Related
So, if rooting the g tablet is the way to go, it surely must stand up to a few simple speed checks. Has anyone posted various root's numbers or have some to post?
Stuff like, time to boot? Time to load common apps? Time to open the same web page? Frames on games? Time to download? Max browser pages open? Other relevant numbers welcome...
As far as I can tell, without any objective numbers comparing root performance, a lot of this rooting fad raves could just be subjective reported elation about being able to be different.
Granted, originally, the Gtab OS had some flaws. That's old news, get over it. How do the current roots compare with OTA version 3588? I'm somewhat shocked not one of the pack of geeks that have rooted their G tab hasn't backed up their raves with real numbers...
Granted, being rooted to the latest vegan might get access to the full Android market, and perhaps even future updates in Android... However, if I'm finding most of what I want at Amazon Android, is rooting worth the trouble until the roots and android versions stabilize? Show us the NUMBERS...!
I've been there done that with this subjective stuff long enough not to be swayed without real numbers...
Also, do any of these roots do OTA auto updates or do root updates require a download & re-root? Just asking...
Jesus christ if you can't do a simple search for benchmark tests then I highly suggest getting the ipad2. I hear that the ipad 2 reads your mind so out don't have to do any search. We've only had a kazillion threads on this.
Edit
This is not to mention all the YouTube vids on this people have posted.
Edit again.
Actually, here are a few.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1047098&highlight=benchmark+2011
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=12984546&postcount=9
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=12986416&postcount=10
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=12986416&postcount=10
Edit again.
I'm serious, I highly suggest the ipad 2 to everyone I talk to. Speaking as someone who repairs computers as a side job, I'm fully aware that most people want to be spoon fed everything, which is why the ipad 2 is the ideal device for most people. If people want to complain about nothing, let apple deal with them.
Thanks for the links.
However, as best as I can tell, they seem to verify that the OTA updated Gtablet is about the same speed as Vegan in the benchmarks when the CPU speeds are similar.
However, do the benchmarks used translate into much of relevance to speed of actually using the tablet to open programs, boot the tablet, download & open web pages. Stuff that people actually do with the tablet... Unless that's what the benchmarks are testing... But that info isn't provided in the links. Again -- weak...
The numbers and detail provided in these links deserve barely more than a C grade, if that... And what they provide seems to be at equal speeds, the current OTA updated gtab OS works fine... As long as you don't need the full Adroid market...
You Tube links? As best as I can tell, not one of them is an objective comparison with the OTA 3588 update gtab. They are just videos of vegan working... As far as real world numbers and comparisons -- Grade D-...
Where are the Grade A numbers? It's not that I don't believe the ROMs are not an improvement, it's just where are the numbers to support these raves?
What exactly are you looking for? There are no hard numbers when it comes to real world use, just your user experience versus mine.
You're not telling us what you want. You said you wanted numbers so I gave you a bunch. Then you say you don't want those numbers. So, I ask again. What do you want?
I'll be brutally honest on this one. Vegan isn't that fast. From all my tests, Calkulin+Clemsyn combo is by far the fastest custom rom+kernel for the gtab.
After trying out everything, I'm back to Calkulin+Clemsyn combo.
Would you like me to make a video of myself openning various programs and post it for you? What do you want?
I'm thinking you should drop that 'r' from your handle.
You also have a misconception of what rooting is/does.
To become root in Linux/Android is to gain administrative privileges. In windows root would be called Administrator. Gaining root privileges gives you the ability to change system files and settings, NOTHING MORE. By itself it does nothing.
Now boys...
The fact is that if you need numbers, reports,testimonials or anything else to justify mucking around with the gtab thenyou probably should just get an iPad. Nothing to prove then -everyone "knows" its the best-no numbers needed! The gtab is for people that don't mind the hardware and software quirks as long as they have the freedom to mess around. Its not about the numbers -its about the experience.
[Q] Why should we ..?!
Droofus said:
I've been there done that with this subjective stuff long enough not to be swayed without real numbers...
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Click to collapse
Well, I am not sure anyone here is trying to sway you in one direction or the others.
Here is how things go in community forums like this one:
- People search for what they got in mind first.
- If they didn't find its either undoable or not that interesting for the community that no one bothered doing it.
- In both case those people are expected to either drop whatever they are wishing for or pursuit it on there own and then share their findings with the community.
In other words, why the heck am I supposed to go beyond whatever benchmarks readily available on the market to show YOU how good/bad are custom firmwares compared to stock ones when :
- custom firmwares are volatile and each couple of days there is a new rom or rom add on or a kernel released (am I supposed to maintain the stats for every single update released ? else how meaningful would be my outdated stats to you? when it represents a ROM that is no longer a candidate)
- the whole flash back and forth and in between roms is a 10~20 minutes process of YOUR time which would suffice to answer all your questions.
