AT&T has introduced a new "Mobility Administrative Fee" to its postpaid contracts. The $0.61 monthly fee ($7.32 per year) is being categorized "below the line" alongside tax and fees as an administrative surcharge. The fee came into effect on May 1st, and applies to all consumer contracts as well as "IRU" business contracts (business accounts where the user pays the bill).
It's a small charge for the individual consumers, but given that AT&T's postpaid subscriber base stands at over 70 million, the move will net AT&T hundreds of millions of dollars — somewhere around half a billion dollars, in fact. That's a lot of extra revenue from one little charge.
AT&T tells us that the administrative fee will "help cover certain expenses, such as interconnection and cell site rents and maintenance." It also added that the charge is "consistent with similar fees charged by other carriers." While it's true that both Verizon and Sprint actually have higher administrative line charges — T-Mobile bundles any administrative fees in with regulatory charges, so it's difficult to tell — that's not likely to be much consolation for AT&T customers
http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/23/4358926/att-mobility-administrative-fee
CheesyNutz said:
AT&T has introduced a new "Mobility Administrative Fee" to its postpaid contracts. The $0.61 monthly fee ($7.32 per year) is being categorized "below the line" alongside tax and fees as an administrative surcharge. The fee came into effect on May 1st, and applies to all consumer contracts as well as "IRU" business contracts (business accounts where the user pays the bill).
It's a small charge for the individual consumers, but given that AT&T's postpaid subscriber base stands at over 70 million, the move will net AT&T hundreds of millions of dollars — somewhere around half a billion dollars, in fact. That's a lot of extra revenue from one little charge.
AT&T tells us that the administrative fee will "help cover certain expenses, such as interconnection and cell site rents and maintenance." It also added that the charge is "consistent with similar fees charged by other carriers." While it's true that both Verizon and Sprint actually have higher administrative line charges — T-Mobile bundles any administrative fees in with regulatory charges, so it's difficult to tell — that's not likely to be much consolation for AT&T customers
http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/23/4358926/att-mobility-administrative-fee
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can we use this to break a contract without paying ETF? I'm seeing yes and no answers on that question all over the internets
gunnyman said:
can we use this to break a contract without paying ETF? I'm seeing yes and no answers on that question all over the internets
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When I had VZW's service, they did something very similar. Technically, there's a clause in your wireless contract that says if the carrier makes changes to your contract that you don't agree with AND are materially adverse(this is a key phrase), you're able to break the contract with no penalty. If you don't challenge this change within a certain time farm... say 30 days, your silence is consent to the change. However, what VZW did to stop people from being able to use the material adverse clause to break the contract was to place a reoccurring discount on the account for the remaining duration of the contract thus bringing it back into compliance with the terms you originally signed. Likely, AT&T will do the same thing.
EDIT: Here's the section I'm talking about. Source, particularly section 1.3.
AT&T said:
We may change any terms, conditions, rates, fees, expenses, or charges regarding your Services at any time. We will provide you with notice of material changes (other than changes to governmental fees, proportional charges for governmental mandates, roaming rates or administrative charges) either in your monthly bill or separately. You understand and agree that State and Federal Universal Service Fees and other governmentally imposed fees, whether or not assessed directly upon you, may be increased based upon the government's or our calculations.
IF WE INCREASE THE PRICE OF ANY OF THE SERVICES TO WHICH YOU SUBSCRIBE, BEYOND THE LIMITS SET FORTH IN YOUR CUSTOMER SERVICE SUMMARY, OR IF WE MATERIALLY DECREASE THE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA IN WHICH YOUR AIRTIME RATE APPLIES (OTHER THAN A TEMPORARY DECREASE FOR REPAIRS OR MAINTENANCE), WE’LL DISCLOSE THE CHANGE AT LEAST ONE BILLING CYCLE IN ADVANCE (EITHER THROUGH A NOTICE WITH YOUR BILL, A TEXT MESSAGE TO YOUR DEVICE, OR OTHERWISE), AND YOU MAY TERMINATE THIS AGREEMENT WITHOUT PAYING AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE OR RETURNING OR PAYING FOR ANY PROMOTIONAL ITEMS, PROVIDED YOUR NOTICE OF TERMINATION IS DELIVERED TO US WITHIN THIRTY (30) DAYS AFTER THE FIRST BILL REFLECTING THE CHANGE.
If you lose your eligibility for a particular rate plan, we may change your rate plan to one for which you qualify.
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gunnyman said:
can we use this to break a contract without paying ETF? I'm seeing yes and no answers on that question all over the internets
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this is how i got out of my sprint contract ..... but im not sure im reading the same thing
Break a contract for an additional $0.65 a month? I'm pretty sure AT&T won't let this happen.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
It's breaking a contract because they changed the terms without my consent. The amount is irrelevant.
gunnyman said:
It's breaking a contract because they changed the terms without my consent. The amount is irrelevant.
