Related
Ok...before I am trying to complaint with the business bureau..I would like to get some feedback or opinion from everyone:
1. Currently I am not with Sprint anymore due to the fact that I am getting tired of slow data on their network and has been filing complaint for the past 6 mos.
2. I did pay the ETF to fulfilled the contract agreement.
3. The question is since Motorola Photon is capable of both GSM quad band and CDMA. Should Sprint unlock the radio band for US user to be able to use on the US GSM network?
This is really struck me hard with their level of technically expertise:
4. I called Sprint tech support today and here is the answers:
a) Your phone can't use the SIM card (this is the answered from the Tech Support Supervisor)... After I told him to look at the only Sprint World phone release last year.. he finally accepting the fact that it is capable on GSM.
b) Then he went on explained to me that even the phone is support GSM it can't support the frequency of T-Mobile or ATT network. What the hell?
c) So just for fun, I asked him what is the frequencies for T-mobile and ATT?
he did gave me the right answers on both network so I asked him are those matching the specification of the Photon. he re-plied "YES".
d) I went on and asking him that if I fulfilled my contract with Sprint. Should I (the owner of the phone) have the right to use any carriers if my phone support it? He said "YES".
e) He then tell me that it's still does not accept SIM card with T-Mobile and ATT because the phone does not support it. I ask him why? he said because the SIM card is different (What??????????), Even after I explained to him that I have been travel to Philippines, Vietnam, and Thailand I have no trouble using their SIM card.
Man .. at that point after holding on for almost 1 hour, I know the conversation getting no where. I felt like I am talking to and "idi****t".
So now, just for the fun of it I am gonna see if I get them to unlock the Radio Band for US GSM through the "Law" in US.
Any opinions would appreciated.
Thanks....It was frustrated with Sprint tech support during the call, but it's something that make me laugh real hard afterward.
you would be a hero if you were able to get it unlocked for carriers within the US. That being said, I suspect your real issue (and litigant) would be Motorola who sells the photon GSM locked for the US.
you bought a world phone, im sure there is some tiny print somewhere at some point that says its locked for some reason
shabbypenguin said:
you bought a world phone, im sure there is some tiny print somewhere at some point that says its locked for some reason
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It could be...but I found there are nothing in the 2 years agreement that I signed up for mentioned anything about it.
Secondly, It's not that I cancelled the contract and failed to pay their ETF.
I did paid my ETF as agreed in the contract.
This does mean I owned that particular phone.
T-Mobile or ATT always unlocked you phone after contract is over (for ATT is if you are with them for 6 mos.. call in and they will provide the unlock code).
findthedr said:
you would be a hero if you were able to get it unlocked for carriers within the US. That being said, I suspect your real issue (and litigant) would be Motorola who sells the photon GSM locked for the US.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I can see that this is going to motorola ... but they gonna passing the buckets around.
I will attempt to contact Motorola later to see what their answer is gonna be.
I say if the companies won't provide it for us directly, then we should make complaints to the BBB as mentioned above along with the FCC.
- Promoting competition, innovation, and investment in broadband services and facilities;
Does allowing Sprint to lock the GSM on a phone being sold in the US from not working with US GSM Carriers truly accomplish this?
- Supporting the nation’s economy by ensuring an appropriate competitive framework for the unfolding of the communications revolution;
I don't believe that allowing our purchased handset to not be usable on other carriers while its' technically possible for it to do so supports this either. It's actually an anti-competitive framework that encourages lock-in and tries to block consumers from having choice at the technical level.
It'd be understandable if the Photon was a CDMA only phone, but it's capable of GSM at frequencies that other carriers can use. Sprint/Motorola chose to stop us from being able to switch carriers due to price deterrence by having to purchase a new telephone.
- Encouraging the highest and best use of spectrum domestically and internationally;
My phone can't use any spectrum deigned for GSM use in the US. Encourage Sprint/Motorola to fix this please.
- Revising media regulations so that new technologies flourish alongside diversity and localism;
Does that mean that you no longer care for the life old technologies that you help enable to flourish?
- Providing leadership in strengthening the defense of the nation’s communications infrastructure.
I don't think that me selling my Photon to a shady character to cover the cost of a new purchase contributes towards that security that hope to foster. In Octavia Butler's "Parable" series, it's common for people to use disposable phones as a means to not be tracked easily and to quickly stay secure personally. Why encourage me to offer someone a high-end disposable phone with all types of awesome abilities when I can keep this phone or be encouraged to give it to a trusted friend once I'm done using it?
http://www.fcc.gov/what-we-do
F-C-C please set us free!
Photon: Let me be me on ATT!
(Honestly, I would jump to T-Mobile instead of them, I can't do so because my phone has been interfered with.)
Updated: Call with Motorola and Sprint
Updated:
Call Motorola today, after frustrating call with Sprint. As soon as I mentioned about SIM Subsidiary Unlock for US GSM, I got transfered to a level II rep.