If you still need some usability tests (you can use your own stop watch to time through the videos) you might want to check here.
Best of luck,
Zaphod-Beeblebrox said:
I'm thinking you should drop that 'r' from your handle.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this was the best answer.
The information you are demanding is indicating your ignorance. As was already stated rooting does nothing for performance. If you want numbers you can install each rom and test with each kernel setting whatever your heart desires. Its not likely anyone else even cares as most people only care about stability and a lack of lag
Droofus said:
So, if rooting the g tablet is the way to go, it surely must stand up to a few simple speed checks. Has anyone posted various root's numbers or have some to post?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rooting itself does nothing other than giving you root - the speed of your device before and after rooting is identical.
Now, if you want to talk about the speeds with or without an overclocked kernel, or with a custom Froyo vs custom Ginger vs stock rom, as others have said there are plenty of posts out there.
Mine lasted on the stock rom for exactly one boot after opening the box - so I could copy on the bits to begin the rooting/custom rom flashing goodness.
cu_ninja said:
What exactly are you looking for? There are no hard numbers when it comes to real world use, just your user experience versus mine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I'm looking for is defined, at least in part, in the first post. Copy and pasted here for your convenience.
Stuff like, time to boot? Time to load common apps? Time to open the same web page? Frames on games? Time to download? Max browser pages open? Other relevant numbers welcome...
If I go to a notebookcheck.net/Computer-Games-on-Laptop-Graphic-Cards, the various card performances in various games are reviewed. The reviews are very professionally and objectively done with detail. Clicking on any specific card opens a detailed review of that card. This allows users to make decisions based upon what sorts of (graphic game) uses they might actually have.
It seems a similar but much smaller objective set of benchmarks could be performed on the various g tablet roots using a set of common uses in part noted above. It doesn't need to be as elaborate or detailed as the video card review site noted above. Just objectively testing a few simple end user tasks would seem to be adequate to get beyond the subjective raves that one commonly sees about this or that OS change...
FYI, part of this is related to my background as a doctor (plus a computer background dating back beyond the Apple II to programming FORTRAN and COMPASS on mainframes in the 1960s). As doctors we are constantly bombarded with all sorts of anecdotal raves about this or that treatment all the time, only to find that they aren't supported by actual objective research -- some cause harm, not healing. Fortunately for those promoting software changes related to raves and fads don't have the potential to cause anyone significant harm... Excuse me if I'd like to see similar objective professional 'standards of care' when it comes to reviewing and analyzing software/hardware fads. I'm sure there are plenty of others in the audience who'd feel the same...
So is this a religious thread, I see Jesus was mentioned.
Actually sometimes you modders act like it.
I'll get the other times later. Here is the startup time.
Droofus said:
FYI, part of this is related to my background as a doctor (plus a computer background dating back beyond the Apple II to programming FORTRAN and COMPASS on mainframes in the 1960s). As doctors we are constantly bombarded with all sorts of anecdotal raves about this or that treatment all the time, only to find that they aren't supported by actual objective research -- some cause harm, not healing. Fortunately for those promoting software changes related to raves and fads don't have the potential to cause anyone significant harm... Excuse me if I'd like to see similar objective professional 'standards of care' when it comes to reviewing and analyzing software/hardware fads. I'm sure there are plenty of others in the audience who'd feel the same...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, while I can see your point, I also have to point out the other side of the argument. I am an engineer. Last year, we got a college graduate who, from the outlook, had all the numbers and credentials. He graduated with almost a perfect gpa. Sounds nice, right? He had all the numbers. The problem was as soon as he began working with us we figured out very quickly that we had a book smart-absolutely no common sense person with us. I swear, he pulled me aside one time and asked me why they were "watering the concrete slabs" in the lab. It got worse from there. I had to explain to him very basic engineering concepts and applications like stirrups, slippage, etc.
This guy actually went through college getting the grades and everything without actually understanding any of it. He graduated with a structural engineering degree without knowing the very simple practical processes of curing concrete or reinforcing footings.
The point is numbers can be deceiving if you ignore annecdotal (aka common sense) evidence. You need both objective numbers and common sense to work in reality. Sure, I've heard plenty of annecdotal nonsense like creationist BS, religious miracles, and homeopathic crap. I'll give you that. But you seem to be on the other extreme side, which is to ignore all personal evidence and place all your bets on pure numbers.
I'm telling you now. We got both the numbers and personal evidence. I'll try to get them for you.
Doofus
I like the list of missing benchmarks you listed. Why don't you measure them and report back?
Droofus said:
What I'm looking for is defined, at least in part, in the first post. Copy and pasted here for your convenience.
Stuff like, time to boot? Time to load common apps? Time to open the same web page? Frames on games? Time to download? Max browser pages open? Other relevant numbers welcome...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All those numbers are identical before and after rooting your device since nothing changes before and after root, other than you now have root access.