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Good luck
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
I'm just looking for information here.
gunnyman said:
I'm just looking for information here.
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From what I gather this is not consider a rate change to your plan. It is an added tax which will not be considered a rate change so there for they won't let you out the contract.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
shook187 said:
From what I gather this is not consider a rate change to your plan. It is an added tax which will not be considered a rate change so there for they won't let you out the contract.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
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Att can't "tax" you. You mean it's a new service charge.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
shook187 said:
From what I gather this is not consider a rate change to your plan. It is an added tax which will not be considered a rate change so there for they won't let you out the contract.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
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its not a tax it's a FEE and YES you can get out of your contract this is EXACTLY how i got out of my contact with sprint 5 line's no ETF canceled since they was being sneaky and added a few extra fee's like this
CheesyNutz said:
its not a tax it's a FEE and YES you can get out of your contract this is EXACTLY how i got out of my contact with sprint 5 line's no ETF canceled since they was being sneaky and added a few extra fee's like this
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Same. I got out of my Sprint contact over what would have amounted to like $1.50 extra per year
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2
estxxas said:
Same. I got out of my Sprint contact over what would have amounted to like $1.50 extra per year
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2
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Same here...
This Messages Was Shot From A Galaxy S4!
Just spoke with ATT rep. When I asked to release me from the contract because of the fee increase, she responded with the following - since fee is not a service change, she cannot waive the ETF.
dk152 said:
Just spoke with ATT rep. When I asked to release me from the contract because of the fee increase, she responded with the following - since fee is not a service change, she cannot waive the ETF.
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Who said you needed a service change to void the contract? You signed a contract for x price. they've changed that price, which according to the others here, is enough to walk away.
And as far as ATT Reps are concerned, you can call 10 times and get 10 different answers.
@CheesyNutz What is the exact name of the additional fee? Is it the Mobility Administrative fee in the op, is that how it shows on the bill?
I just had a chat sessiom with them and they kept saying other carriers have a similar fee.
My response was that I was a sprint customer when they added this fee abd they allowed customer's to terminate they're contract and have their etf waived.
Then they kept saying att is a difference carrier
This Messages Was Shot From A Galaxy S4!
dk152 said:
Just spoke with ATT rep. When I asked to release me from the contract because of the fee increase, she responded with the following - since fee is not a service change, she cannot waive the ETF.
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Do the same thing in store, it's easy to tell someone no on the phone.. Totally different in person when you walk in holding a copy of the highlighted text on the contract.
Sent from my Tricked out HTC One
plmiller0905 said:
I just had a chat sessiom with them and they kept saying other carriers have a similar fee.
My response was that I was a sprint customer when they added this fee abd they allowed customer's to terminate they're contract and have their etf waived.
Then they kept saying att is a difference carrier
This Messages Was Shot From A Galaxy S4!
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I'd tell them that it doesn't matter what "other" carriers have. You dont have a contract with "other" carriers.. You didnt have the fee when i signed my contract. Then quote from the contract.
IF WE INCREASE THE PRICE OF ANY OF THE SERVICES TO WHICH YOU SUBSCRIBE, BEYOND THE LIMITS SET FORTH IN YOUR CUSTOMER SERVICE SUMMARY, OR IF WE MATERIALLY DECREASE THE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA IN WHICH YOUR AIRTIME RATE APPLIES (OTHER THAN A TEMPORARY DECREASE FOR REPAIRS OR MAINTENANCE), WE’LL DISCLOSE THE CHANGE AT LEAST ONE BILLING CYCLE IN ADVANCE (EITHER THROUGH A NOTICE WITH YOUR BILL, A TEXT MESSAGE TO YOUR DEVICE, OR OTHERWISE), AND YOU MAY TERMINATE THIS AGREEMENT WITHOUT PAYING AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE OR RETURNING OR PAYING FOR ANY PROMOTIONAL ITEMS, PROVIDED YOUR NOTICE OF TERMINATION IS DELIVERED TO US WITHIN THIRTY (30) DAYS AFTER THE FIRST BILL REFLECTING THE CHANGE.
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nugzo said:
I'd tell them that it doesn't matter what "other" carriers have. You dont have a contract with "other" carriers.. You didnt have the fee when i signed my contract. Then quote from the contract.
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Yeah..but I assume the "service" theyre talking about is like data, text messaging, minutes..etc
This Messages Was Shot From A Galaxy S4!
What the fine print says is that they can increase the service fees without notice, but this is adding a service fee. I think one could get out of your contract without ETF. I'll try calling tomorrow.
Related
Unfortunately, I havent been able to find a job in almost 3 years and cant afford my bill. Is there anyone that can help me cancel my line and waive the ETF?
Free Dirk!!!
Right now Sprint is raising some of their regulatory charges, you can argue that these increases represent a material adverse charge which in accordance with their contract allows you to exit your contract with no ETF. I used this to exit Verizon, it should work with Sprint too.