-The representative understood what I was asking for and he understood that I have my contract fulfilled with Sprint.
-He said that there are no reason why Sprint did not unlock the US GSM band. So he placed a 3 ways call to Sprint CSR. Again, Idio***t Sprint CSR said that the phone doesn't have the SIM card even though it's the World Phone and it can only be used in CDMA mode. Again I got frustrated and told the CSR that Motorola Photon operated on quad band GSM and CDMA. I have paid my ETF and I owned the phone, it does not belong to Sprint anymore and no one can tell which carrier should I use or locking me from using other and It's my property. I told her that I got the Motorola Representative online and would happy to talk to her. Motorola rep jump in and explained to her that it should work on GSM abroad and US. US carriers does operated on the same frequencies that described in Photon's specification. He asked the CSR if I am still in contract with Sprint? and Sprint CSR replied "NO". He asked did I pay my ETF and fulfilled my contract? She said "YES". He then tell her there should be no reason for Sprint not to provide the SIM Subsidiary unlock code for US GSM. He said there is no reason that I could not take my Photon to any CDMA or GSM provider US and Globally if the network supported the frequencies of the phone and use it. Here is the fun part: Sprint CSR then replied "His account no longer active and therefore I could not provide the unlock code" ??? huh ???
and yet my account with them still active but they could not find my phone? I then asked Sprint CSR: do you know what is the SIM Subsidiary unlock code is? and please do not mistaken with the MSL number. At this point both I and the Motorola Rep got tired. She then kept repeating that the phone is not active she can't do it.
I got frustrated, and said this "If I do not get this issue resolve by either Sprint or Motorola, I will complaint to BBB and FCC on both Sprint and Motorola". Sprint CSR said go ahead if I wanted to. Both I and Motorola say goodbye to her.
Motorola Rep, however understood what I am asking. He promised to call me back tomorrow with a solution, but first he needs to research with the technical team and higher management on the matter.
Well.. in my opinion, it's true that the SIM Subsidiary unlock code is the carriers responsibility. Phone Manufacture normally provided these with the phone. It's the carrier responsible to unlock the phone based on the contract agreement. I have experienced with AT&T and T-Mobile when asking for unlock code. They should provided to you when the contract is over or earlier depends on how good you are as customer to them.
Let wait and see if Motorola came up with something..If not I will file the complaint with BBB and FCC.
Even that now I don't use Photon (just got the huge Galaxy Note with AT&T) .. I am still pursuing this matter. No one can tell me what to do with thing that I owned as long as I don't use them illegally. hmmm
roadster92 said:
Updated:
Call Motorola today, after frustrating call with Sprint. As soon as I mentioned about SIM Subsidiary Unlock for US GSM, I got transfered to a level II rep.
-The representative understood what I was asking for and he understood that I have my contract fulfilled with Sprint.
-He said that there are no reason why Sprint did not unlock the US GSM band. So he placed a 3 ways call to Sprint CSR. Again, Idio***t Sprint CSR said that the phone doesn't have the SIM card even though it's the World Phone and it can only be used in CDMA mode. Again I got frustrated and told the CSR that Motorola Photon operated on quad band GSM and CDMA. I have paid my ETF and I owned the phone, it does not belong to Sprint anymore and no one can tell which carrier should I use or locking me from using other and It's my property. I told her that I got the Motorola Representative online and would happy to talk to her. Motorola rep jump in and explained to her that it should work on GSM abroad and US. US carriers does operated on the same frequencies that described in Photon's specification. He asked the CSR if I am still in contract with Sprint? and Sprint CSR replied "NO". He asked did I pay my ETF and fulfilled my contract? She said "YES". He then tell her there should be no reason for Sprint not to provide the SIM Subsidiary unlock code for US GSM. He said there is no reason that I could not take my Photon to any CDMA or GSM provider US and Globally if the network supported the frequencies of the phone and use it. Here is the fun part: Sprint CSR then replied "His account no longer active and therefore I could not provide the unlock code" ??? huh ???
and yet my account with them still active but they could not find my phone? I then asked Sprint CSR: do you know what is the SIM Subsidiary unlock code is? and please do not mistaken with the MSL number. At this point both I and the Motorola Rep got tired. She then kept repeating that the phone is not active she can't do it.
I got frustrated, and said this "If I do not get this issue resolve by either Sprint or Motorola, I will complaint to BBB and FCC on both Sprint and Motorola". Sprint CSR said go ahead if I wanted to. Both I and Motorola say goodbye to her.
Motorola Rep, however understood what I am asking. He promised to call me back tomorrow with a solution, but first he needs to research with the technical team and higher management on the matter.
Well.. in my opinion, it's true that the SIM Subsidiary unlock code is the carriers responsibility. Phone Manufacture normally provided these with the phone. It's the carrier responsible to unlock the phone based on the contract agreement. I have experienced with AT&T and T-Mobile when asking for unlock code. They should provided to you when the contract is over or earlier depends on how good you are as customer to them.