That was easy.
1
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Theres some more random numbers
While watching everyone bash eachother here has its entertainment i have some advice.
Droofus
1 i would recomend not comming into a community forum and bashing people who put a lot of effort into making the product you own better. These people don't get paid for the hours of work they put in.
2 if you don't like how thing are done around here take the time to be a good example and do it better. You clearly have an idea in your head on how to make a professional stastical representation of the roms so do it.
3 what some people are trying to tell you is that it is not all about the numbers. Some people want gingerbread features. Right now all of the gingerbread roms suck for video performance due to driver issues so i don't use them. I like the gingerbread features but i watch videos a lot so i use a froyo rom. Others really care about performance so they give up some stability and overlock.
4 people around here get upset when the same question gets asked over and over again. If you have done some reasearch reference other articles to show that.
5 this is a dual core tablet, what are you doing that you care that much about preformance.
This thing is faster than my netbook.
6 dropping your title on us just makes you sound pretentious. There are a lot of very intellgent successful people here who are not impressed by doctors or your past experience. If you have useful skills to the community don't brag just use them and people will be grateful.
7 people were a little rude about it but they are right. I tell people that if they want something that is easy go buy an ipad or a xoom. If you want something for under 300 then buy a g tab and understand that with some effort it can be great.
Everyone
1 relax... starting flame wars with someone who doesn't know their way around isn't going to help anyone.
I forgot to mention that traditionally us geeks are known for our lack of formal documentation.
P.s. while many of us proudly wear the badge of geek calling us a pack of geeks is a little adversarial.
Hello has anyone used the money toolkit app to access your account?. On my iphone I have an official natwest app, which am sure is safe however a bit worried about this one cause it clearly states not affiliated with any bank.
Hi marvi0
I am Dan - founder of Money Toolkit, so obviously my opinion is not impartial
You are absolutely right to question apps like ours, and I wish more people were more diligent in this resect.
The biggest barrier to using any third party financial app is trust. For a small start up like ours, theres a bit of a catch 22 thing. The best way for people to trust our app is to see others using it, which means having enough early trail blazers use it.
I hope you do read some of the pages on our site regarding security - we have gone to very great lengths to keep you in charge of your credentials.
But this is still only our word. Probably the best thing to help increase your confidence is to look on our get satisfaction pages - (we cant delete messages, so it is an open conversation). Also check the comments on the Android market, again we can't even respond as the developer (which can be frustrating).
I hope others do respond on here, though we only have 500+ active users, so I would be a bit surprised.
There will always be some nervousness committing to our app, ultimately you have to go with your instincts - most people who see our app don't go on to enter their details, which is a shame in my opinion (obviously), because those who do find our app really useful.
Any questions, just ask.
Cheers.
Dan.
I have installed it and it looks pretty good
I have my fingers crossed regarding the security
Thanks for your reply so does this app actually allow me to view my natwest account information?
marvi0 said:
Thanks for your reply so does this app actually allow me to view my natwest account information?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it does yeah
you get an overview and then when you click on the account it drills down into the transactions
you cant see direct debits etc
also i wish you could change the theme, the wooden effect is a bit yukky, lol
but it does the job fine
also you have to manually log out or the app will run in the background, and if someone picks up your phone they can see the bank funds etc
winwiz - thanks for that.
You are not alone a few people don't like the wooden theme, so we are thinking of changing that.
The idea was that it continues the web site theme of being a work bench - continuing to follow the tool kit idea! We also didn't want to look like another boring bank, but probably it doesn't work that well on the phones.
Regarding logging out - we keep you logged in on purpose, (it will time out after 5 minutes) it is really annoying when you accidentally go back too far or want to swap to another app and have to log back in. Perhaps we should make that another setting?
some people even choose to keep their password remembered, and rely on the phones own security.
Remember this is a READ ONLY app, there is absolutely no way anyone could transfer funds, or make any changes to your bank.
We've got some nice things planned, like categorising your sending and graphs etc.
So any feedback or ideas really welcome - especially on the get satisfaction pages
Cheers.
MTK-Dan said:
winwiz - thanks for that.
You are not alone a few people don't like the wooden theme, so we are thinking of changing that.
The idea was that it continues the web site theme of being a work bench - continuing to follow the tool kit idea! We also didn't want to look like another boring bank, but probably it doesn't work that well on the phones.
Regarding logging out - we keep you logged in on purpose, (it will time out after 5 minutes) it is really annoying when you accidentally go back too far or want to swap to another app and have to log back in. Perhaps we should make that another setting?
some people even choose to keep their password remembered, and rely on the phones own security.
Remember this is a READ ONLY app, there is absolutely no way anyone could transfer funds, or make any changes to your bank.