If they ask you why you wish to end your contract
The increase in the Regulatory Charge represents a material adverse effect to me
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They'll ask if there are any other reasons, there are not, do not complain about the service, the device, the monthly contract price.
THERE IS NO REASON BUT THAT CHARGE.
They may argue that these charges reflect a change in taxes and fees that Sprint is charged by local, state, and federal fees and are thereby not subject to the material adverse effect clause.
Sprint defines the regulatory charge as "Sprint Surcharges are rates we choose to collect from you to help defray costs imposed on us. Surcharges are not taxes on you or amounts we are required to collect from you by law." As this is not a fee required by law and explicitly a fee Sprint chooses to collect it is in fact covered under the material adverse effect clause.
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They may try to offer to rebate the difference to you, if they do argue the following
The contract does not stipulate that Sprint may choose to mitigate a change in contract with an account credit. However the contract does explicitly state my option to cancel the line. If I were to accept or not accept the offer, which has no basis is the written contract, the material adverse effect is still represented in the new contractual fees.
In Cunningham vs. Fleetwood Homes of Georgia, reported at page 611 of the third Federal Reporter, volume 253, the Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that arbitration clauses are material terms to a contract.
If the contract has in fact been altered to allow for mitigation of the charges by account credit, then my standing in a potential arbitration has been negated. So such a clause, having the potential to alter my standing in arbitration would itself be a materially adverse change.
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If they still refuse to let them go ask them
Are you explicitly notifying me, as a representative of Sprint, of Sprint's refusal to comply with the terms of a federally binding contract?
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That's all I had to do with Verizon
Okay, I'll give it another shot.
You could sell your phone and pay the ETF with that money.
USSENTERNCC1701E said:
Right now Sprint is raising some of their regulatory charges, you can argue that these increases represent a material adverse charge which in accordance with their contract allows you to exit your contract with no ETF. I used this to exit Verizon, it should work with Sprint too.
If they ask you why you wish to end your contract
They'll ask if there are any other reasons, there are not, do not complain about the service, the device, the monthly contract price.
THERE IS NO REASON BUT THAT CHARGE.
They may argue that these charges reflect a change in taxes and fees that Sprint is charged by local, state, and federal fees and are thereby not subject to the material adverse effect clause.
They may try to offer to rebate the difference to you, if they do argue the following
If they still refuse to let them go ask them
That's all I had to do with Verizon
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Wow, are you a lawyer or someone of that sort? This is amazing. I'm not being sarcastic by the way. I truly am impressed.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using XDA App
cruise350 said:
You could sell your phone and pay the ETF with that money.
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Ha! The **** I look like selling my phone?
USSENTERNCC1701E said:
Right now Sprint is raising some of their regulatory charges, you can argue that these increases represent a material adverse charge which in accordance with their contract allows you to exit your contract with no ETF. I used this to exit Verizon, it should work with Sprint too.
If they ask you why you wish to end your contract
They'll ask if there are any other reasons, there are not, do not complain about the service, the device, the monthly contract price.
THERE IS NO REASON BUT THAT CHARGE.
They may argue that these charges reflect a change in taxes and fees that Sprint is charged by local, state, and federal fees and are thereby not subject to the material adverse effect clause.
They may try to offer to rebate the difference to you, if they do argue the following
If they still refuse to let them go ask them
That's all I had to do with Verizon
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I love you dude. This worked 100%
StoneColdCarl said:
Wow, are you a lawyer or someone of that sort? This is amazing. I'm not being sarcastic by the way. I truly am impressed.
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Nah, studying physics and philosophy Thanks though
knowledge561 said:
I love you dude. This worked 100%
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Glad it helped. Good luck with the job, it's a **** market to be looking in
Does anyone know if you will be able to start a new contact right after you cancel this way as a way of getting an early upgrade, or will they kind of blacklist you for a few months after you cancel the contact?
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
el_capitan10 said:
Does anyone know if you will be able to start a new contact right after you cancel this way as a way of getting an early upgrade, or will they kind of blacklist you for a few months after you cancel the contact?
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
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I've seen it somewhere that you can sign up immediately after through a third party vendor, specifically wirefly was suggested. I can't remember where I read this though, may have been here on XDA
USSENTERNCC1701E said:
Right now Sprint is raising some of their regulatory charges, you can argue that these increases represent a material adverse charge which in accordance with their contract allows you to exit your contract with no ETF. I used this to exit Verizon, it should work with Sprint too.
If they ask you why you wish to end your contract
They'll ask if there are any other reasons, there are not, do not complain about the service, the device, the monthly contract price.
THERE IS NO REASON BUT THAT CHARGE.
They may argue that these charges reflect a change in taxes and fees that Sprint is charged by local, state, and federal fees and are thereby not subject to the material adverse effect clause.
