I have been following the forum since I got this beast.
Personally I have had a very pleasant Windows Phone experience using Titan. However in last few days the negative feedback threads have increased in number. Presuming that number of end users is increasing, the amount of threads/feedback would have increased anyway. But then does it mean that majority of users are regretting buying this beast? - I am not.
However after looking at few threads, I've noticed that majority of issues with Titan are to those owners who are on AT&T. Could it be carrier modifications in the USA? Is Titan available on any other network in the US? Anyone have feedback?
Most Europe based users have not give much input in those problem threads, so am assuming it's just AT&T handsets that go weird.
But it will help if we guessed a rough number of Titans and their providers/sellers.
Not sure what a poll of owners will show you without correlating it to how happy they are. I am on AT&T and am quite happy - other than WIFI being a little over sensative. If I did not turn off the sound enhancements, I think I would be very unhappy.
I am on at&t with the titan and have no issue with it. Its been an amazing phone, best i have ever had.
AT&T here, other than my disappointment at "4G", everything is fine. Most notably, I don't have any signal issues while holding the phone, I ran several tests with the app Bandwidth
Astute observation. As another poster said on another thread, we drooled over the Titan so much that there had to be a little bit of let down.
I tried to balance my likes and dislikes in another thread, but my bottom line is that the good still outweighs the bad, and much of the bad is software, not hardware, so might be fixed in the future.
I would agree that, yes, the Titan is the best phone I've ever owned, period.
All that said, I just picked up my wife's Focus not ten minutes ago, and I really miss its form factor, weight and saturation.
Thanks for voting guys!
The only reason I din't correlate it to happy or not happy was because it will be too relative an idea of happiness. e.g. I might be happy even with those wifi issues, purely because I am with a network provider that gives me unlimited internet and never use wifi!
However, it is definitely a good idea to have a poll correlating experiences with geographical purchases.
By the looks of just initial 9 votes it looks like either way the views are from AT&T users majorly - happy or unhappy ones. I am just a little inclined to believe AT&T modifications could be at the root of all these(?)
Can someone let us know if on WP AT&T puts it's own bloatware like on Android? Or is bloatware additions just restricted to manufacturers and not network providers?
I know here in the UK Orange is nasty and very notorious in terms of modifying any OS to an extent by their useless bloatware. But am not very sure about AT&T, however would be good to add to my knowledge
drupad2drupad said:
Thanks for voting guys!
The only reason I din't correlate it to happy or not happy was because it will be too relative an idea of happiness. e.g. I might be happy even with those wifi issues, purely because I am with a network provider that gives me unlimited internet and never use wifi!
However, it is definitely a good idea to have a poll correlating experiences with geographical purchases.
By the looks of just initial 9 votes it looks like either way the views are from AT&T users majorly - happy or unhappy ones. I am just a little inclined to believe AT&T modifications could be at the root of all these(?)
Can someone let us know if on WP AT&T puts it's own bloatware like on Android? Or is bloatware additions just restricted to manufacturers and not network providers?
I know here in the UK Orange is nasty and very notorious in terms of modifying any OS to an extent by their useless bloatware. But am not very sure about AT&T, however would be good to add to my knowledge
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They install a couple AT&T specific apps, but you can uninstall them. Other than that, it is as stock of a rom as you can get. No bloatware.
I had all the att stuff off ,except for the Myatt app, within an hour of getting and activating my Titan. Love it, only hiccups so far are getting my old word,excel docs off my old Fuze- not all of them are docx format. Hope the next update includes the ability to mms with gif and audio files. I have fun just turning it on and flipping screens smooth and bright.
Edit to the office docs: had to reset the office hub on the phone, no problems now reading earlier versions of office and can edit newer versions.
Dragon Queen said:
I had all the att stuff off ,except for the Myatt app, within an hour of getting and activating my Titan. Love it, only hiccups so far are getting my old word,excel docs off my old Fuze- not all of them are docx format. Hope the next update includes the ability to mms with gif and audio files. I have fun just turning it on and flipping screens smooth and bright.
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Click to collapse
Haha exactly my feeling! turning on and flipping screens gives me so much of satisfaction!
Now that we know ATT bloatware is nearly zero, I am struggling to figure out how come so many ATT users have dodgy titans that need to be replaced within one week. Again not 'so many' probably 5-6 that might be reported out here in the forum.