We've got some nice things planned, like categorising your sending and graphs etc.
So any feedback or ideas really welcome - especially on the get satisfaction pages
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Dan,
Thanks for the great feedback. I'd like the option to customise the background, or if this is not possible, a solid black background. The timeout option should be configurable so the user can set the timeout period!
I look forward to the updates
MTK-Dan said:
I am Dan - founder of Money Toolkit, so obviously my opinion is not impartial
...
Any questions, just ask.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Dan,
Was just deliberating about using Money Toolkit and I had a couple questions. I've no knowledge in this area so please bare with me.
On the blog post here: hxxp://moneytoolkit.com/2010/09/secure-mobile-banking/
You said that:
"Yodlee then sells your bank data to the web site that you signed up".
Which I agree doesn't sound ideal - but they have to make money to be a sustainable business. How does money toolkit intend to make money? Which part of users financial details will be utilised to do this?
Secondly - regarding the security - the same blog post says:
"Not only would someone have to get access to your phone they would have to go to the same lengths as they would if they wanted to ‘hack’ into a bank, but they would have to do it three times!"
I presume that each location storing data can't login to the bank account in part. Instead a single server instance would have to login - requiring all 3 parts of the information to do so as banks usually randomise the questions asked. That presumption may be wrong however - but if it's correct does that mean a hacker could just hack that single server instance and intercept the traffic being sent to the bank?
You said that:
"Yodlee then sells your bank data to the web site that you signed up".
"but they have to make money to be a sustainable business. How does money toolkit intend to make money? Which part of users financial details will be utilised to do this?""
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We point out the normal relationship with Yodlee because Yodlee is an independant third party, they are the entity that you end up having the biggest contractual relationship with, in fact you sign over power of attourney to them when you use a web site that uses their aggregation (read the small print).
Regarding Money Toolkit making money, so far we don't! Of course, as you point out, we need to, so we have two options - we will ask for 50p per month (for example), or we will offer good deals with companies we trust (generally not main stream banking companies), where we will make a commission, if we do that we will make the commission obvious and share it with the person taking the offer.
"Secondly - regarding the security...
...does that mean a hacker could just hack that single server instance and intercept the traffic being sent to the bank?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well your main assumptions is correct, but the reasoning not quite right. Firstly it is not just because of the random nature of the security questions that the three way split is valuable, but literally each part is utterly useless without the other parts, they are three parts of an encrypted file, which MUST come together before it is possible to decrypt.
The decrypted file (now only in volatile memory) then returns values to your phone and it is your phone which sends (over SSL) the right request to the bank, so they would have to breach our own SSL traffic (and custom encryption). Our IP's and the bank's are hard coded so a traditional man in the midle attack is ruled out. They would in effect, have to dupe you into downloading a dodgy Money Toolkit apk for this to be possible.
As you may know, the huge majority of security problems come from static data being discoverable (cd's and memory sticks left on trains for example). In our case the three seperate locations, including your phone make this kind of static data recovery, all but impossible.
However... you are right tht if someone managed to compromise the individual server that, at that moment (we have many), did that specific decryption: then if they were very smart, they might have the ability to detect your secure bank details. Though it would be almost imposible for that to happen and us not know about it. To alter our code and not have our systems detect the intrusion would be phenomenal.
MTK-Dan said:
so we have two options - we will ask for 50p per month (for example), or we will offer good deals with companies we trust (generally not main stream banking companies), where we will make a commission, if we do that we will make the commission obvious and share it with the person taking the offer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great, both options sound reasonable
MTK-Dan said:
they are three parts of an encrypted file, which MUST come together before it is possible to decrypt.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Neat, didn't realise.
MTK-Dan said:
The decrypted file (now only in volatile memory) then returns values to your phone and it is your phone which sends (over SSL) the right request to the bank, so they would have to breach our own SSL traffic (and custom encryption).
They would in effect, have to dupe you into downloading a dodgy Money Toolkit apk for this to be possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That at least does sound secure (without understanding it more) I suppose there may also be security issues beyond a dodgy .apk file if the Android device has been rooted - because I think that allows apps to work outside of their sandbox. Again, I don't know enough about that.
Thanks for the detailed answers, it gives me more confidence in the service.
aph5 said:
Great, both options sound reasonable
Neat, didn't realise.
That at least does sound secure (without understanding it more) I suppose there may also be security issues beyond a dodgy .apk file if the Android device has been rooted - because I think that allows apps to work outside of their sandbox. Again, I don't know enough about that.
Thanks for the detailed answers, it gives me more confidence in the service.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it possible to transfer money to whomever you want with this app?
I need to find a very good DEV who is available to work on a fairly large project.