They may try to offer to rebate the difference to you, if they do argue the following
If they still refuse to let them go ask them
That's all I had to do with Verizon
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that sir is great im calling tonight and will use this if need be
@USSENTERNCC1701E
Wow! Just... Wow! I'm not even with Sprint (I'm up in Canada), but I must say, I'm impressed! I do love to pin large corporations to the wall and make them accountable when need be! I've used somewhat similar tactics to have early upgrades, waived fees, even got a free computer once from my landline provider (back in the stone age when I HAD a landine)
I've found you can get just about anything you ask for as long as you do your homework, keep a cool head, and when in doubt, ask to speak to a supervisor. Good on you man
This should be stickied! I'm sure there are plenty of folks out there who could use this sort of advice!
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we will change the world
If I change my current phone which I bought through wirefly back in July to a 4g phone, will I pay a penalty? It hasn't been 6 months since I got the phone. I won't be lowering my monthly rate plan but it will just change to unlimited 3g and 4g instead of just unlimited 3g. Can they find out that I changed the phone?
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
They can find out yes and then you'll be charged.
antispiral said:
If I change my current phone which I bought through wirefly back in July to a 4g phone, will I pay a penalty? It hasn't been 6 months since I got the phone. I won't be lowering my monthly rate plan but it will just change to unlimited 3g and 4g instead of just unlimited 3g. Can they find out that I changed the phone?
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
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Can't you wait a 2-3 more weeks?
Checkout the terms here http://www.wirefly.com/about/purchaseterms/?referringdomain=wirefly&refcode1=&refcode2=&agent=&eid=&zipcode=94107 It states the following:
INSTANT SAVINGS DISCOUNTS
Wirefly promises you savings in the form of instant discounts with no rebates or gimmicks when you sign up for wireless carrier service on a 2 year agreement. Delivering on this promise means that you must agree to maintain your agreement for a minimum of 6 months after activation. Deactivating your phone, or downgrading features or the rate plan, may lead to additional charges.
To provide you with significant savings vs. buying in a retail store, the price you paid for your device includes an Instant Savings Discount from Wirefly.
By accepting this Instant Savings Discount, you agree to repay $200 of this discount ($400 for smartphones, tablets, and netbooks) and authorize us to charge your credit card in repayment of this amount if, you signed up for a 2 year agreement and during the 181 days after your new equipment is activated, your wireless carrier notifies us that the services you purchased have been suspended, disconnected, or deactivated, or if you return your purchase outside of the return and exchange provisions of our Satisfaction Guarantee.
Please note some of the reasons your wireless carrier may notify us of a deactivation include if:
You transfer this equipment to another carrier line of service after it is activated
You change your rate plan to a lower monthly service rate than was specifically required at the point of purchase
You deactivate texting/data features that were specifically required at the point of purchase
The new line of service activated with your order is used to replace a pre-existing account
Hope this helps
I ordered from wirefly and changed phones around on my lines and was never charged. They might notice, they might not.
Wirefly is a scam I would never buy anything from them. And they will charge you don't try it unless you have enough to cover an ETF but once you pay it you'll be on Verizon terms then..
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using xda premium
Ok thanks for the help
Sent from my R800x using Tapatalk
A new for AT&T to earn more money??
Administrative Fee (Consumer and Individual Responsibility User (IRU) lines only)
The Administrative Fee helps defray certain expenses AT&T incurs, including but not limited to: (a) charges AT&T or its agents pay to interconnect with other carriers to deliver calls from AT&T customers to their customers; and (b) charges associated with cell site rents and maintenance.
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What a B.S.! Can't stand these communication companies and the lack of options in this country.
sbi1 said:
A new for AT&T to earn more money??
What a B.S.! Can't stand these communication companies and the lack of options in this country.
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The rich will get richer, the poor will get poorer. Its ridiculous what this government let these corporations get away with. Of course at the working man's expense.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda app-developers app
lildoggs said:
The rich will get richer, the poor will get poorer. Its ridiculous what this government let these corporations get away with. Of course at the working man's expense.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda app-developers app
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They don't make enough money.... they justify by letting us pay only $200 for a $700 phone. Tha'ts how they get away with it... we can all go to the European way and just buy the phones up front and save a little on the service. But they will still make tons of money of us. $37 stock price for today 11%+ rise year to date... They obviously need more and more :crying:
I called AT&T yesterday to ***** about it, I asked the CSR "What 'new' expenses does AT&T have now that they didn't have last month?". Sure enough he started reading to me the same thing as I posted above. I said "don't read this to me, I can read it myself. I want to know what NEW EXPENSES do you have..."
He said "we don't have that info". I said "well, HQ should give you the answers".
I got so pissed at him that he ended up giving me a credit of the 4 lines times this bull**** fee for the next year ($30). Sure, I was happy and appreciative of his attempt to make a customer happy. Nevertheless, can't wait for my contract to expire to get the hell out. That's why I don't take 'free/discounted' phones from AT&T. Only international versions, nothing with AT&T logo on it. I will not be tied in contracts with big corporations any more.
