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This question has flooded my mind almost as much as Android has flooded the market...
Does anyone else think that Android has gone out of control? I mean there are literally dozens of devices announced / released every week, updates are a mess, developing is tricky due to all the different versions of the OS, screen resolution, cpu, gpu etc. The custom overlays is so common that the AOSP phones are almost non existant.
Manufacturers release a new phone each week since its an easy buck because its free and they know that with Android it cant keep a decent life span since its forgotten pretty much the day its released since all the new phone arriving or due to arrive, so asking for good support is a bit much nowadays. It seems like Android is becoming the new "featurephone OS" since almost every phone released runs it, so imo it loses its Premium feel since i can run most of the same apps in a crappy free budget device than a high end monster save some games and speed...
I have had dozens of android devices, from the HTC Touch port, to the EVO 3D, and frankly its hard to get exited for an android device nowadays since theres always something bigger and better almost immediatly instead of living out its life span before it gets eclipsed by something else. Thats why i like the iOS and WP7 approach since they release it in batches (cept apple because its 1) in a certain time frame, so you know you dont have to worry about being left behind or being behind the curve for a good while (i you care about that stuff like me) OS updates are a sure thing, app compatibility is all there and it just feels more integrated and organized
Android feels like mess actually, i have an android and really like the OS but honestly, its a touch friendly version of Windows Mobile in my eyes. It has all the features you would wanr, but performance is inconsistant, user experience is a mess, updates are hit and miss, and development is a headache
Sorry to rant so much, i really like Android actually, but got to the point that flooded the market with such a thing has ruined a good thing imo
Any imput?
s3nT Fr0m mY pYrAmId fLaVoReD gLaCi3r
*Fixed a few things
Well, I believe that's what android is about. Its like windows, many different computers run different versions of windows. I understand the "premium feel" aspect, but there's no alternative to Linux on phones besides android.
on the other hand, no one wants to be as confined as iphone. there is nothing unique between one iphone and another. they are both iphones whereas android has variety
It'll really be interesting to see what the future holds. Android could replace Windows and MacOS in a lot of ways.
Good post OP. I feel, as you do, that the fragmentation of the Android platform is a complete mess. It would have been nice if Google had more control over what happened to the OS on a manufacturer level. I'd have liked, at the very least, to have seen a minimum hardware requirement, an outright ban on carrier bloat and manufacturer skins too. I'm a purist though and some people buy HTC, for example, because they want 'Sense'. Personally i believe these skins should have been an optional component, perhaps available as a Market download.
Updates to the OS should have been arranged in a more consistent and controlled manner too, but with the diversity of hardware it has become a crap-shoot. Manufacturers are churning out phone after phone and most are horribly derivative. Of course, it's all about the $$.
I'm a fan of what Microsoft are doing with the WP7 platform and can only dream about a similar scenario with Android!
I think its all good.Its all about freedom.The freedom to choose you firmware,kernal,ROM or what ever.Others like iOS are to confined.Its great.
It is just because android is "opened". All manufacturers can produce and sell a phone running android. Like the computers, for example, you can't say to HP that "Why did you guys releases computers so fast? ASUS just released one yesterday!"
Also about what you think android is complicated is because of it's customizability (ability to be customized). When it can be very personalized, it gets a lot of settings. When it have a lot of settings, things get complicated. This is also why every android device is unique
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
I've always been a PC guy and have used Macs in the past. I'm just used to Windows as opposed to an iOS. The fact that Android is open sourced, it allows for any user to customize it however they want.
I own an EVO 3D, and own an iPod Touch. There's endless possibilities on what I can do on the 3D versus what I can do on the iPod. I also know that the iPod can be jailbroken as well.
I do understand your argument as there are many different phones that come out each week/month. It gets overwhelming as to which device is better and what not, but it all comes down to what the end user wants for a device that fits their needs. A typical user just wants to be able to call, text, and get online. These typical users would like to see different styles, colors, sizes that fit their lifestyle.
Apple has a standardized iPhone/iPod and it receives an update once in a while. Granted, you can pick out a cover for it in different colors and styles, but it has the same UI look.
But I, on the other hand, like to tinker and like to customize the device of my choice.
Based on the fact that we're all members here on this forum by choice and are happily reading and writing...I'd say that there's no such thing as too much.
Although I'll be honest, I was dying to just say about this much "...................." (there I said it)
i agree that android is all over the place with late updates ect however i love the fact that its available in all flavors not just one flavor like you know who.
Android is just the hip thing. It's quickly becoming to mobile-devices what MS-DOS/Windows was to home computers. Only, the licensing is different
That doesn't mean there's too much of it though. Android is still linux at its core, and part of that is putting up with the disorganized community development.
THIS IS JUST MY OPINION:
I don't know why, but it seems to me that people seem to think that they are entitled to get the newest operating systems.
I am not talking about incremental items like 2.3.3 to 2.3.4, 3.1 to 3.2 but major upgrades... Froyo to Gingerbread, Gingerbread to Honeycomb, etc.
If I want to upgrade Windows XP to Windows 7, it will cost me money, and my hardware might not be able to run it. If a Mac user wants to upgrade to Snowleopard, it cost them, too.
I think if we had to pay $49 for a new operating system, we wouldn't be so hard HTC or other manufactures that are slow to release an operating system.
They won't charge because they can't adhere to any established schedule.