Let wait and see if Motorola came up with something..If not I will file the complaint with BBB and FCC.
Even that now I don't use Photon (just got the huge Galaxy Note with AT&T) .. I am still pursuing this matter. No one can tell me what to do with thing that I owned as long as I don't use them illegally. hmmm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should have asked to speak to a manager while you had the rep on the phone. Btw was the rep you spoke with American or foreign to america in accent? No offence to foreign call centers but they are way to close to their sprint handbook. I have dealt with sprint several times and every time I called except twice I got an American who was extremely helpful and have even done things for me without question. The two times I got a foreign call center, I was placed on hold several times, spoke to several different people about my issue and then finally after nearly a 30 minute call they finally told me if I could pay ahead on a zero balance for future billing. Called back a few days later just to verify my answer and got an American first try and without hesitation new the answer and even said I could set up autopay to exceed the next months bill and whatever remaining balance I had would count as a credit towards the month after that. As with any device or technical question I have american call centers have always given a more straight forward answer without all the bull****.
I used to work for an ATT call center and we had to go to 3 months of training before we could start taking calls and then another 3 months of assisted training once on the phone. We had to learn every device they sold and had to know the entire book or they would not accept us on the floor. It payed very well for a call center so I understand why they would spend so much time making sure we knew what the hell we were talking about. Sometimes you have slackers that someone get through training but I can verify that foreign call centers only have to go through ONE day of training before taking calls and only have ONE superviser per 40+ reps as to American call centers have around 10 supervisors to every 40 reps plus supers have to going to more intense training to better assist customers. They can even provide us with an ATT or T-Mobile unlock code even if the phone is not active.
Sent from my Photon Q using ultramegaextremeXDA
Previous call did get to a supervisor and manager with Sprint. No help at all. Second call was 3 ways call with Motorola, Sprint and me. And I am kinda surprised at the second call where the Sprint CSR did not even call a Manager or Supervisor... and she has the nerve tell me go ahead with the complaint to BBB and FCC. Wow, I guessed she did not care. So the Motorola Rep decided to say goodbye to the Sprint CSR so he can get on with my issue. I think he is also frustrated at the Sprint CSR too. Let wait and see how this play out.
roadster92 said:
Previous call did get to a supervisor and manager with Sprint. No help at all. Second call was 3 ways call with Motorola, Sprint and me. And I am kinda surprised at the second call where the Sprint CSR did not even call a Manager or Supervisor... and she has the nerve tell me go ahead with the complaint to BBB and FCC. Wow, I guessed she did not care. So the Motorola Rep decided to say goodbye to the Sprint CSR so he can get on with my issue. I think he is also frustrated at the Sprint CSR too. Let wait and see how this play out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ive complained to the FCC and BBB twice in the past year about Sprint and both times Sprint's reply has pretty much been "f**k you".
Sprint in general doesn't care about FCC or BBB complaints.
CSRs definitely do not - since those complaints are not tied back to the CSR and never impact their metrics.
Also, I've never had a CSR volunteer to get a supervisor involved - I've always had to ask. And whenever I hear a canned phrase for the second time, I do ask to speak with a supervisor.
I dont think Sprint cares about much except whether or not your bill is late.
MadFlava said:
I dont think Sprint cares about much except whether or not your bill is late.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite true.
I thought the photon was locked in the radio software to ignore the gsm signals from att and t mobile in the usa. The Sim unlock wouldn't really do anything because the software on the phone would still ignore the Sim card because it isn't setup to use the Sim card in the usa. I think you are kinda **** out of luck. There are numerous posts about this issue already and from what i understand it will not work here in the usa with gsm
Sent from my MB855 using Tapatalk 2
abrcrmdl23 said:
I thought the photon was locked in the radio software to ignore the gsm signals from att and t mobile in the usa. The Sim unlock wouldn't really do anything because the software on the phone would still ignore the Sim card because it isn't setup to use the Sim card in the usa. I think you are kinda **** out of luck. There are numerous posts about this issue already and from what i understand it will not work here in the usa with gsm
Sent from my MB855 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know it doesn't work with GSM band here in the US. My argument is that I am off contract and fully paid for the phone, therefore I should get those GSM US band unlock. It's not a sprint phone... It's my phone and I paid for it.
I agree with you but the gsm is not locked to sprint..its blocked in rom from the us gsm network...this requires an update to the the radio rom firmware....real world it can be done...but sprint and motorolla will fight it every step of the way...make bet the moto rep that backed you will get an ass chewing from moto managment if they here about it...
It this case they look at a firmware update to turn on hardware parts of the phone as a hardware upgrade..
But again real work kdd japans photon is the same hardware as a sprint photon...replace the sprint firmware with kdd firmware (really just the radio firmware)..and your phone would work with us gsm..may not work with sprint but would work us gsm..