Sure, it's much more difficult now to go somewhere else when Straight Talk no longer have AT&T sim cards, but we'll see.
sbi1 said:
That's why I don't take 'free/discounted' phones from AT&T. Only international versions, nothing with AT&T logo on it. I will not be tied in contracts with big corporations any more.
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Could not agree more, well said.
Sent from the i777
Quick & Easy BBB, FTC, FCC links
Some momentum is growing at forums.att.com to have a mass of customers report to the BBB, FTC, and FCC, so I am posting easy links here, in case others wish to do so as well.
It's really quick and easy to make your voice heard .
BBB: www.bbb.org/atlanta/business-reviews/telephone-companies/atandt-in-atlanta-ga-7935/file-a-complaint
FTC: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?Lang=en
FCC: http://www.fcc.gov/complaints
You can base your info on the following but you will have to edit it to fit in the web forms:
"AT&T has raised the price on every wireless line in service by $.61 a month by adding a new fee to every bill, which they explain as follows:
"MOBILITY ADMINISTRATIVE FEE" Effective May 1, 2013, the Administrative Fee will be $0.61 per line per month. The Administrative Fee helps defray certain expenses AT&T incurs, including but not limited to: (a) charges AT&T or its agents pay to interconnect with other carriers to deliver calls from AT&T customers to their customers; and (b) charges associated with cell site rents and maintenance."
This is a baloney way of saying "price increase", and is a blatant violation of basic contract law which does not allow the changing of terms after the beginning of a bilateral agreement. The vast majority of ATT customers have 2-year contract agreements which prevent their switching carriers without paying a huge penalty clause.
The ATT Wireless Agreement reads: "If we increase the price of any of the services to which you subscribe, beyond the limits set forth in your customer service summary... you may terminate this agreement without paying an early termination fee or returning or paying for any promotional items."
CTIA Consumer Code reads: "Carriers will not modify the material terms of their subscribers' contracts in a manner that is materially adverse to subscribers without providing a reasonable advance notice of a proposed modification and allowing subscribers a time period of not less than 14 days to cancel their contracts with no early termination fee."
ATT claims that the price for the service remains the same and are only adding a "fee".
What's from stopping AT&T from adding an additional $50/month fee and not letting customers out of their contract?
$.61 doesn't sound like much, but some people have multiple lines. In addition, multiplied by 115.78 million customers, AT&T makes an extra $847 million a year from this dishonest price hike.
As it is not any kind of tax or government mandated charge, the new fee should be included in the basic price displayed in advertising and informational material. The new fee should only be charged on new contracts beginning after the increase, and existing contract customers must be allowed to either reject the price hike or be allowed to terminate their service without penalty, as the contract has already been breached by the carrier."
Coincidentally I just cancelled one of my add-on packages with Comcast cable and they also tried to charge a $2.xx administrative fee. Although the CSR waived it as a 'one time courtesy,' seeing the same issue here highlights what appears to be a growing trend.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyDbfCbQnH8
harryspar said:
Some momentum is growing at forums.att.com to have a mass of customers report to the BBB, FTC, and FCC, so I am posting easy links here, in case others wish to do so as well.
It's really quick and easy to make your voice heard .
BBB: www.bbb.org/atlanta/business-reviews/telephone-companies/atandt-in-atlanta-ga-7935/file-a-complaint
FTC: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?Lang=en
FCC: http://www.fcc.gov/complaints
You can base your info on the following but you will have to edit it to fit in the web forms:
"AT&T has raised the price on every wireless line in service by $.61 a month by adding a new fee to every bill, which they explain as follows:
"MOBILITY ADMINISTRATIVE FEE" Effective May 1, 2013, the Administrative Fee will be $0.61 per line per month. The Administrative Fee helps defray certain expenses AT&T incurs, including but not limited to: (a) charges AT&T or its agents pay to interconnect with other carriers to deliver calls from AT&T customers to their customers; and (b) charges associated with cell site rents and maintenance."
This is a baloney way of saying "price increase", and is a blatant violation of basic contract law which does not allow the changing of terms after the beginning of a bilateral agreement. The vast majority of ATT customers have 2-year contract agreements which prevent their switching carriers without paying a huge penalty clause.
The ATT Wireless Agreement reads: "If we increase the price of any of the services to which you subscribe, beyond the limits set forth in your customer service summary... you may terminate this agreement without paying an early termination fee or returning or paying for any promotional items."
CTIA Consumer Code reads: "Carriers will not modify the material terms of their subscribers' contracts in a manner that is materially adverse to subscribers without providing a reasonable advance notice of a proposed modification and allowing subscribers a time period of not less than 14 days to cancel their contracts with no early termination fee."
ATT claims that the price for the service remains the same and are only adding a "fee".
What's from stopping AT&T from adding an additional $50/month fee and not letting customers out of their contract?
$.61 doesn't sound like much, but some people have multiple lines. In addition, multiplied by 115.78 million customers, AT&T makes an extra $847 million a year from this dishonest price hike.