LG Optimus 3D (T-Mobile/P920)
Theoretically that could work and provide an incentive to the vendors. They could lower their initial price to buy a device (since the support cost are baked in), but software is still hard and i think customer acceptance of those upgrade fees would be the problem. As long as the industry leader (Apple) gives free OS updates it would be a hard sell to charge for Android updates. The bigger problem for most handset and tablet makers is that they are in a constant churn cycle trying to bring the next shiny new paperweight to market ahead of the competition. Apple has a fanatical user base and is somewhat insulated from competition. If you look at their hardware against say Samsung, Apple is a generation behind in radio and processor technology.
And each of these new churns of the newest hardware causes a hardware maker to have to redo all the device specific software (there's a lot of it) to run Android.
sbrownla said:
They won't charge because they can't adhere to any established schedule.
LG Optimus 3D (T-Mobile/P920)
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Who says they have to have a schedule? MS doesn't have a schedule. Also, didn't MS charge for one of the Windows Mobile updates? Pretty sure I'm remembering that correctly.
Well and the reason a lot of us even use Android is that it's perceived (rightly or wrongly) as being more open and inclusive. Part of that openness has been the eventual Open Source release of each version of the operating system.
I'd pay extra for hardware that ran a 100% Open Source version of Android though, with some freeer alternative to Market, etc.
TidBit said:
THIS IS JUST MY OPINION:
I don't know why, but it seems to me that people seem entitled to get the newest operating systems.
I am not talking about incremental items like 2.3.3 to 2.3.4, 3.1 to 3.2 but major upgrades... Froyo to Gingerbread, Gingerbread to Honeycomb, etc.
If I want to upgrade Windows XP to Windows 7, it will cost me money, and my hardware might not be able to run it. If a Mac user wants to upgrade to Snowleopard, it cost them, too.
I think if we had to pay $49 for a new operating system, we wouldn't be so hard HTC or other manufactures that are slow to release an operating system.
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In the Windows world things are a bit different. You pay Microsoft only for the OS. The biggest issue to get a new Windows version running on an old pc is drivers. If we translate the Windows world to Android we would pay Google for the OS (and upgrades) and HTC (for example) for the hardware (and drivers). In this world, when a new Android version is released, I can asure you that users will start to chase HTC to write new drivers compatible with the new Android version. And they want it for free.
It would be better to standarize all internal components and connections in devices. And android should contain some generic drivers to at least boot the device and use basic functions (screen, sd card, touch).
I wouldn't mind paying something extra for OS upgrades, but I don't like the idea of paying HTC for an OS upgrade while most of the work was done by Google.
Btw, by buying an HTC Android device, you also donate some bucks to the nice guys @ Microsoft.
Sent from my HTC Flyer P510e using xda premium
As a consumer, unless you enter a contract with a vendor, you are entitled to nothing. However the market forces suppliers to behave in a certain fashion in order to maintain a place in the market. How well a company balances service, vs. cost vs. profit will in the long run determine how well they do in comparison to their competitors. Therefore consumers are in effect entitled to expect some level of support from vendors when they purchase a product.
The problem is , that level of support is undefined, so a vendor has to be careful how they set expectations and consumers have to be realistic in their expectations. It's a hard balance to achieve.
I would love to see the whole concept of mobile devices move to a more PC oriented ecosystem.
Think about it.. Being able to pick and choose which hardware and which OS, and only having to deal with the carrier for service (ala cable providers) would certainly change the way things work. In my opinion for the better.
No more carrier locked phones, no more manufacturer locked OS's. I could go pick up my HTC Phone1 or Samsung Phone9, load up my Android XP and punch in my Verizon credentials and im off.
Crazy concept, i like it. Downsides i could see being increased price in phones. But on the same token, just the fact they are carrier free would drive down the price due to competition.
Would drive down cellular prices too since the only thing they would be competing with would be service area, price and data caps. Similiar to now, but without the contracts tying you in to a phone for 2 years.
Also, side-rant. 2 years for a mobile contract is absurd right now. Mobile tech is exploding, and with major hw improvements within a years time are rolling out, its just not fair.
My buddy just upgraded from his HTC Hero last month. I couldnt imagine still using that relic after having upgraded to an Epic, then an iphone4. Going back to the Hero would be torture.
TidBit said:
THIS IS JUST MY OPINION:
I don't know why, but it seems to me that people seem to think that they are entitled to get the newest operating systems.
I am not talking about incremental items like 2.3.3 to 2.3.4, 3.1 to 3.2 but major upgrades... Froyo to Gingerbread, Gingerbread to Honeycomb, etc.
If I want to upgrade Windows XP to Windows 7, it will cost me money, and my hardware might not be able to run it. If a Mac user wants to upgrade to Snowleopard, it cost them, too.
I think if we had to pay $49 for a new operating system, we wouldn't be so hard HTC or other manufactures that are slow to release an operating system.
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Click to collapse
It's funny that you mention this because I remember Apple charging like $5 to upgrade older ipod touches to the newer OS and people were throwing a fit. They eventually gave the software upgrade away for free. I think everyone feels entitled to the honeycomb upgrade since HTC promised that it was going to be available soon. Nobody wants to buy a new tablet every year. Just look at Apple as an example. They could have easily only made IOS 5 only available for the Ipad 2 and alienated the millions of Ipad 1 owners out there. Instead, they offered the upgrade for both devices so people with the older model can still enjoy some of the new features. I think what everyone here is afraid of is that HTC is going to announce a HTC Flyer 2 in a couple months with a dual core processor and honeycomb/ice cream sandwich.
thetruth1983 said:
It's funny that you mention this because I remember Apple charging like $5 to upgrade older ipod touches to the newer OS and people were throwing a fit. They eventually gave the software upgrade away for free. I think everyone feels entitled to the honeycomb upgrade since HTC promised that it was going to be available soon. Nobody wants to buy a new tablet every year. Just look at Apple as an example. They could have easily only made IOS 5 only available for the Ipad 2 and alienated the millions of Ipad 1 owners out there. Instead, they offered the upgrade for both devices so people with the older model can still enjoy some of the new features. I think what everyone here is afraid of is that HTC is going to announce a HTC Flyer 2 in a couple months with a dual core processor and honeycomb/ice cream sandwich.