My Titan after 7740 update has worked so much flawlessly and everyday I keep discovering new apps that never imagined to exist on my old Android phone! This WP Titan is a treat to my eyes!
Thank you for your replies, they have defiantly given me something to think about.
I think your correct, a Android to Titan? thread might be useful, especially with these great answers. Will sort it now.
Thanks again for your responses.
Edit, its sorted. Thread created titled Android to Titan? I have moved the responses there. Hope its useful
original_ganjaman said:
Thank you for your replies, they have defiantly given me something to think about.
I think your correct, a Android to Titan? thread might be useful, especially with these great answers. Will sort it now.
Thanks again for your responses.
Edit, its sorted. Thread created titled Android to Titan? I have moved the responses there. Hope its useful
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was quick! Thanks
drupad2drupad said:
That was quick! Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only a BUMP!
my 2 cents worth,unbranded sim free europe with zero issues from day one. love this phone
stevov said:
my 2 cents worth,unbranded sim free europe with zero issues from day one. love this phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
me too,the phone is just great.No problem so far.
Well for one thing us AT&T users are running older software on our Titans than the rest of the world because AT&T sucks.
Unbranded Titan UK, No issues, Perfectly happy and hope it stays that way.
UK
Unbranded UK on orange no problems so far, battery lasting much better than i hoped slight issues with the radio and wifi , not had any screen lack of response as metioned in other forums, last phone was HD2 running 'everything'.
This phone is the only upgrade i could go for after the HD2. Sadly just lurking in hope of the 'custom ROM' i know the geniuses here will eventualy produce
After putting WP7 on my HD2 I decided to get myself a Titan until something better comes along here is Australia.
So I got myself a AT&T branded unit off ebay, SIM unlocked it using htcimeiunlock.com (which took all of a couple of minutes) after AT&T customer serice told me I couldn't unluock it and I'm now a happy camper on the Telstra NextG network here in Oz wiht my Titan.
I am seeing 3G/WiFi issues like others but other than that the unit is going well.
Oh I also got the Mugen Power 1950mAh battery, which I can run my Titan for almost 2 days, with bluetooth and often WiFi on as well.
Now if only we can get a custom unlocked ROM the world would be perfect
Related
Is it a bad thing, I ordered the HTC TYTN from my Service Provider and I don't even have it yet and I am looking for tweaks, hacks and accessories.
I found this forum from Howard Forums. The Wiki for my phone (on this site) helped me tremendously. So thank you to all the contributors of that.
Well my first order of business will be getting Streets and Trips Mobil running on it and for that I am going to need a GPS. From what I gather reading other threads a wired GPS is a bad idea if not futile. So Bluetooth it is. I did a quick Ebay search for a few models I saw mentioned here, and came up with some very wide ranges in prices. I am leery of buying a "cheap" one from Ebay as I have made that mistake before thinking I am getting a great deal only to find out what I bought was flaky at best and junk at worst. So I am looking for some feedback from other people running Bluetooth GPS units on there Hermes type phones.
Ok next question,
Rom, Burnt, Fried, Baked, Cooked, I think they are coming to make me away he ha ha, to the funny farm........ (you have to be older (30-40) to get the joke.
Windows Media 6 sounds awesome, however I don't really want to brick my phone on my first tweak. What is the safest way to update from WM5 to WM6. I am on Rogers AT&T in Canada and would like to maintain most if not all of the features that will come with the phone. From what I understand the Rogers Branded phones have some "unique" registry settings that could be altered when you update to WM6. I am willing to loose them if I have to, in order to update, however if there is a way to keep them I would really prefer it. Specifically the new Named Caller ID. (displays the name of people calling you even if you don't already have them in your phone book)
What should my first tweaks be, are there any really good "to die for" apps out there......
My first love in life is (my wife) however for this topic lets just say cars and driving, hence why I want streets and trips.
My second love is computers and modding. I am also into movies and video's, so big storage will be a must. I want to be able to bring along a couple gig of music and video's with me.
I hope I have not driven anyone away with so many questions. If you can answer even one of my questions that would be helpful, if you can answer them all YOU ARE A GOD.
Thanks in Advance for listening to a newbie post.
first off.. welcome to the forums.. believe me when i tell you youll have tons of fun on new your toy..
secondly, i think you should take time knowing your new toy before you delve into tweaking or playing with it...
thirdly, read up and not until then and coupled with you being comfortable with your device should you consider starting messing with it..