As it is not any kind of tax or government mandated charge, the new fee should be included in the basic price displayed in advertising and informational material. The new fee should only be charged on new contracts beginning after the increase, and existing contract customers must be allowed to either reject the price hike or be allowed to terminate their service without penalty, as the contract has already been breached by the carrier."
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Complaints filed.
sbi1 said:
Complaints filed.
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You da man. How long did it take, a few minutes, right? We need more people to act.
Thanks for the heads up, I didn't even notice it. I filed a complaint with the FTC and will look into switching when my contract ends next month
Does this fee count as a material change in the contract? I'm guessing not. Sneaky
edit: I now read harryspar's post completely. When Sprint did this, many people were able to cancel and not pay an ETF, but I'm guessing AT&T will fight this but some people might be able to get away with it.
havanahjoe said:
When Sprint did this, many people were able to cancel and not pay an ETF, but I'm guessing AT&T will fight this but some people might be able to get away with it.
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Some people have been successful, see thread on fawallet.com: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1270724/
harryspar said:
You da man. How long did it take, a few minutes, right? We need more people to act.
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Yup. few minutes and the bastards "responded" to the BBB one with the usual B.S., to which I responded with (basically) "Cut the B.S.". Nothing will change until everyone files a complaint.
I went through a similar experience with Sprint last year. They claimed it was not a "material change" as another poster eluded to and when I digged very deep in my contract - there was a clause which allowed them to add up to $2.00 per month in "fees" without being considered "material" changes...
I think it depends on the rep you get, some people I know used the fee to get out of their contracts and some it did not work for. I was able to get the fee waived (it was only 20 cents per month or so that they were adding this time) but I didn't feel like fighting to get any further.
Have A Question Regarding etf. I recently had a line cancel out on my account. The etf is 350 but then I'm also getting charged an additional $65 in taxes for a total of $415. What the heck is that. When did taxes start applying in to the etf. I had an etf line a year ago and there was none of this. I even looked at the contract and online at sprint.com and it states upto $350 etf. No where does it say plus taxes. Can anyone clarify this? Any sprint employees
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yaniel06 said:
Have A Question Regarding etf. I recently had a line cancel out on my account. The etf is 350 but then I'm also getting charged an additional $65 in taxes for a total of $415. What the heck is that. When did taxes start applying in to the etf. I had an etf line a year ago and there was none of this. I even looked at the contract and online at sprint.com and it states upto $350 etf. No where does it say plus taxes. Can anyone clarify this? Any sprint employees
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Yeah, based on a cursory search of their Terms and Conditions, I couldn't find anything relating to taxes on an ETF. You might want to call their billing department to see what's going on with that. Record your phone call (tell them that you're doing this, as some states require everyone to be aware of recordings), make them tell you exactly where in their Terms and Conditions this line is located. If they don't answer your questions to your satisfaction, talk to a supervisor and see what they can do for you.
Edit:
I just saw this line in Sprint's Return and Exchange Policy:
Please note that this policy may not reflect the additional return policies of our authorized third-party dealers or retailers. If you are returning a device leased through Apple Finance Services (AFS), call AFS at 1-800-216-4384.
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The taxes could be from a third-party dealer or retailer, but it doesn't sound like it. Just a heads up.
Just read it but this looks like it is due to a return within the 14 days they give you.
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I find it funny that on the Framily plan Sprint advertises no contract no ETF's yet my plan still indicates I am locked into a contract and that I will have ETF's if I cancel.
MikeyLee said:
I find it funny that on the Framily plan Sprint advertises no contract no ETF's yet my plan still indicates I am locked into a contract and that I will have ETF's if I cancel.
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You don't have a contract, unless you we're already under a contract before you switched your plan. Then you would still have until your original contract date ends. Also if your enrolled in easy pay for a new phone where u would pay monthly for it, if you we're to decided to terminate your service you would be responsible for the remainder of the phones retail price!
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MikeyLee said:
I find it funny that on the Framily plan Sprint advertises no contract no ETF's yet my plan still indicates I am locked into a contract and that I will have ETF's if I cancel.
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I believe this is due to the transition between Subsidized to Un-Subsidized phone plans... I'll try to explain this in a way that makes sense, since I had to ask a lot of questions in order to fully understand it myself. In order to understand why there's even an ETF, we have to understand how subsidized phones worked and why Sprint (and soon all other carriers) will move away from them.
Subsidized Phones and Early Termination Fees (ETFs)
When you buy a subsidized phone (let's say a Note III) for $200, that doesn't mean that Sprint got the phone for $200 and is now passing the savings off to you. It means that they have factored in the cost of the phone in their plan pricing. If the phone cost them $500 (at wholesale), that's $300 that they have to recoup from you over the course of two years. If you get your phone and decide to leave after 6 months, they're not going to recoup $240 (assuming they split it evenly over the 24 months, which I doubt). That's the philosophy behind the ETF. If you leave early, they aren't going to recoup from their subsidized phones, and they lost out on a decent amount of cash.