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I guess you are right. I did buy my HTC Flyer when the price dropped to $299 and I really love it. It is much better than my old Viewsonic G Tablet. I guess if I paid the $499, I would feel a little different.
Google tried the complete unlocked , open source concept essentially with their first Nexus phone, unfortunately it was a flop. The percentage of people that want to tinker with a phone (or tablet) vs. those that just want it to work is really small, otherwise, Apple wouldn't be so successful. I know most if us feel differently because we are passionate about the tech. and customizing.
And one more note. I worked for General Electric doing commercial software development for many years.I understand the business and legal aspect. Consumers are not "entitled" to anything, but..
I also understand that consumers are entitled to feel they are being treated fairly or you will be out of business (unless you have a monopoly , which unfortunately the cell industry behaves like in a lot of instances).
I do have a problem with false or deceptive advertising which this industry engages in fairly routinely.For example HTC announcing that the Flyer would get the honeycomb update and not delivering is deceptive. Verizon's TV ads about speed of network "rule the airways" while not talking about how they throttle your speeds is deceptive. It's not illegal, but it is deceptive and I do think consumers are entitled to the truth at some point.
DigitalMD said:
As a consumer, unless you enter a contract with a vendor, you are entitled to nothing. However the market forces suppliers to behave in a certain fashion in order to maintain a place in the market. How well a company balances service, vs. cost vs. profit will in the long run determine how well they do in comparison to their competitors. Therefore consumers are in effect entitled to expect some level of support from vendors when they purchase a product.
The problem is , that level of support is undefined, so a vendor has to be careful how they set expectations and consumers have to be realistic in their expectations. It's a hard balance to achieve.
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I think there's an implied agreement that any major defects will be fixed unless you state otherwise. Take for example the HTC logging security issue.
---------- Post added at 03:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:35 PM ----------
DigitalMD said:
Google tried the complete unlocked , open source concept essentially with their first Nexus phone, unfortunately it was a flop. The percentage of people that want to tinker with a phone (or tablet) vs. those that just want it to work is really small, otherwise, Apple wouldn't be so successful. I know most if us feel differently because we are passionate about the tech. and customizing.
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FWIW, consumers *do* care about crapware. Friends know I'm an Android developer and the first thing they always ask, without a doubt, is how to remove ESPN or Avatar or other crap from their phones. Especially when people move over from the iPhone world, they are inundated by crapware.
I think the biggest selling point of the Nexus phones SHOULD be that they are mostly crapware-free, although I consider Twitter and Facebook superfluous.
ICS will let you disable system apps, which is going to be a huge bonus for users as long as the carriers don't find a way of blocking that feature.
If you believe that whole "implied agreement" thing, go check out what Sprint customers are dealing with now that Sprint yanked their unlimited data plan out from under them.
Eliminating as you call it ,Crapwear is not going to happen in Android period. You seem to have forgotten, Google is a advertising company. That's where they make the overwhelming majority of their income, about $12.5 billion last quarter. Android is a platform for leveraging that market.
The Nexus One phones were actually targeted toward developers and as such were pretty clean and open. The new Nexus Galaxy is a consumer phone.
Google doesn't make a dime from ESPN and Avatar pre-installs. The money they make on Admob is mostly from apps that users opt to download. Maps, which has some sponsored results, isn't crapware by most people's standards.
If Google had no interest in helping people out with clean phones, they wouldn't have put the ICS feature in to disable system apps.
As for implied agreement, see that those customers are angry. It's not like you're going to sue Sprint (although class actions do happen), but if you advertise one thing and do another, people get mad.
well ...
barry99705 said:
Who says they have to have a schedule? MS doesn't have a schedule. Also, didn't MS charge for one of the Windows Mobile updates? Pretty sure I'm remembering that correctly.
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MS most certainly does have a schedule for updating all of their devices to Mango, by the way. And, they are updating every single one built by every single manufacturer. The schedule is available online. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/features/update-schedules.aspx MS didn't charge end users for updates and never has, but the expectation is that all phones built around the same time period will have similar capabilities with regard to updating. With Android it's, "build first, slap the OS on later and see what works." In other words, it's not an OS-based market, it's a device-based market (I can't stand that word "ecosystem" unless it's used to describe biological phenomena, sorry).
What it boils down to is consumer expectation, as brought up by other commenters.
If Google were to charge for updates, they'd have a greater obligation to fulfill the promises made: update schedules, device lifespan, OS compatibility, etc. That would put more pressure on manufacturers to adhere to Google's whims, instead of allowing manufacturers to do whatever they want in terms of price/OS--that was the freedom and flexibility that the Open Handset Alliance was meant to offer manufacturers.
Android is too unwieldy and manufacturers (and Google) are making more money just throwing things out there and hoping that they stick than they would if they solidify anything related to the software on devices--which is what they would have to do if they began to charge for the OS.
They also run the risk of exposure to even more complicated licensing issues. You thought the Oracle debacle is bad, if Google were charging end users directly it would have been far worse for them because of the money they would have made on IP that came from sources that: (1) didn't put it out there to be 'profitable' to any one particular entity, (2) didn't put it out there in the first place (allegedly), etc.