But for that you need to know how to upgrade the rom and have the right rom and sprint and moto are not going to tell you
Sent from my MB855 using XDA
Have you heard back from Motorola yet?
Sent from my Photon Q using ultramegaextremeXDA
Motorola give me the feedback, but it's not good. Generally, I think he got chewed by his higher up. He said he understood that I am gone through, and the only way to get unlock is to have Sprint approval. He explained to me that the lock is in the lower level programming and it is needed to get approved by Motorola. He said really sorry that he could not help more. He have asked me to pursue whatever course it takes to get Sprint authorized.
I felt that this is the first time he step on something like this. Poor guy, he doesn't sound enthusiastic as he did when he first spoke with me.
In any case, I will file the complaint through BBB and see how Sprint response. Heck I don't even need the phone now, and about to list and sell on Ebay.
I just got my Galaxy Note (huge phone) with AT&T and I like it. I think in the past of couple of years , Samsung finally improve their product.
roadster92 said:
I just got my Galaxy Note (huge phone) with AT&T and I like it. I think in the past of couple of years , Samsung finally improve their product.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you like it over the Photon?
roadster92 said:
Heck I don't even need the phone now, and about to list and sell on Ebay.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am looking for a cheap one for my wife. What do you want for it?
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
Here is the ABC News link:
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/now-illegal-unlock-cellphone/story?id=18319518
I just want to clarify that
I am not trying to "sensationalize" the issue.
I am not trying to pass on "misinformation."
I don't write for ABC.
I don't write legislation.
I don't vote on the passage of legislation.
I am merely sharing a link on a story that you will see sooner or later.
At least now you can say you saw it first on XDA!
DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER.
Please hit the "Thanks" button.
A link has been added to sign a petition if you are interested. It requires a "White House DOT Gov Account." Why?" Big Brother, probably.
I am not afilliated with the Federal Government,
I am not afilliated with any State Government,
I am not afilliated with Law Enforcement,
IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.
I'm just a regular dude trying to make a positive, informative contribution to the community which I love so much and am very greatful and appreciative for ALL of the contributors, and everyone who shares. Where would we be without the Devs? Running STOCK, UNROOTED!
The petiton link was found via www.phonearena.com.
White House Petition:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-unlocking-cell-phones-legal/1g9KhZG7
Let us expand on the sensationalistic thread title, as many will not click through to see the real story, shall we?
Unauthorized subsidy unlocks performed without the consent of the carrier, return to being illegal under the DMCA today.
This does not mean that AT&T or T-Mobile won't or cannot provide unlocks, although it could mean that they might become less likely to do so during the period between the user purchasing the device at new line or upgrade pricing and the contract period expiring or an ETF being paid.
Re: Carrier Unlocking Your Cellphone ILLEGAL As Of TODAY
It is not illegal to unlock my phone, like you said. It is for phones purchased after today.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda app-developers app
PaulF8080 said:
It is not illegal to unlock my phone, like you said. It is for phones purchased after today.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, you misread it. If your phone was unlocked as of today then you are grandfathered in. If it is not unlocked then it is illegal for you to unlock it without the consent of the carrier.
Edit: My apologies PaulF8080 as you are correct and the story in the first post is not written correctly.
Re: Carrier Unlocking Your Cellphone ILLEGAL As Of TODAY
*cough cough*
Ebay *cough*
*cough*
............................*sneeze*
Sent from my SGH-T879 using xda premium
This may just drive up the prices of unlocked phones on eBay. Still curious to know how carriers will know if your phone was unlocked yesterday or tomorrow. I tend to use Canadian unlocked phones anyways.
Agoattamer said:
No, you misread it. If your phone was unlocked as of today then you are grandfathered in. If it is not unlocked then it is illegal for you to unlock it without the consent of the carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is misinformation.
Any phone bought before today can be carrier unlocked, legally. And then there is the fact that the carriers are not really on a witch hunt to find anyone anyway. At least not yet.
Seems that story in the first post may be incorrect. You are correct kimtyson.
Unlocking phones without the express consent of the carrier who locked them became illegal thanks to edits to DMCA exemptions back in October, but it's only now that the 90-day grace period is running out. Locked phones purchased in the 90 days after the ruling are still game to be unlocked, but from here on out, for an unlocked phone to be legitimate, it'll have to have been bought that way or come with a permission slip from your carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Taken from: http://gizmodo.com/5978982/unlocking-your-phone-is-illegal-starting-tomorrow
DELETED -(addendum to title description)
Re: Carrier Unlocking Your Cellphone ILLEGAL As Of TODAY
It should be illegal when/if you still have contract or the phone is on EIP. other that it should be fine because you own the phone and you can do what u you want with the phone
granted it maybe, but when I saw the article, I went on to ATT chat this morning and unlocked my wife's SIII. Did my replacement note about 3 weeks back. Both phones under original 24 month contract, mine 8 months since upgrade, wife's about 6 months since her upgrade, both subsidized by the way......