That's also why the ETF decreases as you get closer to that magic 2-year mark. They've already recouped most of their "investment" into you as a customer, so they can't charge you as much for an ETF.
Now, the Subsidized phone scheme has always been a means to entice new customers and to keep existing customers. If you can offer a $700 smart phone for $250, it's great marketing! But, I bet they are making less money when they have to subsidize a smart phone than when they offer a "dumb" flip-phone for free. When smartphones (I'm thinking back to the days of the Treo) were relegated back to the nerds and businessmen, they could afford to make less money on the subsidized plan and still make a ton on the subsidized flip phones.
Verizon must have loved my in-laws, because they had the same "dumb" flip-phones for about 5 years, but were paying the same price as the High School senior who had a subsidized iPhone. In my opinion, the in-laws were paying the subsidy price of the iPhone.
After the iPhone and the mass-market flooding of smart phones, more and more people started getting smart phones. When looking at phones, the consumer can easily argue an extra $50 to get a top-end smartphone over a medium-level phone. Which should work out fine, but it also means that Sprint (or Verizon or ATT or whoever) is not going to make as much money (due to the subsidized portion of the phone cost being higher). I've even heard that they started losing money on some of the top-end phones since the subsidized costs were higher than the recouping they were doing. (note: the previous sentence is hearsay and no credible source has been given to me).
At first, Sprint (and others) tried to recoup those losses by incurring a "smartphone" fee. I remember the first time I saw a $10 "Premium Data" fee, I knew it was bull**** (pardon the language), but I was also stuck in a contract. Despite much arguing with various supervisors, I still ended up paying it, but not before threatening to leave numerous times (even with the ETF). If it weren't for my 18% "employee" discount, I would've switched.
Un-Subsidized Phones and the Future of Phone Buying (IMO)
I think the Framily Plan is interesting. They are basically taking the subsidy cost out of the phone plan and having the customer pay for what they actually get. In my opinion, this is much better.
Yes, I get a gut reaction when I have to pay full-price for my latest-and-greatest phone (since I'm so used to my subsidized price). But for those customers who are OK with keeping their technology a bit longer or buying second-hand phones, they can make some pretty significant savings. It also means that you don't have to buy your phone from Sprint or Verizon. The customer has more options when it comes to buying their phone.
So, all-in-all, I think it's a good move and I can see all carriers moving towards this model in the future.
Transition between Subsidized and Un-Subsidized Plans
This is where I believe you, MikeyLee, are stuck. Sprint can't recoup their losses from your subsidized phone because you're now paying $25/month on the Framily plan. This is why they initially had the whole "existing members can't join the Framily" crap. They loosened that to some members being "merge eligible," meaning they were allowed to switch to the Framily Plan. I believe the only check for "merge eligibility" was whether or not Sprint had recouped enough of their subsidy.
For those of us who were merge eligible but who still had time before their old two-year contract was up, Sprint also has an ETF to cover the remainder of the original two-year agreement (and recoup their losses from you leaving and not ponying up for your subsidized phone).
In Closing
I personally like the Un-Subsidized plan. For me, I went from paying $150/month down to $75/month (2 lines, one with unlimited, not counting phone monthly payments). Even when I factor in the cost of two new top-tier smart phone every 2 years, I still save $700 over the two years.
It also makes more sense for people like my in-laws, who don't need (or want) the latest-and-greatest and would rather keep their phones for decades if they could.
But yes, the transition between the two is inherently going to be messy. Hold out to see the real value of un-subsidized plans!
Anyone heard or have any input for this website? Cellbreaker.com. It claims to break your cellphone contract without paying ETF's. I've seen it on the news, but still not too sure since per line its 77 bucks. Anyone use this and have experience to share?
Thanks
Ummmm, yeah...
ppat324wi said:
Anyone heard or have any input for this website? Cellbreaker.com. It claims to break your cellphone contract without paying ETF's. I've seen it on the news, but still not too sure since per line its 77 bucks. Anyone use this and have experience to share?
Thanks
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I never heard of it until now, so I went to the site. First they want to charge you $10 to do an analysis. Then, IF they find breach of contract, you pay another $77 to them to get you out of it. So, that's $87.00.
Most carrier ETF's are $250, pro-rated for 24 months. This means that every month you have the phone, you deduct $10.42 from that $250.00. Once you've had your phone for 16 months, the price cellbreaker wants to charge you is MORE than your ETF would be.
Further, from what I'm reading on their website, the breaches they look for are price increases, terms changes, and "performance deficiency." Performance deficiency is very subjective. If you only have service 4 days out of 7, and can document it, sure, there's a breach of contract. But I don't think I've been anywhere where I have not had service for more than a couple of minutes. I've been with Verizon for 14 years and they have never once raised the price, altered my terms or done anything even remotely close to breaching their end of the bargain during any two year period.