Read this for a good perspective of where Google and the Android update schedules actually sit at the moment. Google tired to get a group of hardware makers to agree to timely updates and virtually nothing came from it. Google has no control.
http://www.tested.com/news/what-googles-android-update-deal-means-for-fragmentation/2310/
Sad but true.
I wish there were a Nexus with a physical keyboard.
I remain optimistic for the Flyer. I don't expect much from HTC, but I believe one of our independent developers will pick the ICS ball up and run with it.
HTC has shown a previous pattern of leaving their customers behind. I hope it is changing, but I don't count on it.
Hey Guys, just came across this article and thought it was a good read. Do you think Android will partner with Asus to make their own brand of tablets...will it be better for us as Android buyers in the future if Android had more control by being the hardware as well as software maker. or do you feel like this is turning them into Apple-lite
http://www.androidauthority.com/will-google-abandon-android-71483/
Seems like Android Authority is a bit desperate for clicks. That is all I got from it.
detta123 said:
Seems like Android Authority is a bit desperate for clicks. That is all I got from it.
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yeah basically..lol.
they taking the whole Asus Manufacturing Google Nexus tablet and spinning it into some crazy apocalyptic Android dying story. Android will be fine. Android growth has really actually just begun. we haven't seen nothing yet. Google needs a nexus tablet to instill confidence and optimism in Androids future. It can almost be guareenteed to attract more developers to android ecosystem. If android was dying, I'd seriously doubt they'd be making a tablet with Asus, restructured Google Play Store, and Making Google store purchases possible to be made online by anyone. All these recent moves Google has made is pointing to something big coming up.
Android for LIFE!
All of my current and future devices will continue to be android.
It is just way too much fun, IOS sucks.
If android goes away, I will go back to laptops.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk
I dont even want to read that article Android brings profit and is a huge thing worldwide. Why would you abandon something like this? Of course its not Google's biggest income generator but it has so much potential and it serves as competition to Apple.
Google deciding to do some hardware manufacturing? I really like that. They probably learn from it and be able to improve the software/hardware.
There is one thing though they could do to android imho. I like some of the 3rd party GUI's that come with android devices. For example HTC Sense. They add alot of nice widgets and great looking uniform base apps.
BUT. At the price of getting important updates like ICS half a year later? No... No.
For me there are 2 ways those companies could handle the situation. Make custom UI's optional. Let people use vanilla Android if they want fast upgrades and let them switch to custom UI's once their done. Or just open all the bootloaders and release all kernel source and stuff to XDA so people can make their own roms and updates (which usually are better anyway...).
Apart from that Android is just totally great.
clouds5 said:
For me there are 2 ways those companies could handle the situation. Make custom UI's optional. Let people use vanilla Android if they want fast upgrades and let them switch to custom UI's once their done. Or just open all the bootloaders and release all kernel source and stuff to XDA so people can make their own roms and updates (which usually are better anyway...).
Apart from that Android is just totally great.
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Actually Google is already consdidering this. read several articles on it. it's a great idea bit one catch, Phone carriers would hate it. those companies add those GUI to devices to differentiate themselves from other similar devices. I'd rather have vanilla android experience and not have bloat ui on top of it. A GUI on top of vanilla android will never be faster out the box than a plain vanilla experience. one suggestion was to make the various companies GUI removable if the user chooses. they could use that companies GUI or go vanilla route or use one of the many launchers available on android. Usually a company GUI will be more integrated and stable than one from marketplace.
Yeah i've read about that too. i dont think custom UIs need to go away. Sometimes they're great. And with tegra3 phones coming out i guess the performance wont be such an issue anymore.
But i'd love to see some change in that situation. I think updates shouldnt be delayed more than 1 month. Not like half a year.
The article is the usual blog filler; title is admittedly clickbait. Then again, most news & blog sites have SEO'ed titles to varying degree. Yellow journalism used to be on the fringe. Now, it's the way to get clicks. That's the cost of "free" content.
Idle gossip aside, Google's strategy for tablet adoption has not worked. It will need to do something, and soon. We should know by Google I/O in June, if not earlier.
IMO, the rumors presently circulating--direct-sale of cheapo tablet & online store--aren't enough. The problems are more fundamental, and are myriad. To me, what's discouraging aren't the obstacles, but that I haven't seen any signal from Google leadership that they recognize the scope of the obstacles.
At any rate, Android won't suffer the fate of WebOS. It's entrenched on phones, and its open-source distribution will allow it to live on as a "hobbyist" OS, if nothing else.
Things move pretty fast in this mobile market, so we won't have long to wait, one way or the other.
Trolling done wrong.
A terrible excuse for either op-ed or journalism. sigh.
Seems this kid who wrote the article didn't get the point of android....
It amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products... it generates Google accounts which can be used for the almost infinite range of Google products. It helps to spread G+ and not to mention Google ad-words..
There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand... When you use it the normal way you pretty soon notice that Android is a Google product... you are asked to create a Google account, you have a ton of Google services pre-installed etc. .
Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort. Just because it spreads Google stuff. The power you have when 50% of the smart-phones world wide run with your is is enormous... Google does not have to worry too much about branding as long as the providers don't remove the Google-Products from it...
I see it like a commenter in the article, Google Tablet to fight the Kindle Fire... because it breaks the Google-branding... not so funny for Google...
>[Android] amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products...There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand...Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort.