Re: Carrier Unlocking Your Cellphone ILLEGAL As Of TODAY
How in the world are people going to enforce this?
Sent from my GT-P7510 using xda premium
tigeryee said:
How in the world are people going to enforce this?
Sent from my GT-P7510 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually pretty simple, service provides will no longer unlock your phone and the pay for folks will charge four times the amount, because that is what the service providers will charge them. Not hard at all.
Agoattamer said:
This may just drive up the prices of unlocked phones on eBay. Still curious to know how carriers will know if your phone was unlocked yesterday or tomorrow. I tend to use Canadian unlocked phones anyways.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nah, I don't think so...Apparently, it is still legal to unlock your phone if you bought it used.
Gizmodo said:
Legacy phones, i.e. "used (or perhaps unused) phones previously purchased or otherwise acquired by a consumer" are still cool to unlock, and that definition has a little bit of play in it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Re: Carrier Unlocking Your Cellphone ILLEGAL As Of TODAY
My opinion... If I want to unlock my phone fully (and the option to do so exists) I'm going to do it. It's not like I can jump carriers & not pay the ETF before the contract is up.
Just another example of crap legislation from D.C. morons.
Sent from my Thunderbolt using one opposable thumb.
This contradicts legislation already in place called fair use, which means if you buy a phone outright (no contract or used), you are free to modify it any way you please.
That law came as a result of class action against at&t and the iphone.
If you buy a phone at a subsidized price through a contract/upgrade, you break the law for flashing non-carrier software. The carrier still owns the phone until you pay it off.
Throwing a bone into the equation. For example, look at all the used ATT Notes that are for sale at this moment. I would say most of those are still involved with a subsidized 2 year contract. So how would future purchases like this be handled? I wonder if IMEI codes will have to be released before they can become unlocked. That would be the only way to run checks on this.
All I can say about that is a web service chat session with at&t gets you the code.
gibbsrob said:
Here is the ABC News link:
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/now-illegal-unlock-cellphone/story?id=18319518
I just want to clarify that
I am not trying to "sensationalize" the issue.
I am not trying to pass on "misinformation."
I don't write for ABC.
I don't write legislation.
I don't vote on the passage of legislation.
I am merely sharing a link on a story that you will see sooner or later.
At least now you can say you saw it first on XDA!
DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER.
Please hit the "Thanks" button.
A link has been added to sign a petition if you are interested. It requires a "White House DOT Gov Account." Why?" Big Brother, probably.
I am not afilliated with the Federal Government,
I am not afilliated with any State Government,
I am not afilliated with Law Enforcement,
IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.
I'm just a regular dude trying to make a positive, informative contribution to the community which I love so much and am very greatful and appreciative for ALL of the contributors, and everyone who shares. Where would we be without the Devs? Running STOCK, UNROOTED!
The petiton link was found via www.phonearena.com.
White House Petition:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-unlocking-cell-phones-legal/1g9KhZG7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lmao You guys think there going to approve this and make it legal again?
T-Mobile and AT&T are the ones who created to make the idea of unlocking illegal and presented it to the Congress. I don't see them making this legal again. Obviously its a monopoly.
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda premium
This seems like it's aimed at people who are selling unlocked phones in higher numbers - it's not illegal to call up your carrier, request the unlock code, and unlock the phone, yesterday or today or whenever. It's only illegal if they say "no" and you go ahead and unlock it by some other means.
IMO, this is aimed for iPhone users - my phone took me 5 minutes to unlock, since I happened to have a SIM from another carrier. iPhones need to go through some big process to unlock, even officially. I asked for my wife's unlock code for her phone, and they gave this whole list of instructions, which included 24-48 hour wait for the code to be obtained, or something.
If I had to go through that with the Note, I might think about unlocking it by some other means as well, especially if I'm just trying to sell it.
EveryOne Petition the obama administration to: Make Unlocking Cell Phones Legal
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Petition the obama administration to: Make Unlocking Cell Phones Legal.
The Librarian of Congress decided in October 2012 that unlocking of cell phones would be removed from the exceptions to the DMCA.
As of January 26, consumers will no longer be able unlock their phones for use on a different network without carrier permission, even after their contract has expired.
Consumers will be forced to pay exorbitant roaming fees to make calls while traveling abroad. It reduces consumer choice, and decreases the resale value of devices that consumers have paid for in full.
The Librarian noted that carriers are offering more unlocked phones at present, but the great majority of phones sold are still locked.
We ask that the White House ask the Librarian of Congress to rescind this decision, and failing that, champion a bill that makes unlocking permanently legal.
Created: Jan 24, 2013
Issues: Civil Rights and Liberties, Consumer Protections, Technology and Telecommunications
Learn about Petition Thresholds
It's up to you to build support for petitions you care about and gather more signatures. A petition must get 150 signatures in order to be publicly searchable on WhiteHouse.gov.
Over time, we may need to adjust the petition signature thresholds, but we'll always let you know what the thresholds are.