I am a disabled yet still serving soldier, who has a need for a specific app. This app will help millions of people and I DO plan to market it to both VETS and
NON Vet disabled persons (as well as anyone else who wants it!) Vets will of course have either a free or reduced price option.
You will be required to know every aspect of a project DEV to include the GUI, images, background, visual aid, the Database, it has to "share" and export to several mediums including googleCal and Excel graphs. It may be built with a module style or have a lot of options that can be turned on or off. Some will be protected so it can't be turned off unless a password is entered depending upon the level of disability and functions needed per person.
I will expect a non-disclosure agreement. I have done the paperwork to protect my idea.
I will expect timely completion of phases as well as bug fixes. All of which I am very realistic about. We just need to be in daily or even hourly communication if needed.
This is a long term project that can lead to a permanent type of side job for all the ongoing updates/changes.
I need to get this moving while I am still able to keep track of what I actually need it to do. Your development skills will be instrumental in getting this up and running. You will have full liberty to do the app as you see fit as long as it meets the needs and has the ability to do each task I need. I really don't care how it is done as long as the outcome is correct. I have certain tasks that must be included, you are more than welcome to add your ideas as well.
Payment is of course Negotiable as either upfront or a portion of future income from sales, or possibly both. This will be agreed upon in writing for everyones safety, but this will really be more of a friendly work together type of environment.
Please msg me or reply here for more details.
(Mods, if this is is the wrong category, I apologize. Just move me and I will learn my lesson!)
Must have placed this in the wrong area! I can't seem find a good developer in the entire world that wants to take on a very lucrative (possibly like all good ideas are) project??
Wow Ok anyone know where I should look or post my "Programmer wanted" ad?
You would probably be better posting it in the developer forums rather than Q & A.
Good luck with your project!
All the best,
Ash
(Survey Closed - Results Below)ASUS Prime Online Objective Survey & Results Review
Ok fellas,
I have constructed an online survey questionnaire as I have previously suggested here
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1707406&page=31
This way issues can be objectively collected and centralised – and if follow up is needed by ASUS. This online survey only serves to kickstart “things” in a more directional fashion, rather than the usual scattered complaints which are difficult to follow and sometime lead to a lot of duplications.
Hopefully we can get as many people to do this and we can get the general idea what is going on with our prime.
Also, if the data is useful enough, maybe we can get some of the guys in here who are close to asus to send them the data and hopefully they will do something about it. Or following the data collection, perhaps a second detailed survey can be collected to home in into issues that matter most to the end-users.
The link for the survey is here - And you can see the cumulative results at the end of the survey
https://kwiksurveys.com?s=MLKOKM_b334b37b
Note:
(1) At the end of the survey, the cumulative results are shown(hence instant result – no secret statistics to hide). And individual result is there for everyone to see and follow.
(2) Questions marked “*” are compulsory
(3) Please answer non-compulsory questions if possible so better picture can be drawn in the end
(4) If your cookie is enabled, you can change your answer after completing the questionnaire but only one survey is considered valid per ip address
(5) If you have suggestions on what other questions there are to add or details to add, pm me and I will change it. Or if you note any gross logical error in the construction of the questions, pm me.
Disclosure of interest:
I don't know anyone from ASUS. I neither work for ASUS nor have worked for ASUS and I don't work for rival companies. I am doing this as part of (or lack of) my contribution to this forum.
Update (20/06) - Survey is now closed See results review at post #23 #24 #25 #26 #27
all.pdf - all results to date (164 responses)
anyappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with ANY apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 1)
specificappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with SPECIFIC apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 2)
The results can be filtered against multiple criteria. If you have a request, tell me and I will do it at my earliest opportunity. Raw data can also be exported into xml/xls/csv format.
I filled out the survey. I want to give you a huge THANKS for doing this. And Asus should give you a free Infinity lol
Yuhfhrh said:
I filled out the survey. I want to give you a huge THANKS for doing this. And Asus should give you a free Infinity lol
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Click to collapse
No worry dude. Used to think that linux has mind of its own. But this thing is in a different league, seems like a living organism/psychopathic ex-gf to me. I am baffled.
maxfac1234 said:
No worry dude. Used to think that linux has mind of its own. But this thing is in a different league, seems like a living organism/psychopathic ex-gf to me. I am baffled.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That pretty much hits the nail on the head. This tablet is very temperamental. You never know how of is going to act when you boot it up.
cause to ponder
I have been in IT for 30 years now, and have used just about every device ever made or at least one representative sample. The only people I ever see complaining about devices are generally people who don't read up on them, load way too many conflicting apps into them, or try to do way too much, and complain because everything doesn't work - what I call "Swiss army knife syndrome". Most of the above can be attributed to pure inexperience. Of course statistically 5-10% of the people doing anything on the planet just aren't pleased with anything, so you have to take that number right off the top - they will never know how obstinate they are so don't bother. I have had very few problems with this device, and I do not consider myself lucky - just experienced. Great survey. I really hope it helps!