These are all true. But IMO it misses the forest for the trees, the forest in this case being the next computing form factor, ie the tablet being a successor rather than adjunct of laptops. That should be the goal, not just an extension to sell more wares.
To be the next "computer," the OS has to do more, akin to the range of functions on desktop OS'es. Android, like iOS, lacks basic underpinnings--things like built-in networking, printing, support for peripheral devices, apps interoperability, etc etc.
The shortcoming doesn't affect Apple, because iOS has achieved critical mass on phones and tablets. Its success engenders 3rd-party support to address any deficit faced.
The other aspect not oft mentioned is that a bona fide OS needs support. One takeaway from a quick scan through these and other (official) Android forums is that OS support is grossly inadequate. As much complaints as there are in this forum, Asus is actually one of the better vendors for support. Users of Acer, Toshiba, and others, have given up on support. And these are enthusiasts. Think of how worse it would be for normal users.
The writing is on the wall: HW vendors don't have the expertise to support the OS. Google needs to do it. But with its current distribution philosophy, ie making AOSP code public and let HW vendors do what they will, Google can't do that. For it to support its OS, Google will need to follow the Microsoft path.
Getting its hands dirty with its own hardware may be a start, assuming Google better supports its product. But customer support has never been in Google's DNA, so I have my doubt that things would improve soon.
Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
>Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Because Asus can make cheap tablets, eg the rumored $199 tab, and Moto can't. Secondly, because Google still needs to maintain some degree of impartiality. With declining vendor support (on tablets), it can ill afford to piss off the few remaining.
e.mote said:
>Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Because Asus can make cheap tablets, eg the rumored $199 tab, and Moto can't. Secondly, because Google still needs to maintain some degree of impartiality. With declining vendor support (on tablets), it can ill afford to piss off the few remaining.
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Agreed, the Motorola Xoom, great as it was(I owned one), was simply overpriced.
I do believe that in order to be widely accepted as being better than Apple, Google needs to seriously focus on getting better developer support. You can release the best tablet in the world, but if you do not have developer support, people will continue to flock to IOS. Lower the price of tablets while maintaining good quality standards, and gain developer support=win for Android
e.mote said:
>[Android] amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products...There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand...Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort.
These are all true. But IMO it misses the forest for the trees, the forest in this case being the next computing form factor, ie the tablet being a successor rather than adjunct of laptops. That should be the goal, not just an extension to sell more wares.
To be the next "computer," the OS has to do more, akin to the range of functions on desktop OS'es. Android, like iOS, lacks basic underpinnings--things like built-in networking, printing, support for peripheral devices, apps interoperability, etc etc.
The shortcoming doesn't affect Apple, because iOS has achieved critical mass on phones and tablets. Its success engenders 3rd-party support to address any deficit faced.
The other aspect not oft mentioned is that a bona fide OS needs support. One takeaway from a quick scan through these and other (official) Android forums is that OS support is grossly inadequate. As much complaints as there are in this forum, Asus is actually one of the better vendors for support. Users of Acer, Toshiba, and others, have given up on support. And these are enthusiasts. Think of how worse it would be for normal users.
The writing is on the wall: HW vendors don't have the expertise to support the OS. Google needs to do it. But with its current distribution philosophy, ie making AOSP code public and let HW vendors do what they will, Google can't do that. For it to support its OS, Google will need to follow the Microsoft path.
Getting its hands dirty with its own hardware may be a start, assuming Google better supports its product. But customer support has never been in Google's DNA, so I have my doubt that things would improve soon.
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You make some interesting points, but I disagree that iOS is anywhere near being accepted as a PC replacement. In many important ways, Android is much farther along in this respect--access to the file system alone is one area. And, I think the idea that tablets will replace PCs is way overblown--having tried to use mine (even with the keyboard dock) as a replacement for my Windows notebook, I can testify that although some things are more convenient with tablets (like ebook reading, casual surfing, etc.), NOTHING is as efficient as with a "real" PC.
I could never do my job on any existing tablet, whether it's iOS or Android. I work with complex documents, use Photoshop for more than changing color tones, do some light video editing, etc. None of those are efficient (or even possible) on a tablet. Even the simple things like browsing, Twitter, etc., etc., are more efficient on a notebook or desktop. Again, a tablet is convenient--lightweight, long battery life, etc.--so it has its place alongside a real PC. But thinking it can replace a PC for most people is, I think, entirely unrealistic at this point.
Maybe that'll change in a few years, although I doubt even that. Seriously, who can imagine working EXCLUSIVELY on a 10" screen? And if a tablet becomes something that you plug into external monitors and keyboards and such, well then, ASUS is already mostly there with the Transformer series. And at that point what we'll have is just a more portable PC with external accessories. Once a tablet becomes complex enough in terms of network support, printing, peripheral devices like scanners, etc., then is it really a "tablet" any longer?
..........
demandarin said:
Actually Google is already consdidering this. read several articles on it. it's a great idea bit one catch, Phone carriers would hate it. those companies add those GUI to devices to differentiate themselves from other similar devices. I'd rather have vanilla android experience and not have bloat ui on top of it. A GUI on top of vanilla android will never be faster out the box than a plain vanilla experience. one suggestion was to make the various companies GUI removable if the user chooses. they could use that companies GUI or go vanilla route or use one of the many launchers available on android. Usually a company GUI will be more integrated and stable than one from marketplace.