Signatures needed by February 23, 2013 to reach goal of 100,00087,845
Total signatures on this petition12,155.
PLEASE GO SIGN IT MAKE YOUR VOICE HEARD
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/pet...legal/1g9KhZG7
Thanks
I wouldn't ask that _uck up for a glass of water if I was dying of thirst. And why would you want to expand his fingers of incompetence to include your cell?
Umm, why post this? I don't see that it is a huge deal. All this states is that you can no longer buy a phone from (for example) Verizon and take it to MetroPC or some other carrier and unlock it to use with their service.
Most phones now are global ready, and if you buy a Nexus from Google it is unlocked for you to use as desired.
This is NOT saying that rooting or unlocking your bootloader is illegal. So again, I don't see why it is such a huge deal.
jonathon1289 said:
Umm, why post this? I don't see that it is a huge deal. All this states is that you can no longer buy a phone from (for example) Verizon and take it to MetroPC or some other carrier and unlock it to use with their service.
Most phones now are global ready, and if you buy a Nexus from Google it is unlocked for you to use as desired.
This is NOT saying that rooting or unlocking your bootloader is illegal. So again, I don't see why it is such a huge deal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. You'll do what you want to anyway...or atleast I will lol
Plus I think the president has bigger issues to tackle quite frankly
sent from my Note 2
Kinda thought the same thing. Not really a big deal. It's my impression that this is mainly to curb abuse by people who get the phone, unlock them and resell them. Giving authorities a way to prosecute those that fit that category ( that essentially fraud the subsidy that carriers provide)
Sent from my SCH-I605
Lol, you can always buy a phone from your new carrier...? It's not like they are banning cell phones.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda app-developers app
purged363506 said:
Kinda thought the same thing. Not really a big deal. It's my impression that this is mainly to curb abuse by people who get the phone, unlock them and resell them. Giving authorities a way to prosecute those that fit that category ( that essentially fraud the subsidy that carriers provide)
Sent from my SCH-I605
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a civil/contract matter between the carrier and the person that did that. The problem I have is that the dcma law is being turned on its head to help the carriers with this issue. I support the carriers in getting what is due to them but I object to them abusing the law.
TonikJDK said:
That's a civil/contract matter between the carrier and the person that did that. The problem I have is that the dcma law is being turned on its head to help the carriers with this issue. I support the carriers in getting what is due to them but I object to them abusing the law.
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If you have paid your ETF and/or finished your contract, why would it stop them from unlocking it?
They know they won't keep you by not doing it, and they certainly don't have use of the phone being locked in.
I think things are being blown out of proportion.
I think the real loud ones against this law are just upset that they can no longer default on a contract and sell the device unlocked on another carrier.
OP just wanted to start a political flame thread. Congrats. Mission will be accomplished.
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http://m.androidcentral.com/what-you-need-know-abut-cell-phone-unlocking
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People that know that they will need an unlocked phone because they will be traveling will either already have one, or go into the store with the intention of buying an unlocked phone for that exact purpose.
I personally don't see the big issue about this new law. If you know you're going to be traveling abroad and need an unlocked phone, then there are several to choose from on most carriers. Plain and simple.
TonikJDK said:
That's a civil/contract matter between the carrier and the person that did that. The problem I have is that the dcma law is being turned on its head to help the carriers with this issue. I support the carriers in getting what is due to them but I object to them abusing the law.
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I don't think you realize how hard it is to get new laws enacted. That's why so many existing ones are modified.
You think they are going to go after John Smith that unlocks his phone cause he got a new job traveling? That would be a PR nightmare.
Now Johnny Mule that does it to every major carrier around then sells the phone after to support whoever told him to do it.....Sure.
What about the shops that deal in stolen phones but they are unlocked for other carriers? Contrary to popular opinion, those databases are rubbish and fragmented.
There are quite a few ways that this could help criminal prosecution where right now there is very little.
Sent from my SCH-I605
Starting this weekend it is illegal to unlock new phones to make them available on other carriers. Seriously: It’s embarrassing and unacceptable that we are at the mercy of prosecutorial and judicial discretion to avoid the implementation of draconian laws that could implicate average Americans in a crime subject to up to a $500,000 fine and up to five years in prison.
When did we decide that we wanted a law that could make unlocking your smartphone a criminal offense? The answer is that we never really decided. Instead, Congress passed the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) in 1998 to outlaw technologies that bypass copyright protections. In practice it has terrible, and widely acknowledged, negative consequences that affect consumers and new innovation. The DMCA leaves it up to the Librarian of Congress (LOC) to issue exemptions from the law, exceptions that were recognized to be necessary given the broad language of the statute.
After Saturday it will be illegal to unlock a new smartphone, thereby allowing it to switch carriers. This is a result of the exception to the DMCA lapsing. It was not a mistake, but rather an intentional choice by the Librarian of Congress, that this was no longer fair use and acceptable.