Some preliminary results
So far there 72 responses over the last almost 24hours – Which I think isn't bad.
(1) I have pasted the “compact” "raw" data in pdf form in the OP / post #1– And I will try to do this for every 50-response-increment. There are two files:
i. all the results
ii.the results filtered against those who have problems with ANR's/FC's with ANY apps at ANY duration (just to give you the idea and sample what the tabulated data look like) – Question #22 in the survey.
(Edit 1): I'd forgotten to click "expand" for the "text based input results" - In case you're wondering why they appear truncated.
(2) The result can be filtered – e.g. information "just from rooted users" or information "just from users who have x problem(s)" – If you want to view any data filtered with certain criteria, tell me and I will try to do it when I am free and post it here for everyone to follow up. Unfortunately the particular website I am using doesn't allow me to filter against serial number right now as it requires 4 alphanumerics in the filter field – However, the expanded raw data can be exported into csv/xml/xls format for anyone who is interested.
More inputs please.
@photogf4
Maybe you should beginning read some of the many treads about Primes problems and issues before you make a statement like yours. There is a VERY GOOD REASON why no one else still had a quad core tablet out for sale (including Asus themself !) Asus olso accept that they have problems with Prime .
Please notice; XDA people that have problems with Prime are NOT Android novices. I promise you, that they all have trying much, much more then normal customers will and can do to to find a solution on Primes very stranges behavior.
Wow, sorry... I didn't expect a guilty conscience so soon! I assure you i read xda nearly daily, and it is a fabulous reference with serious people serious about making these devices the best they can be. I am not trolling, just making an observation. I maintain that he 80% of people left need to ask themselves if they are causing their own problems before they skew the survey. Thanks to xda i have a cell that i can manage my entire company network with, and two tablets -101 and 201 that run flawlessly ( I gave my Apple tablet to someone else). Any problem I have ever had was my own fault, other than gps. I bought a few 201's for my staff, and they don't have problems either!! Don't blame the hardware until you look at the software.
An additional observation is that if no one on xda used the developers' product and discussed it here, this would be moot. Thu site needs users as well, and i appreciate the privilege.
photogf4 said:
I have been in IT for 30 years now, and have used just about every device ever made or at least one representative sample. The only people I ever see complaining about devices are generally people who don't read up on them, load way too many conflicting apps into them, or try to do way too much, and complain because everything doesn't work - what I call "Swiss army knife syndrome". Most of the above can be attributed to pure inexperience. Of course statistically 5-10% of the people doing anything on the planet just aren't pleased with anything, so you have to take that number right off the top - they will never know how obstinate they are so don't bother. I have had very few problems with this device, and I do not consider myself lucky - just experienced. Great survey. I really hope it helps!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So what your saying is Asus is sending out updates, gps dongles and rma's just for fun? 30 years in IT ....you might want to look into taking some refresher courses or perhaps a a new line of work.
Enough with the personal attacks... try and stay on topic!
The last four posts have gone waaayyy of topic. Please stay on topic which in this case is a user survey regarding problems people are having with the Prime, and please keep all comments constructive.
Thanks.
Good idea!
Just filled the survey! Thank you for your time!
I have a problem that I haven't solved yet, and I hope this survey helps in any way!
Thank you again!
PS: BTW, here's my problem explained http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1716591
Sorry about the post.
I did not mean to go off topic, but for anyone to come and deny that the Prime has no problems is just unrepresentative of the community as a whole. I do realize that some problems are user induced but most of these are well documented across many different user bases! If this were not so, we would not see ASUS patching and working with consumers on this somewhat personal level.
I have to believe with the data at hand that the problems lie in the manufacturing of the device or materials used. It looks like someone's quality assurance department fell asleep on the job, and now many people suffer from problems, and maybe even ASUS because one manufacturer let some bad material pass that should of been tested more thoroughly.
But hopefully, the data collected from this survey is pointing to some common things that many users are experiencing, which will be able to be addressed with new firmware and software. Thanks for creating the survey and I wish I could take it again because I did not know you had to save each page as you went along and only saved the last page, which did not let me see the current tally. Peace, V
@vvveith
I had a look at the survey again and how it works - You don't have to save each page as you go along - They are automatically saved - In the end, it should show you the cumulative results. But again there may be quirks that I am not aware of.
However, if you want to do it again and put some comments in - Just go to the same link and do it again - but from what I understood from the website that provide the service, each ip is logged to prevent multiple entries, so
(1) if you do it again (with your cookie previously enable and still available), then your result based on your ip will be changed accordingly (I have enabled this in the survey setting)
but
(2) if you do it again (with your cookie previously disabled or cookie is not available), then your survey input will just be rejected
(3) the other workaround is for you to hook onto your neighbour's free wifi or work's ip
(General) in any case, I will be updating the full unfiltered results soon. If you have a specific request, i.e. to have the results filtered against specific criteria, just make it known here and I will try do it.