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I was hearing at one point that Google was looking to simplify the custom GUI creation (just a custom GUI xml that the manufacturer can push that the vanilla OS will honor) so that even if there are large changes underneath by Google, there is no change needed by the manufacturer prior to release (assuming the manufacturer is only making GUI changes and not anything deeper).
sparkym3 said:
I was hearing at one point that Google was looking to simplify the custom GUI creation (just a custom GUI xml that the manufacturer can push that the vanilla OS will honor) so that even if there are large changes underneath by Google, there is no change needed by the manufacturer prior to release (assuming the manufacturer is only making GUI changes and not anything deeper).
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that was what it was involving. thanks for pointing out those details.
Link doesn't work anymore!
Why is it more apps are being developed for iOS and not android?? I personally think this sucks considering phones with android are dominating the smartphone market e.g android currently runs on Samsung phones, HTC phones, LG phones, Motorola phones, ZTE phones, Huawei phones as well as tablets such as Acer, Nexus 7, Galaxy Tab, HP Touchpad etc. I just get the feeling android is being left out. IOS runs on the iPhone and iPad and that's it....doesn't make sense to me.
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Agreed. Fortunately I have all the apps that I need
Its because if you make a app on iOS it only has to really work on 2 or 3 devices which makes testing and making bug free much easier.
With android there are so many devices it can be hard to debug across all device and screen sizes etc etc.
For 'simpler' apps its not a issue but with bigger more complexed apps it can be a bigger issue and thus far more work for the dev
Apparently over 40% of IOS Apps have never even been downloaded once so I think the word Shovelware certainly applies.
Its still the largest single device out there, one phone and one tablet. I imagine it makes dev work easier, sort of like building a complex website that only has to work in one browser. Plus the way the media talks about the iPhone all the time, many probably think it has a huge majority of the market share.
spunker88 said:
Plus the way the media talks about the iPhone all the time, many probably think it has a huge majority of the market share.
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Yeah, that's right. In fact, I never seen an Google commercial on TV, and many people don't know about Android. However, if you ask them "Do you know the iPhone/iPad?" surely the answer will be "yes... it's cool"
RoberGalarga said:
Yeah, that's right. In fact, I never seen an Google commercial on TV, and many people don't know about Android. However, if you ask them "Do you know the iPhone/iPad?" surely the answer will be "yes... it's cool"
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There are some Nexus 7 commercials on these days, and back before Verizon got the iPhone they ran quite a few commercials with the OG Droid and Droid X. The iPhone is in nearly every new movie when a cell phone is shown. Its ironic because for years Apple embraced being different than the mainstream majority of whatever product they were trying to sell. Now the iPad/iPhone is about as mainstream as you can get since its everywhere.
What about the android shop in California....that must be the only store dedicated to an OS lol
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Once Google opens a nexus store in every big city in the world and has more commercials, sues the heck out of everybody and mocks Apple then they will be more popular. Oh yea there are ups and down on both platforms. Apple charges 99 bucks a year to develop apps and publish them while android only charges 25 bucks. But like said above there are too many androids from 3.5 inch 800 megahertz processors to giant 4.8 inch phones with a quad core cpu. The galaxy note is 5.3" GEEZUS
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apple smooth and no laggy
NicoJanuar said:
apple smooth and no laggy
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And JellyBean isn't?
NicoJanuar said:
apple smooth and no laggy
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Iphones and iPads are just overpriced ****e imo! They all look and feel the same, layout has been the same since day 1, their not very attractive, specs are a joke (4s is EXACTLY the same as the 4 just added a dual core 800mhz CPU and a joke piece of software called siri, which doesn't work half the time) and they have a cheek to charge £599 for a beefed up version of the iPhone 4!!! You must be kidding right??
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I just picked up a Galaxy S3 and it cost roughly the same as a new iphone. Apple appeals to a broad consumer base as any idiot can figure it out, and most people only use their phones to talk, text, facebook, angry birds, etc anyway. They're usually stable, and just work. Android, however, claims the cake because it doesn't lock you into any single hardware manufacturer, and has the open-source backing. It just so happens that since the tv is lovestruck by apple products, most people clamor to apple cause they saw it on tv, and since apple has the outspoken user base it does (aka fanboys), it popularly perceived that ios is the most popular platform. And with that, most entrepreneurs are going to go with the platform they feel their products will get the most exposure on, which leads to higher revenue. Econ 101
drbobmd said:
I just picked up a Galaxy S3 and it cost roughly the same as a new iphone. Apple appeals to a broad consumer base as any idiot can figure it out, and most people only use their phones to talk, text, facebook, angry birds, etc anyway. They're usually stable, and just work. Android, however, claims the cake because it doesn't lock you into any single hardware manufacturer, and has the open-source backing. It just so happens that since the tv is lovestruck by apple products, most people clamor to apple cause they saw it on tv, and since apple has the outspoken user base it does (aka fanboys), it popularly perceived that ios is the most popular platform. And with that, most entrepreneurs are going to go with the platform they feel their products will get the most exposure on, which leads to higher revenue. Econ 101
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I think you pretty much nailed it. Android being based on linux, and an 'open' system, alot of linux users/hackers use it, and there for do not want to pay for software, as with their computer operating systems. Now dont get me wrong, some people do pay for software, but if you can find a free alternative, or even better just create your own, why would you pay for it ?
With Apple products, basicly morons are buying it because they are told to, they think it is cool, all thier dumb ass friends have them, and so any software that is needed for it, they will pay through the nose for, just like their devices they have to upgrade before they have finished paying off the last one.
Forgive my extreme dis-like for Apple products. I just really do not like them.