Laws that can place people in jail should be passed by Congress, not by the decree of the Librarian of Congress. We have no way to hold the Librarian of Congress accountable for wildly unfair laws. There are still plenty of crazy laws passed by elected officials, but at least we can then vote them out of office.
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Source
For those who need to unlock your phone, you must now do it via your service carrier!
This is horiable
Just a few points I'd like to make that may clear up a few things.
When we get our phones on contract, we pay ~$200 or so for a $800 device. Cell companies subsidize our phones and don't want us buying at their low price then switching. From this point of view I could see it as a breach of contract, nothing more.
Also AFAIK, rooting your device is still perfectly fine. It's taking your ATT phone to, say, T-Mobile that's now illegal.
[If any of this information is incorrect, please post sources. The above is what I have gleaned from reading dozens of threads on this topic.]
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.
What about people who run this buissness?
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If you ask att for a code and say you're going overseas they almost always give it to you
Sent from my GS4 running CM11 Kandy Kane
IconRunner said:
Just a few points I'd like to make that may clear up a few things.
When we get our phones on contract, we pay ~$200 or so for a $800 device. Cell companies subsidize our phones and don't want us buying at their low price then switching. From this point of view I could see it as a breach of contract, nothing more.
Also AFAIK, rooting your device is still perfectly fine. It's taking your ATT phone to, say, T-Mobile that's now illegal.
[If any of this information is incorrect, please post sources. The above is what I have gleaned from reading dozens of threads on this topic.]
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.
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Rooting is still legal. It's actually protected by certain laws.
jthatch12 said:
Rooting is still legal. It's actually protected by certain laws.
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Rooting the phone is NOT illegal.
Rooting the tablet is illegal.
---------- Post added at 04:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:15 PM ----------
IconRunner said:
Just a few points I'd like to make that may clear up a few things.
When we get our phones on contract, we pay ~$200 or so for a $800 device. Cell companies subsidize our phones and don't want us buying at their low price then switching. From this point of view I could see it as a breach of contract, nothing more.
Also AFAIK, rooting your device is still perfectly fine. It's taking your ATT phone to, say, T-Mobile that's now illegal.
[If any of this information is incorrect, please post sources. The above is what I have gleaned from reading dozens of threads on this topic.]
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.
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How's about I pay $200 for the phone, sign and stay with provider for 2 years. After 2 years, isn't that my OWN phone? Why can't I unlock it and do whatever I want with it?
I think the title of the thread is poorly chosen.
1) The new law applies to phones purchased after January 26th 2013, hence phones purchased before this date are 100% okay to unlock.
2) Only applicable on US customers.
This law can be completely ignored by clients outside of the USA. (Apparently it is part of the DMCA ruling)
There is an online petition to the white house to stay the order being run atm. (Mods should make that link/this post a sticky for the entire forum.. )
Vote to get yourself heard
spacescreamer said:
I think the title of the thread is poorly chosen.
1) The new law applies to phones purchased after January 26th 2013, hence phones purchased before this date are 100% okay to unlock.
2) Only applicable on US customers.
This law can be completely ignored by clients outside of the USA. (Apparently it is part of the DMCA ruling)
There is an online petition to the white house to stay the order being run atm. (Mods should make that link/this post a sticky for the entire forum.. )
Vote to get yourself heard
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By my understanding, it is illegal to unlock your phone after 01/26 (or 27) regardless you bought the phone a year or 10 years ago, if you unlock it b4 the 26th, it's OK. It's not now.
Agreed with you on your 2)
spacescreamer said:
I think the title of the thread is poorly chosen.
1) The new law applies to phones purchased after January 26th 2013, hence phones purchased before this date are 100% okay to unlock.
2) Only applicable on US customers.
This law can be completely ignored by clients outside of the USA. (Apparently it is part of the DMCA ruling)
There is an online petition to the white house to stay the order being run atm. (Mods should make that link/this post a sticky for the entire forum.. )
Vote to get yourself heard
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Click to collapse
Got my vote! :good:
votinh said:
By my understanding, it is illegal to unlock your phone after 01/26 (or 27) regardless you bought the phone a year or 10 years ago, if you unlock it b4 the 26th, it's OK. It's not now.
Agreed with you on your 2)
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This is my understanding also. They can't magically say everyone that has an unlocked phone before 1/26 is now a felon... I'm just glad that I had my phone unlocked before all this **** went down. I'm heading to England in a few months
You can still legally get unlock codes from the carrier (AT&T for us). The law speaks about subsidized phones. It is legal to purchase an unlocked phone, usually for full retail price. Also, it is unclear whether a phone is still legally considered subsidized after your two year contract ends. I can't seem to find anything on that.
creepyncrawly said:
You can still legally get unlock codes from the carrier (AT&T for us). The law speaks about subsidized phones. It is legal to purchase an unlocked phone, usually for full retail price. Also, it is unclear whether a phone is still legally considered subsidized after your two year contract ends. I can't seem to find anything on that.