HERE IS A GOOD START....
OF COURSE YOU SHOULD NOT MISS THIS ONE..
hope this helps you for a start and good luck.
oopss. . .forgot addressing your subject line.. (got engrossed reading the body of your post that i do not think mentioned anything about the subject line )
i would suggest you look into BT-818, its small, compact has long battery life (32 hrs. and 32 satellites) and the battery can be replaced by you. i know a lot of members here will recommend something smaller but for me i think being practical without sacrificing functionality is essential..
Thank You Bapski for the quick reply, I have spent the last 2hrs reading through those pages and I don't think I have even scratched the surface of it all. Finding the FTP site link is going to save me a lot of time searching for files.
I hear alot about Black Magic, and CID unlocking. I came across a thread about how to unlock the phone without having to really do much. I guess this is a pretty simple procedure?
Well I have lots more reading to do thanks again for the links. (And I thought I covered most of it in the Wiki)
Well the phone arrived today.
I gave it a charge for about 5hrs and have been kinda playing with it.
Edited because I figured out how to fix my contact issues.
Now next up is upgrading to WM6. I really want to do this upgrade before I spend hours learning and tweaking WM5 which sounds like it will be a waste of time. However I am terrified of bricking the phone. I have downloaded the CID Unlocker and although it sounds as easy as hell, I want to make sure that the unlocker won't kill my phone. What numbers should I get off the phone to verify all this.
Are there any version numbers off of the phone that would / should be added to a database for anyone else to compare with older phones. I skimmed over a database that listed some phones with problems and what phones had what installed. This is a Rogers Branded HTC TYTN phone.
I am not a complete Tech Moron, I just don't know anything about Phones. (I run an Apache Web Server as well as an FTP Server and a separate Media Server)
If anyone has suggestions or thoughts about the safest way to update the phone with the least amount of risk, I would be really interested in hearing about it. I am going to do the update at some point its just a matter of me being comfortable enough with the software to do the updates.
P.S. I found a local supplier for a Bluetooth GPS for $79 which I will be picking up next weekend. Not sure how your board posts URL's so here it is straight up. http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=23763&vpn=IBLUE737&manufacture=i-Blue
Capt Fiero said:
Well the phone arrived today.
I gave it a charge for about 5hrs and have been kinda playing with it.
Edited because I figured out how to fix my contact issues.
Now next up is upgrading to WM6. I really want to do this upgrade before I spend hours learning and tweaking WM5 which sounds like it will be a waste of time. However I am terrified of bricking the phone. I have downloaded the CID Unlocker and although it sounds as easy as hell, I want to make sure that the unlocker won't kill my phone. What numbers should I get off the phone to verify all this.
Are there any version numbers off of the phone that would / should be added to a database for anyone else to compare with older phones. I skimmed over a database that listed some phones with problems and what phones had what installed. This is a Rogers Branded HTC TYTN phone.
I am not a complete Tech Moron, I just don't know anything about Phones. (I run an Apache Web Server as well as an FTP Server and a separate Media Server)
If anyone has suggestions or thoughts about the safest way to update the phone with the least amount of risk, I would be really interested in hearing about it. I am going to do the update at some point its just a matter of me being comfortable enough with the software to do the updates.
P.S. I found a local supplier for a Bluetooth GPS for $79 which I will be picking up next weekend. Not sure how your board posts URL's so here it is straight up. http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=23763&vpn=IBLUE737&manufacture=i-Blue
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
safest way is to change your bootloader if your going to flash... its pretty much simple if you have a stable computer and dont pull out your USB while your flashing.... if you dont have enought confidents yet, read more about your phone....
best safety precaution we do here is to install hard spl 2.10.. with this installed, it is said youd be able to avoid bricking (unbrick) your phone if something goes wrong.
safest and fool proof way is to read MRVANX GUIDES
follow all instructions to the letter and youll never go wrong.. i know thats how i did it.. just choose whatever ROM there is on the guides for a start and then once you get the hang of it, you can try other ROM's as you please..
Ok my first ever change to the phone, Hard SPL 2.10 v7 has now been installed on the phone. Followed the guids exactly and worked like a charm. I have not ran any "unlocking software" yet. I guess that is my next step and then loading the official HTC WM6 update.
Yee Haw, I am rocking out now.......
Ok I did the Bootload update.