It was long before the iPhone that I stayed away from Apple products. Their computers were and still are way overpriced when compared to the same specs on a Windows PC. Or you can build your own and save even more money. iPods are overpriced and you are forced to use iTunes. I've used Creative and Sandisk players that don't require any software as they were USB mass storage devices. I can write a simple batch file to sync two directories, I don't need a big program like iTunes. I remember one of my friends showing off their cool new iPod shuffle years ago, the model without a screen. Meanwhile I had a Sandisk player (forget the model) that had a screen and more storage space plus it costs less. I also had (still have) my Dell Axim x50 which still is a better MP3/video player than any iPod today since it has CF and SD slots and can play nearly every format with TCPMP.
Android was the next move for me after Microsoft discontinued Windows Mobile. Its the only popular mobile OS for power users left. Its a lot more stable than WM ever was, not responding apps will force close where as on WM you would often have to restart the device.
Unless Apple does something innovative with the iPhone, I predict it is on a sinking ship. Its an outdated device/UI after 5 years with little changes. After ICS, anytime I see an iOS device it just looks so outdated. There have been hardware upgrades but today's iPhone doesn't look much different from the 2007 model. The mobile market moves fast and those who don't keep up die off, look at what happened to Windows Mobile which didn't change for years.
One Topmost reason why Apps are more developed for iOS than Android:
The high-rated, most popular and mostly downloaded apps in Android suffers PIRACY ISSUE which is not acceptable to the developers as it incurs the developers a huge loss. Although it also happens with iOS apps, but their piracy rate is not that high as Android.
Also we must be thankful to the developers that in spite of these issues, they still develop good apps for us and make Android a better OS.
Sent From My Pencil
clonak said:
I think you pretty much nailed it. Android being based on linux, and an 'open' system, alot of linux users/hackers use it, and there for do not want to pay for software, as with their computer operating systems. Now dont get me wrong, some people do pay for software, but if you can find a free alternative, or even better just create your own, why would you pay for it ?
With Apple products, basicly morons are buying it because they are told to, they think it is cool, all thier dumb ass friends have them, and so any software that is needed for it, they will pay through the nose for, just like their devices they have to upgrade before they have finished paying off the last one.
Forgive my extreme dis-like for Apple products. I just really do not like them.
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Nah dude I feel ya. You get the same (for the most part) applications for less to nothing, and if it doesn't have the exact functionality you're looking for, you can change it yourself. Apple doesn't even give the option to sideload whereas Android allows it even for a stock unrooted user. But where we see these drawbacks, it does make iOS much more stable because it's extremely difficult for iphone users to screw it up. But you have to remember, different clientele. The one thing Apple has going for them is their brilliant (if you wanna call it that) marketing. That's the only reason they've done so well, is because they've managed to make a cult of it and exploit that fact that people are half the time so pathetic they need some product/brand to represent who they are, and Apple has provided that branding for millions of people. I do some home automation/networking projects as a hobby, and I hate my buddy's macbook cause that thing leaves crap all over my servers, even if the shares are on major lockdown. And getting them to play nicely with media, forget about it.
spunker88 said:
It was long before the iPhone that I stayed away from Apple products. Their computers were and still are way overpriced when compared to the same specs on a Windows PC. Or you can build your own and save even more money. iPods are overpriced and you are forced to use iTunes. I've used Creative and Sandisk players that don't require any software as they were USB mass storage devices. I can write a simple batch file to sync two directories, I don't need a big program like iTunes. I remember one of my friends showing off their cool new iPod shuffle years ago, the model without a screen. Meanwhile I had a Sandisk player (forget the model) that had a screen and more storage space plus it costs less. I also had (still have) my Dell Axim x50 which still is a better MP3/video player than any iPod today since it has CF and SD slots and can play nearly every format with TCPMP.
Android was the next move for me after Microsoft discontinued Windows Mobile. Its the only popular mobile OS for power users left. Its a lot more stable than WM ever was, not responding apps will force close where as on WM you would often have to restart the device.
Unless Apple does something innovative with the iPhone, I predict it is on a sinking ship. Its an outdated device/UI after 5 years with little changes. After ICS, anytime I see an iOS device it just looks so outdated. There have been hardware upgrades but today's iPhone doesn't look much different from the 2007 model. The mobile market moves fast and those who don't keep up die off, look at what happened to Windows Mobile which didn't change for years.
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Actually you can use an ipod with rhythm box, an itunes-like media player for Linux . I don't have one, so I can't say anything on its functionality. I had a windows phone on, if I remember correctly, a motorola que or something. WORST PHONE EVER. I got from a friend, but I was rebooting a good 10 times a day cause it would lock up or something wacko. In terms of iOS's gui, all they'd have to do is keep adding gooey nonsense and if the play it off as an upgrade, the apple kids will eat it up for the next 30 years without any need for advancing the base functionality. Honestly, I'm sure karma will catch up with Apple (as it did for Microsoft) and they'll bury themselves in crap. Don't know what, I'm just being hopefull
Really because the iOS users are the dumbest and will buy pretty much any app that is developed.
I joke I joke.
But really the reason is because a lot of developers feel that all android users do is pirate apps so they can't make a profit.
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There are so many factors why apple appstore has more apps,
Firstly it has a quality control, so when your apple appstore app is approved, then its a thing to be proud of next, the payment schemes offered my apple is easier than android, and also, you just need to test on 2 or maximum three devices unlike android where you gotta test on so many devices to with so many different API versions and screen sizes.
Next , visibility of new apps is much much more on apple store compared to Play store.
And lastly, the play store's global reach is less!
protonsavy said:
There are so many factors why apple appstore has more apps,
Firstly it has a quality control, so when your apple appstore app is approved, then its a thing to be proud of next, the payment schemes offered my apple is easier than android, and also, you just need to test on 2 or maximum three devices unlike android where you gotta test on so many devices to with so many different API versions and screen sizes.