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This law is going to get complicated real fast Lol.
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creepyncrawly said:
it is unclear whether a phone is still legally considered subsidized after your two year contract ends. I can't seem to find anything on that.
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That shouldnt be the case. I mean after the contract ends.. the company would have got the revenue back from the customer.
So that shouldnt stand in the way of getting it unlocked afterwards. If it does.. it ll be a very stupid 'boot hang' for the end customer
Btw, can non American citizens vote on that petition ? And if yes, Will it count ?
creepyncrawly said:
You can still legally get unlock codes from the carrier (AT&T for us). The law speaks about subsidized phones. It is legal to purchase an unlocked phone, usually for full retail price. Also, it is unclear whether a phone is still legally considered subsidized after your two year contract ends. I can't seem to find anything on that.
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This would be the modern equivalent of holding your phone # hostage. If this is how they interpret the law, it will get smacked down. And as with most stupid laws (DMCA being a big one), the illegality will be truly defined by prosecution/enforcement.
Saurik (the guy who develops Cydia for the iPhone) said it was if you bought the phone after the cutoff date.
I'm more inclined to believe him.
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Although I do not reside in usa, however this doesn't seem fair.
The customer buys a phone on contract. He decodes to use it on other networks. The phone is subsidized by the network operator thus they do not want to loose u.
But let's say I bought the phone on contact and wanted to use it on other networks.. correct me if I'm wrong.. I still need to continue paying the network provider because there is a contract on it. So what's there to loose for the operator? I'm still paying fees as dispicted in the contract.
What if I'm going abroad.. I can't use a local sim card? And forced to use roaming rates?
Sent from my GT-N7100
There are really two issues involved. For an individual to unlock their own phone for their own use, the penalty would be civil only, and the maximum fine is $2,500. On the other hand, to buy phones, unlock them and then resell them would be a criminal offence, with penalty of 500,000 or 5 years, or both for the first offense, 1,000,000 or 10 years for any additional offensees.
Several commentators feel that if the personal use issue comes to court, the court would likely rule that the law is incorrect and be thrown out. But that remains to be seen. At least one commentator stated that if the phone is subsidized, it will be illegal to unlock it regardless of the state of the contract. It will be interesting to see how the law is interpreted over time.
From what I've read, the carriers are more interested in preventing the resale of unlocked phones.
vash_h said:
Although I do not reside in usa, however this doesn't seem fair.
The customer buys a phone on contract. He decodes to use it on other networks. The phone is subsidized by the network operator thus they do not want to loose u.
But let's say I bought the phone on contact and wanted to use it on other networks.. correct me if I'm wrong.. I still need to continue paying the network provider because there is a contract on it. So what's there to loose for the operator? I'm still paying fees as dispicted in the contract.
What if I'm going abroad.. I can't use a local sim card? And forced to use roaming rates?
Sent from my GT-N7100
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If you ask the carrier for an unlock code using say Skype they mostly say yes
Sent from my GS4 running CM11 Kandy Kane
122ninjas said:
If you ask att for a code and say you're going overseas they almost always give it to you
Sent from my GS4 running CM11 Kandy Kane
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Not always. They refused to give me a code for my Aria on three separate occasions. Seems to be dependent on the phone. Never bothered to call them for the S2, I'll unlock it with an app when I go to Europe or Asia next...
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
tedkunich said:
Not always. They refused to give me a code for my Aria on three separate occasions. Seems to be dependent on the phone. Never bothered to call them for the S2, I'll unlock it with an app when I go to Europe or Asia next...
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
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No harm in asking. I see success stories all the time
Sent from my GS4 running CM11 Kandy Kane
That's a bummer!
I hear it's just phones bought from Best Buy
iamnotexisting said:
I hear it's just phones bought from Best Buy
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According to this article (and others I have read), it isn't just on ones bought from Best Buy. It is "even" if you got it from BB, but also on ones from the Verizon stores. Looks like the unlock requires putting an active Verizon SIM in the device for anywhere from a couple of hours to overnight. If you don't care about unlocking the bootloader (or are willing to wait on an exploit that may never come), then this is bad news indeed if you want to be on a different carrier immediately. Bottom line, buy it from the Google Store and pay the premium or deal with big red's nonsense.
https://www.androidauthority.com/verizon-pixel-3-sim-locked-915857/
This might be an anti theft precaution. Here in Canada, phone must be sold unlock. The big three, due to these theft problems, ship all phones locked, then unlock them when sold.
https://www.droid-life.com/2018/10/19/verizon-stops-sim-locking-pixel-3-and-3-xl-for-now/
Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
This is why the last phone I purchased directly from VZW was the first Pixel XL. We got lucky and found an exploit. From that time forward, I refuse to by any VZW sold phones. I got my 2XL and 3XL direct from Google. They offer the same free 2 year interest free payments so to me, there is zero upside to buying a phone direct from VZW unless you plan to leave it totally stock.