Then followed the guides again
I updated the Radio and then updated to Fara's Super Clean WM6.
Dang I was all paranoid for nothing, most of this is just click through and go.
There was a few times the Phone asked me questions that were not listed on the guides, but I think I just said, Yes Allow every time it asked anything and all went well.
congratulations... good to hear everything worked out well...
congratulations.. good thing your upgrade went well...
I updated to radio ver 1.41 and am having issues with network connection. GPRS does not want to work and when I am connected to my home wireless router it is spotty at best. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. As well as the range seems to be drastically reduced.
Any suggestions?
Capt Fiero said:
I updated to radio ver 1.41 and am having issues with network connection. GPRS does not want to work and when I am connected to my home wireless router it is spotty at best. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. As well as the range seems to be drastically reduced.
Any suggestions?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
try 1.50........
Thanks, I will try that.
if that dont work try 1.50.10/1.51
I installed Radio version 1.50 and everything is or at least seems to be working great. Lots of things that I am tweaking in WM6.
2 things,
When I had the Rogers WM5 installed I had a a type of Windows Messenger Installed locally that worked well, and now it is gone. Where Do I re-download that from. I have done some searching and only came up with a web based messenger for Mobil phones that loads in I.E.
Next question How do I do batch text messaging. On my old Motorola Razr I could simple compose a message open up my contacts and then go through and check off all the names I wanted to send it to and hit send and it would send to all the people. However in the TYTN I have to add each person separately.
Is there a way to send batch text message with the TYTN?
Ya know I think this thread has moved far enough off topic that it is time that I just start a new thread in diffrent section for all my "newbie questions"
I would like to offer a huge thanks to all that helped me out the past few days learning a new piece of tech. I am still going to have a lot of questions as time goes on. So you can keep your eyes out for me in other Hermes sections. If anyone ever has a car question drop me a PM.
For a Bluetooth GPS you seriously cant go wrong with this:
http://www.amazon.com/Garmin-Blueto...9?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1188928696&sr=8-2
Garmin mobile 10.
Its small, very small.. easy to use. It uses garmins software on your phone. Its not very expensive. has at least a 22hour battery.
It checks traffic when planning routes.. it can tell you gas prices for nearby gass stations, you can check weather, tell it to avoid almost anything.. its just amazing.
Just to update this thread, I did finally buy a Bluetooth GPS. Final price was $61 including shipping. Its a JRT-29 the website, http://www.gpswindow.com/en/picture.asp?idtype=JRT28 kinda sucks, but the unit itself is really nice. About the size of an old slide out tray matchbox. 42ch and works perfect. Came with a car charger USB Cable and software to use it on a PC as well as a mobil phone. (did not need the software for my phone, just my PC)
Thanks again for everyones help.
http://phandroid.com/2010/10/05/skype-for-android-now-available-worldwide/
Edit
that's right, is doesn't work on the Vibrant.
guess what it does not work on vibrant 2.1
amorek13 said:
guess what it does not work on vibrant 2.1
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Click to collapse
It appears that it doesn't work on any galaxy s phone..
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
It's a POS app
no Video calling
no group calling
They waited this long to release this Garbage?
Fring was doing an excellent job, until Skype shut them down.
UGH SKYPE is a POS company
Galaxy S owners get the shaft ... yet again! Maybe we should just recognize the fact that AT&T/iPhone 4 is the best game in town and quit trying to play catch up.
There is a GPS fix that allows it to work excellent. Get over it.
dcchristopher said:
Well, at least we all now know a little more about the two of you. I don't blame you entirely for your disgraceful behavior. Surely your upbringing had a lot to do with it.
I don't see how what I said was inflammatory but perhaps it was misperceived. Allow me to explain: I paid $500 for this device. I honestly don't even need the phone aspect of it. I just need it to access the internet (email, web, etc), then as a media player, and then occasionally as a GPS device. The calling capabilities are literally icing on the cake. Let's just skip the whole GPS part since that needs no introduction. It simply doesn't work (unless you consider your location jumping around every 10 seconds "working" ... yeah, what fun it is to be hearing erroneous directions from your GPS device). T-mobile's voice and data services have been quite paltry in my experience. Calls drop quite often and that's something many Tmo subscribers complain about, especially near downtown and on a NexusOne. Moreover, data takes FOREVER to connect. I could be getting 4mbps/2mbps one second, then 750k/300k the next, then incessant data connection attempts with no data being transmitted ... until I reboot my phone. WTF??? A month ago I was driving from Dallas to San Antonio and got nothing but Edge the whole way down ... all along an interstate highway (albeit one of the worst I've ever seen) ... the phone was even occasionally switching to "G" and it took me forever to remember what that stood for ... GPRS!!! I haven't seen that since the 90s.