Update 19/06
I've updated the survey results (see OP/post #1):
all.pdf - all results to date (127 responses)
anyappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with ANY apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 1)
specificappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with SPECIFIC apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 2)
A thought:
(1) A quick glance at these results shows some recurring themes in terms of the good, bad and ugly.
(2) This “to date/.28” survey not only shows magnitude of certain issues (evidenced by answers to compulsory questions on certain well known issues) but also shows some improvements in certain other areas (again evidenced by answers to compulsory questions and the free-text based inputs). However a quick glance also show some not-so-new minor issues which are still persistent (the list of these problems mostly in the free-text based inputs)
(3) If I understood some of the other posts in other threads correctly, the beta testers are testing .28.5 – This “to date/.28” survey will be a good baseline shall we all want to run a second survey.
(4) If a second survey is run (after .28.5 or newer that is), we can home in into bigger issues found in this survey with more details – and see where improvements/deteriorations occur in a more objective fashion. And at the same time assess the magnitude of minor issues listed in this survey by formalizing them into multiple choices.
Essentially, next categorization (based on usability with assumption “what lay people would possibly find frustrating” rather than pure technical aspect it) would be:
High frequency non-severe issue (e.g. gps, wifi intermittent dropping)
High frequency severe issue (e.g. severe wifi drops with distance, ANR's and FC's)
Low frequency non-severe issue (e.g. small number of specific apps with ANR's/FC's)
Low frequency severe issue (e.g sleep of death and failed update - ?semi brick)
Mystical issue
Have a look at the results.
maxfac1234 said:
I've updated the survey results (see OP/post #1):
all.pdf - all results to date (127 responses)
anyappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with ANY apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 1)
specificappfcanr.pdf - filtered against ANR's/FC's with SPECIFIC apps at ANY duration (just a sample idea 2)
A thought:
(1) A quick glance at these results shows some recurring themes in terms of the good, bad and ugly.
(2) This “to date/.28” survey not only shows magnitude of certain issues (evidenced by answers to compulsory questions on certain well known issues) but also shows some improvements in certain other areas (again evidenced by answers to compulsory questions and the free-text based inputs). However a quick glance also show some not-so-new minor issues which are still persistent (the list of these problems mostly in the free-text based inputs)
(3) If I understood some of the other posts in other threads correctly, the beta testers are testing .29 – This “to date/.28” survey will be a good baseline shall we all want to run a second survey.
(4) If a second survey is run (after .29 that is), we can home in into bigger issues found in this survey with more details – and see where improvements/deteriorations occur in a more objective fashion. And at the same time assess the magnitude of minor issues listed in this survey by formalizing them into multiple choices.
Have a look at the results.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually the new build I'm testing is .28.5 they could end up sending me an even newer one though.
demandarin said:
actually the new build I'm testing is .28.5 they could end up sending me an even newer one though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
woot woot *corrected. Thanks fella. Looking forward to the new build soon!
demandarin said:
actually the new build I'm testing is .28.5 they could end up sending me an even newer one though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And how's it looking so far?
Did the survey. Thanks for putting this together.
However, few suggestions:
- add SKU to the base questions
- add dock / no dock to the questions
- add no issue as a separate answer
- add common answers given as text as separate answer
... Just some ideas. Also, could you compile a comparison between root and stock?
Thank you.
Sent from my HTC Desire using xda premium
tobi01001 said:
Did the survey. Thanks for putting this together.
However, few suggestions:
- add SKU to the base questions
- add dock / no dock to the questions
- add no issue as a separate answer
- add common answers given as text as separate answer
... Just some ideas. Also, could you compile a comparison between root and stock?
Thank you.
Sent from my HTC Desire using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good ideas - all.
Also: SOD? I did not see it in the survey, and I am hit with it, lately VERY infrequently, but yes, I have had an SOD event (just a single occurrence) on .28
Though I wonder how to effectively track text based answers, they can provide additional dat that would otherwise not be picked up. I think this is an idea who's time has really arrived. Too many unscientific and off the cuff observations around these forums. Thank you very much for this. A good set of data, even with some margin of error is extremely valuable as a tool for some honest measurements in the field. I would venture to say that the respondents here are somewhat more "polarized" (to put it mildly) and that the BASIC group of non-techie Prime owners are, in many case not even AWARE that their tablet has issues, unless they are painful, or incapacitating is some noticeable way.