In other words: try it if you want, but I honestly don't think it will do you any good. Even though it's "GUARANTEED" to get you out of your contract. Here's that "guarantee," by the way: Terms of Use TBD...
Good luck!!!
So Verizon's etf is 250 if you just got the phone, and since I have had my phone (S4) for about a year, my phone 's etf would be around 120 dollars?
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Yep. That sounds about right. Plus you would be responsible for your final bill, so it's important that you cancel prior to the end of your billing cycle.
Well, I called Verizon, and they told me that it would be 250 per line for the etf, bringing me 250+250+230=730 dollars for etf. Ouch
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ppat324wi said:
Well, I called Verizon, and they told me that it would be 250 per line for the etf, bringing me 250+250+230=730 dollars for etf. Ouch
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OUCH! That's strange to me. I was going to dump them a year or so ago because I could have received a better price through my job. But they're on ATT and I don't like ATT. Well, at least I like them less than Verizon. But big red told me the fees were prorated. I wonder if that has changed...
ammjr71 said:
OUCH! That's strange to me. I was going to dump them a year or so ago because I could have received a better price through my job. But they're on ATT and I don't like ATT. Well, at least I like them less than Verizon. But big red told me the fees were prorated. I wonder if that has changed...
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They got rid of prorated fees about two years ago. Now it's straight up 250 per line through out the contract.
skeezer308 said:
They got rid of prorated fees about two years ago. Now it's straight up 250 per line through out the contract.
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According to http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/support/customer-agreement that's not true.
WHAT HAPPENS IF MY POSTPAY SERVICE IS CANCELED BEFORE THE END OF MY CONTRACT TERM?
If you're signing up for Postpay Service, you're agreeing to subscribe to a line of Service either on a month–to–month basis or for a minimum contract term, as shown on your receipt or order confirmation. (If your Service is suspended without billing, that time doesn't count toward completing your contract term.) Once you've completed your contract term, you'll automatically become a customer on a month–to–month basis for that line of Service. If you cancel a line of Service, or if we cancel it for good cause, during its contract term, you'll have to pay an early termination fee. If your contract term results from your purchase of an advanced device, your early termination fee will be $350 minus $10 for each full month of your contract term that you complete. Otherwise, your early termination fee will be $175 minus $5 for each full month of your contract term that you complete. Cancellations will become effective on the last day of that month's billing cycle, and you are responsible for all charges incurred until then. Also, if you bought your wireless device from an authorized agent or third–party vendor, you should check whether they charge a separate termination fee.
ppat324wi said:
Anyone heard or have any input for this website? Cellbreaker.com. It claims to break your cellphone contract without paying ETF's. I've seen it on the news, but still not too sure since per line its 77 bucks. Anyone use this and have experience to share?
Thanks
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Based on what their site states they will analyze your contract for Carrier's breach and if they find one for $77 they send the communication to the carrier on your behalf to cancel your contract due to breach.
It seems highly probable being that your average customer would not be able to look at all possible breaches, as far as reputation well they claim they give you a 100% guarantee so that should cover you.
Did you pay the $10 for the analysis and did the analysis return a positive breach finding?
Well, I used a promo code that got me the analysis for free, and it did return with a breakable contract. I might just try it with one of my lines first, then see it it actually is true,then I will do the extra two lines.
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From the Moderator
To all --the term Caveat Emptor comes to mind.... Though this could be a benefit to some...... with the term contracts going away with each passing day..maybe yes...maybe no..... do your research before letting go of your money and or your privacy (which appears that this is necessary for this company to do what they do)...
~~~ oka1
I would choose cellbreaker again and again!
I was with my cell phone company for years before I decided that I was unhappy with everything. I am a long termer. I had been their loyal customer for upwards of 10 years and beyond. I enjoyed everything about my cell phone company until they decided to hike up my cell phone bill. I felt betrayed. I wanted out of my cell phone carriers company, when I noticed that my friends and family were receiving better pricing and coverage. Did I mention coverage? Coverage was awful! Well CellBreaker was there to help. I discovered them on the internet. When I called them, they told me about their process and about their guarantee that it would only take 7 days to switch my contracts. Well it took them a little longer, about 2 more days. I am still pleased with the results. The new contract that they placed me in was cross checked, by them, to guarantee that I wouldn’t experience the price hikes that I experienced with my old contract. I hope that this review will help you determine whether or not you would like to work with CellBreaker. I am happy I worked with them!
ppat324wi said:
Anyone heard or have any input for this website? Cellbreaker.com. It claims to break your cellphone contract without paying ETF's. I've seen it on the news, but still not too sure since per line its 77 bucks. Anyone use this and have experience to share?
Thanks
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Out of curiosity what are you going to do when you leave your contract? If you go to T-Mobile they pay your ETF, if you go to Sprint they buy out your contract and cut your bill in half. So unless you are going to AT&T (why?) you could save yourself the $$.