If you guys think it is acceptable to get ripped off like that, for hardware and services, by all means continue condoning and promoting Tmo and Sammy's failures and inaction by rewarding them for all that. These phones went on sale 7/15, around the same time Tmo announced their HSPA+ network. Three months later, you expect at least "an" action. No credits, no buy-backs, no remedies ... only failed promises. If you bought a car that couldn't perform as advertised and spec'd, I'm sure you would act differently.
But ... judging from your comments above, you guys are entirely worthy of your fate.
Best,
DCC
P.S. I dislike Apple fanboys just as much as the next guy but at some point we all need to man up to the facts ... the iPhone has the best user experience ... and Windows Phone 7 offers the best development experience (trust me, I have written/am writing apps for all three). The only thing positive about Android in my opinion is the tight integration of all the Google apps and services ... which oddly are not favored by many Android fans on this site ... in addition, they are increasingly being integrated in the other platforms as well (albeit not fast enough). Again, why Android? If it's because you want to be this decade's equivalent of the 90s' Linux geek who spends all day customizing the OS and the environment instead of actually using it and putting to good use, then have fun! Don't feel bad ... most people do not learn from history's lessons either!
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Believe me I hear you, but you make your case weak. Individual experience differs from Joe to Jane.
The biggest advantage of Android over the other's is the hardware support for every major mobile manufacturer.
And Windows Mobile 7? We will see how the numbers look by the Xmas.
Yes, I am a linux geek, but I didn't purchase my phone because I am one.
As for the OP, Skype went downhill once they went to bed with the big red.
So why do you have a tmo vibrant? Why not get an i*hone? There are pros and cons to any device and any carrier...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
lqaddict said:
Believe me I hear you, but you make your case weak. Individual experience differs from Joe to Jane.
The biggest advantage of Android over the other's is the hardware support for every major mobile manufacturer.
And Windows Mobile 7? We will see how the numbers look by the Xmas.
Yes, I am a linux geek, but I didn't purchase my phone because I am one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really wanted Android to succeed but it hasn't and I'm not necessarily blaming Android itself. I just don't see how I can choose it when the hardware and carrier are dropping the ball. All three (OS, hardware, carrier) are part and parcel. "Hardware support" is not enough when the hardware itself is not cutting it. First the Hero had build quality and connectivity issues, now the Vibrant has an elusive Froyo build and major GPS issues (in response to a previous post, I have yet to see a truly working "fix" and I have installed most if not all of them ... whoever claims it's now perfectly working is smoking something he/she should share with the rest of us).
Thank you for keeping an open mind and I do agree with you that individual experiences will vary but let's agree that this forum is proof that there are major unaddressed problems with this phone.
junkdruggler said:
So why do you have a tmo vibrant? Why not get an i*hone? There are pros and cons to any device and any carrier...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for applying intelligence and not resorting to childish name-calling ... simply put, I left AT&T after a decade of being their customer because my non-iPhone superphones (usually purchased from abroad but compatible with US 3G) were being intentionally disregarded by their network in favor of the iPhone devices out there ... $110 a month for a discriminating data service is not acceptable. iPhones are also a little "too user-friendly" for me. I preferred a more open platform. At this point though, I will settle for a device that "just works". That is what every iPhone user will tell you out there ... the s*** just works. A phone is something that should enable you to do things with it, whether it's productivity, app development, multimedia, services, etc. A phone is not a perpetual hack factory, at least not as a primary device. If people want a side project to play with, great. What I have seen on this forum though is that most people need a phone that works for them, not the other way around.
I am waiting for the first generation WP7 phones to roll out and see what drama will ensue, if any. As you very astutely stated, "there are pros and cons to any device and any carrier". I really enjoy the WP7 mobile app development environment and so long as the phones are not involved in yet another fiasco, I will most likely get one. If not, the iPhone it is.
