation procedures, and distros first or just download the first one and hope you know how to install it?
All I'm saying in researching is not a bad thing, if more people did it, less would brick their phones.
Sent from my C6806_GPe using Tapatalk
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PCs that ship with Windows serve the tech ignorant public just fine without restricting access for a common user. Developers is a whole different story when it comes to Windows but that is going off-topic.
I realize most geeks aren't comfortable with marketing and presentation issues with people like Erica Griffen (aka: Angel of Tech) being a huge exception. I don't have anywhere near her level of tech knowledge or even most members on this site but I am willing to help or even take over if needed. I just can't be of much help shortening process or making it more comfortable for the public but at least I haven't been totally useless.
Any help in shortening process or partially automating things wherever and whenever geeks can feel comfortable enough is not only appreciated by me but will be by the public as well.