Next , visibility of new apps is much much more on apple store compared to Play store.
And lastly, the play store's global reach is less!
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Bingo. They simplify everything for quality control that they feel provides a better user experience, and to some extent it does. While it is extremely restrictive, it still provides the masses with simplicity, of whom don't know a motherboard from a graphics card half the time. Android is more of a Wild West of sorts, allowing the users to have more control of their environment. Then again, Apple proponents are more likely to pay stupid amounts of money for close to anything so they can be one of the cool kids whereas Android folk either couldn't/didn't want to afford an iphone, or are Linux people who aren't gonna be keen on paying for software in the first place.
I know this is a little off topic,. but thought it should be seen. Here is the article that i copied and pasted with the URL below to the story, thanks.
There has been lots of action in the mobile industry this week.
First, Samsung is launching a much-anticipated new smartphone in New York this evening--a phone that many observers think will vault it ahead of Apple (AAPL) and the rest of the smartphone industry.
The existing version of this phone, the Galaxy S3, has already put Samsung on a par with Apple, with many phone buyers preferring the Galaxy's large screen to the smaller one on Apple's iPhone 5.
Samsung's new phone, the Galaxy S4, will be even bigger, and it is also expected to have several other new features that may make the iPhone look old and boring in comparison.
Related: Everything You Need to Know About The Samsung Galaxy 4S
Samsung, the Korean TV giant, has come out of nowhere over the last few years to become the world's largest smartphone seller. This rise has surprised both Wall Street and Apple. Apple's stock has tanked. And with Samsung now poised to leap past Apple, Apple executives are suddenly on the defensive.
This week, in a surprising move that has rubbed even Apple fans the wrong way, one of Apple's senior executives, Phil Schiller, gave interviews to The Wall Street Journal and Bloomberg in which he trashed the Android operating system that powers Samsung phones.
"When you take an Android device out of the box, you have to sign up to nine accounts with different vendors to get the experience iOS comes with," Schiller told the WSJ. "They don't work seamlessly together."
He went on to say that "Android is often given as a free replacement for a feature phone and the experience isn't as good as an iPhone."
The points that Schiller made about Android--that it is fragmented into different versions and that it's not as simple to use as Apple's operating system--were reasonable. But coming as they did on Samsung's big launch day, the comments seemed defensive, classless, and even desperate.
Apple's founder and CEO, Steve Jobs, was famous for trashing his competitors' products. But Jobs' picked his spots carefully. His criticisms came on Apple conference calls or at Apple events. He didn't try to steal competitors' thunder on their product launch days.
Also, in the days when Jobs was ridiculing the competition, Apple really was miles ahead of everyone. But it no longer is. So the sudden show of bravado seems even more tone deaf.
The last big development in the smartphone industry this week is that the executive who has built Google's (GOOG) Android operating system from the ground up, Andy Rubin, is being replaced by another Google executive.
Google appears to want to "unify" its two operating systems, Android and a laptop-based operating system called Chrome. This move makes strategic sense: In a world in which "mobile" is now a continuum between laptops and phones (with tablets in between), it's silly to maintain two separate operating systems. And it looks as though, in this unification, Google has chosen between two executives and decided to have the new combined effort led by Chrome boss Sundar Pichai.
In a trend that is reminiscent of the PC industry in the 1980s and 1990s, the Android operating system has become the dominant global mobile operating system over the last several years.
Apple's operating system, meanwhile, iOS, has been reduced to a niche player.
In "platform markets" like these, in which third-party companies build apps and services that run on top of these operating systems, market share is very important.
So if Samsung's new phone is a big hit, and Google's Android continues to gain global market share, Apple's challenges are only going to increase.
http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...ve-samsung-launches-huge-phone-145732269.html
This is not development. Smfh..... To the article. Didn't mean this to sound that mean. Just a little mean
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This is probably in the wrong section and will probably be moved. but i call bull**** on this! Samsung smokes apple out of the water, and im just talking about the Note 2.. And i came from an iPhone just last year!
I love the iPhone and I love android. Both for different reasons. The iPhone always "just works". Which is fantastic and boring at the same time. Android works great or needs help working great which is all the fun we do
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hopesrequiem said:
I love the iPhone and I love android. Both for different reasons. The iPhone always "just works". Which is fantastic and boring at the same time. Android works great or needs help working great which is all the fun we do
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Well this is my first android phone where it "just works".. on top of the freedom that comes along with it, by far, the best phone on the market. It's already awesome!
Wrong section . People fail to realize that Android statistics include the cheaper, lower end phones. Samsung caters to those who want the high end devices as well as to those who seek a low-cost for, while apple does NOT.
So they are comparing their ONLY phone which is their HIGH end to a variety of androids from the GN2 to some android phone you can pick up for pennies on the dollar. Those who I have spoken to that talked bad about androids were talking about phones I've never even heard of. What they should do is compare the satisfactory ratings for specific phones and see which one comes on top...oh wait...already done that and saw the results
So many editors are so quick to jump the gun and publish an article with HORRIBLE sources and populations in which the statistics were gathered from.
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So if this is off topic why would you for any reason think it goes in development? I mean you've been around since 2010..... come on man! Reported.
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Thread has been moved, and unfortunately I am going to have to close it also. All talk of "iPhone vs. Android" or "Apple said this" tends to get ugly fast. Trust me I despise Apple just as much as most of us do, but this isn't the place for it.