I'm not trolling and I do not mean to offend hard-core Linux super-users/developers but this business of shoddy phones, shoddy service and endless "hacking" is not right when we're all paying 50-100 a month for service and 200-500 for devices. I am surprised that people are not up in arms about it. There really needs to be a class-action lawsuit over this. I know, a handful of lawyers will just make a shipload of money. Still, companies cannot get away with this sort of negligence. This isn't the first time and it sure as heck won't be the last.
Vote with your dollars and best luck to you,
DCC
If browse over the iphone forums you will see the plethora of posts complaining about this and that on the iphone too.
There is no magic cookie cater for anything, you will always find something to be not up to your standards.
What confuses me the most is people complaining about the features that are not being the prime in the market cliché they are shopping - for instance, neither Android nor iOS are good examples of the enterprise use, but people still insist that my phone does not integrate well with my corporate Exchange environment the way I *want* hence the product sucks.
Everything has its pluses and minuses, it's up to an individual to weigh in the pros and cons to make a conscious buying decision.
lqaddict said:
If browse over the iphone forums you will see the plethora of posts complaining about this and that on the iphone too.
There is no magic cookie cater for anything, you will always find something to be not up to your standards.
What confuses me the most is people complaining about the features that are not being the prime in the market cliché they are shopping - for instance, neither Android nor iOS are good examples of the enterprise use, but people still insist that my phone does not integrate well with my corporate Exchange environment the way I *want* hence the product sucks.
Everything has its pluses and minuses, it's up to an individual to weigh in the pros and cons to make a conscious buying decision.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really want to say "I hear ya" but here's the deal ...
a) I glanced over the iPhone fora and I am not seeing anything glaring ... mostly basic user ignorance (configuration / customization issues)
b) all the iPhone users I have asked what their biggest complaint is about their phone give me the same "huh?" look ... their phone just works
c) all the major issues with iPhone 4 were addressed with some sort of fix or another, even if all it took was a rubber band ... I have friends who exchanged their phone well after the 30 days because of the proximity sensor issue (just as an example) ... clearly, Apple took ownership of resolving the deal-breaking issues
When I walked into a T-mobile store after the first 30 days and said "I will not put up with this GPS BS" they kindly restated their return policy, gave me Samsung's support number and sent me on my not-so-merry way. When I contacted Samsung, I was told to simply wait for the update as there was no fix for it so a replacement wouldn't accomplish anything. The customer service rep literally laughed when I mentioned a return of the product for refund.
You're absolutely right ... there will always be issues but this isn't a matter of preference or individual taste ... these companies are failing to deliver what they promised and what we have paid for and rightfully deserve. I am in no way saying that the iPhone is perfect; I'm sure I would have something to complain about from time to time ... but when I borrow friends' phones to "play" with, the iPhone is fast and responsive and hasn't failed me once. Load SpeedTest side-by-side. The "Begin Test" button lights up literally instantly. I know the Galaxy S phones have the same hardware. Why is it they can't be as responsive?
As I previously mentioned, I was with AT&T (or one of the companies it acquired or merged with) for over a decade until the Hero came out and I switched to Sprint. Then I went to T-mobile for the Vibrant. I will just make my rounds until I find something that works. My problem is that I get way too overexcited about the technology and jump ship before it has had a chance to prove itself. Right now the iPhone 4 has proved itself fairly well. As I said though, as a mobile apps developer, I really want WP7 to work out so I will _try_ to wait and see. The development experience is "magnifique!"
Best,
DCC
It's really disheartening to see android sinking like this because if googles ignorant attitude. I agree with you, if google woukd be a bit more proactive like Apple or Microsoft (now that they revamped) and set a standard for the OS requirement, quality control. We can all breath better. I have a bad feeling that once wm7 hit, Android will be the new WM6.5, a cheap buggy and unorganized akternative for manuftre and carriers.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
PaiPiePia said:
It's really disheartening to see android sinking like this because if googles ignorant attitude. I agree with you, if google woukd be a bit more proactive like Apple or Microsoft (now that they revamped) and set a standard for the OS requirement, quality control. We can all breath better. I have a bad feeling that once wm7 hit, Android will be the new WM6.5, a cheap buggy and unorganized akternative for manuftre and carriers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for chiming in. Hopefully Android will survive, even if only because competition is a good thing. I think most of the issues faced today (so-called fragmentation, etc) will be resolved in the re-architecture being introduced in Android 3.0. I'm more concerned about the carriers and hardware manufacturers closing up shop after a phone has been released and only looking forward to the next model. What good is it if Android survives and succeeds if I am the one left holding the dud? "Oh, just pay another two to five hundred dollars." The worst part is that the user/owner community turns a blind eye to the egregious failures in the name of fandom. That is NOT the way to organize and effect change.