What has always been my biggest annoyance with the Prime is it's obvious lack of a major performance advantage over the OG Transformer, which I sold to buy this. Yes, it is slim, and pretty, and had all the ingredients for a technical slam-dunk. It has just never "wowed" me like I expected.
anyway, I got off subject there, or rather too detailed for this particular thread. I liked that the guy with the sensors issue simply linked to his thread, instead of going off all over the place like... er... well, like me, I guess. Sorry bout that. One thing you can NOT accuse Prime owners of is not being passionate about their tablets.
Thanks again for doing this. Perhaps a quick update after the ew firmware would be good as was suggested.
Hello, I am currently a privacy novice trying to learn about different avenues of where I can get help to better protect myself. I see apple devices and I like the fact that they have a closed ecosystem per device, but I don’t like the fact that they are all interconnected with each other; it freaks me out that someone else with an Apple device could very easily connect to mine. That’s why CalyxOS stood out to me, because what it looks like from the outside-in is a decentralized form of android device, without all of the Google strings attached. I’d honestly rather use it than Graphene, because the people over on the graphene forums are kinda toxic to be honest. I have no knowledge of how to install operating systems, however, and I’m afraid that I could easily screw it up. Does Calyx sell any Pixel 6/Pixel 6 Pro models that I could buy to get started?
Welcome. I'm probably a terrible example but oh well. I had time to kill and been stuck on this topic myself since the early 90s.
If you're serious about privacy to the point that you are worried about other devices as you mentioned, I highly suggest (seriously, not trying to be a ****) you take some online courses on the fundamentals of telecommunications, and do some "light" reading on topics likeLinux Kernel, enterprise networking, Signals Intelligence, and Section 215 metadata collection. thats a decent starting point to the state of things. Though it's just a shinny coin on a string to distract while the real work continues. It must always continue. It will never stop.
I'm sorry to tell you.
It's too late. In any practical sense short of finding somewhere to go love in a cave until you starve or die from a infection a 99¢ tube of cream could have prevented.
You can have a privacy focused phone. It can keep certain things safe. Stop some people from doing things. Delay an outcome. You're gonna need to learn about installing an OS though. It gets pretty complex rather quickly.
Nothing is safe. Every lock can be picked or bypassed. There is no such thing as a door only you can use. The last place anything is truly a secret is in your head. When you are the only person in the entire world with the right permissions.
There was a window when we could have made meaningful and lasting choices in how protocols, standards, regulations, and laws were adopted. Back when it was all just a few hundred trunk lines, IXPs and NOC with good intentions, and tragically short sight. Lots of people screaming at the top of their lungs about the potential outcomes. Tinfoil hats were worn. Turns out we were right.
When you wrap your brain around what the "internet" really is...it's similar to getting a small sliver of understanding; grasping ever so lightly; the brain breaking inconceivable scale of the infinite universe and how infinitesimally small we are. The remnants of a dead stars clumped together pondering its own own existence. Connecting wires together and making things beyond our capabilities. The amount of data being exchanged right now ain't ****. It's bonkers, but it won't be next year, or next or the next.
The rate at which machine learning and the race to general AI is going, watch for the casualties along the way. one example is encryption as we know it. Gone. It'll be rendered trivial by 2040 MAYBE. Honestly that's a really high estimate. Likely before.
Post quantum encryption is just about as experimentally verifiable as string theory. Won't be long though before we get a chance to see if itll hold up. The Xbox is older than the time we have left. The Patriot Act as well.
Practice basic OPsec. Best Practices. Trust few, tell fewer. Read. Read some more. Then read the book. Every question you could ever think of likely has a 12 year old thread at a slackexchange site and no shortage of users ready to remind you how tired they are of duplicates. The community at grapheneOS is similar. On that though. Best to just go to the source. He tries to explain things without just speaking in jargon. Daniel Micay himself on the matter of android security.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GrapheneOS/comments/bddq5u
and
https://www.reddit.com/r/GrapheneOS/comments/du23la
There is no shortage of people currently who disagree with him even though they have little to no grasp on the complexity of what it is he actually intended. Ran into one of them myself, on this site, just the other day. Sure, It's hardneded, but what that means from user to user is drastically different.
It's more than some. It'll fit some use cases. But it's just a speck in a cloud. If you attract the attention of a human being with skills and motivation...good luck my dude. Godspeed.
The real thought experiment and one of my favorites to fall asleep to on nights I actually sleep is "what are they going to do with all the encrypted data they hoovered up and have been storing for the last 30-40 years? Once AI turns the encryption algorithms that humanity runs on into a half finished cheap dollar store sudoku." How long does any one reckon that'll be the case before us plebs hear about it. We got a good track record, as a collective species in doing the right thing, right? No way they will actually use what is functionally a rewind button on...well everything. Nah, it'll be fine.
Oh look, Lapsus$ group woke up, posted a new dump... Wonder how much Globant spend on securing their stuff. Probably more than me.
--just a jaded old man