dcchristopher said:
I really want to say "I hear ya" but here's the deal ...
a) I glanced over the iPhone fora and I am not seeing anything glaring ... mostly basic user ignorance (configuration / customization issues)
b) all the iPhone users I have asked what their biggest complaint is about their phone give me the same "huh?" look ... their phone just works
c) all the major issues with iPhone 4 were addressed with some sort of fix or another, even if all it took was a rubber band ... I have friends who exchanged their phone well after the 30 days because of the proximity sensor issue (just as an example) ... clearly, Apple took ownership of resolving the deal-breaking issues
When I walked into a T-mobile store after the first 30 days and said "I will not put up with this GPS BS" they kindly restated their return policy, gave me Samsung's support number and sent me on my not-so-merry way. When I contacted Samsung, I was told to simply wait for the update as there was no fix for it so a replacement wouldn't accomplish anything. The customer service rep literally laughed when I mentioned a return of the product for refund.
You're absolutely right ... there will always be issues but this isn't a matter of preference or individual taste ... these companies are failing to deliver what they promised and what we have paid for and rightfully deserve. I am in no way saying that the iPhone is perfect; I'm sure I would have something to complain about from time to time ... but when I borrow friends' phones to "play" with, the iPhone is fast and responsive and hasn't failed me once. Load SpeedTest side-by-side. The "Begin Test" button lights up literally instantly. I know the Galaxy S phones have the same hardware. Why is it they can't be as responsive?
As I previously mentioned, I was with AT&T (or one of the companies it acquired or merged with) for over a decade until the Hero came out and I switched to Sprint. Then I went to T-mobile for the Vibrant. I will just make my rounds until I find something that works. My problem is that I get way too overexcited about the technology and jump ship before it has had a chance to prove itself. Right now the iPhone 4 has proved itself fairly well. As I said though, as a mobile apps developer, I really want WP7 to work out so I will _try_ to wait and see. The development experience is "magnifique!"
Best,
DCC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess I went to the apple forums before the proximity sensor issues were resolved, and it was Vibrant GPS Redux over there.
I am glad that Apple took care of the problem after a few updates to their iOS, but as with the GPS issues on our phones the proximity sensor should've been caught during the QA, I am not gonna say anything about Antennagate.
Hopefully GPS will be patched for good on the Vibrant too, and no I do not need the proof that it is addressed with the latest update - faster locks does not mean accuracy.
scrizz said:
Fring was doing an excellent job, until Skype shut them down.
UGH SKYPE is a POS company
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its those bloody Iphone Users that were clogging up the servers using Fring that caused fring to gett banned from skype
cdill3000 said:
Its those bloody Iphone Users that were clogging up the servers using Fring that caused fring to gett banned from skype
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't let Skype off the hook though ... I used to be a big fan of theirs but they've been very slow with delivering platform-specific clients and they seem to be playing favorites and such. Closing the door on fring, a very, very open solution out there, was a deplorable thing to do.
It doesn't matter folks ... when Google comes out with their VOIP service, and you KNOW they will (Gizmo5 acquisition, etc), all these other (dis-)services will be obliterated. I predict Google will establish its own data-only cell carrier (cause data is all you need anyway) ... hopefully within the next 2-3 years.
I know this thread kinda derailed off topic, but imma put my two cents in.
I do kinda agree with DCC, at my workplace pretty much everyone has some sort of smart phone. When the subject of phones comes up, I am the first one to bang my chest and yell ANDROID~!
But the sad truth is, iphone users like the iphone because IT DOES WHAT THEY NEED IT TO DO. they really dont care about all the stuff we have come to love about android.
So they are happy and content, while we are up till the wee hrs of the morning trying to make our phones have a milli-second faster lol.
And to me its not really trying to make our phones better than the iphone, its me just making my phone better than it was.
I am disappointed in samsung about the lag issue and the gps issue.
I dont complain about it though, cause we are all here at this website to make our phones better than it is from stock. and I am 100 percent sure , once its said and done, this phone will more than satisfy me.
As far as I've read, Fring violated Skype's API and when they were challenged Fring, instead of changing their code, resolved to drop Skype support altogether. It's basically Fring's fault for not playing according to the rules. Fring issued a statement saying that Skype blocked them. It's an unlikely story since Skype has a fairly open API and would be leaving itself open to lawsuit if they did so.
blogs.skype.com/en/2010/07/fring.html
Where are you guys reading or hearing these things from?
cashless said:
As far as I've read, Fring violated Skype's API and when they were challenged Fring, instead of changing their code, resolved to drop Skype support altogether. It's basically Fring's fault for not playing according to the rules. Fring issued a statement saying that Skype blocked them. It's an unlikely story since Skype has a fairly open API and would be leaving itself open to lawsuit if they did so.
blogs.skype.com/en/2010/07/fring.html
Where are you guys reading or hearing these things from?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Umm, definitely NOT from either side's highly partial blog, that's for sure ... which, by the way, you are misquoting. Fring did not drop Skype support all together. They temporarily disabled video calls because Skype and the carriers were *****ing about it (due to the excessive load on their networks). Then they were suddenly blocked from routing connections through Skype. This is an obvious behind-closed-doors ganging up of Skype+carrier(s) against Fring who stands alone and is one of the most open companies out there.
I get it, no one here really knows what happened when and why but ... Skype is no victim. On the other hand, the Objectivist in me says Skype should have every right to deny Fring (or any individual, company or group in the world) access to their systems. I just wish they would come out and say it instead of being all sly about it.
dcchristopher said:
Umm, definitely NOT from either side's highly partial blog, that's for sure ... which, by the way, you are misquoting. Fring did not drop Skype support all together. They temporarily disabled video calls because Skype and the carriers were *****ing about it (due to the excessive load on their networks). Then they were suddenly blocked from routing connections through Skype. This is an obvious behind-closed-doors ganging up of Skype+carrier(s) against Fring who stands alone and is one of the most open companies out there.
I get it, no one here really knows what happened when and why but ... Skype is no victim. On the other hand, the Objectivist in me says Skype should have every right to deny Fring (or any individual, company or group in the world) access to their systems. I just wish they would come out and say it instead of being all sly about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Saying that a company violated API publicly when they didn't is libel.
Just answer the question, your smugness, where did you get your info (especially seeing as you're stating that it's an obvious behind-closed-doors ganging up of Skype+carrier(s) against Fring. I guess you're one of these people behind these closed doors?
Lemme get your "jump to conclusions" board for you.
I have heard a mixed bag of reviews about this phone but what I gather is most bugs are no ironed out. I have a SGS2 at the moment, but its to big and I never really was a big android fan and well iOS is looking very dated, I love the look of the Lumia 800. Could you recommend it?
I'd vote yes. The look and feel is great. The OS works well. Main caveats are lack of apps, and bugs/short battery life, as you say I hope these are mostly sorted. Biggest frustration for me has been the won't charge/won't turn on problem if you let the battery run flat, but I'm hopeful the latest update may help.
Tim
slugger09 said:
I have a SGS2 at the moment, but its to big and I never really was a big android fan and well iOS is looking very dated, I love the look of the Lumia 800. Could you recommend it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel exactly the same way about the SGS2, Android and iOS.
I originally bought the Lumia as a stop gap - I was sick of flashing roms onto my Galaxy S and thought the Lumia would be nice to own until the iPhone 5 comes out. But after having the Lumia for a month, Apple will need to do something drastic with iOS as well as the hardware to get me away from my Lumia. I love it to bits.
You're picking the right time because the annoying bugs - terrible battery life and bad audio quality are now fixed. I'm sat here listening to music off the Lumia via a set of Sennheiser HD555's and it sounds brilliant.
The OS is great, it has a couple of minor usability issues compared to iOS which is very good in this respect, but it blows Android out the water.
Go for it!
slugger09 said:
I have heard a mixed bag of reviews about this phone but what I gather is most bugs are no ironed out. I have a SGS2 at the moment, but its to big and I never really was a big android fan and well iOS is looking very dated, I love the look of the Lumia 800. Could you recommend it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So far all the issues have been dealt with, if your phone has a fault that needs sorted, I can assure you that Nokia will sort it out. They are people that listen to the consumers, as most bugs have so far been dealt with. I have no problems with the phone now apart from my screen being messed up, but hopefully that's getting replaced by them. I would recommend the phone as it's excellent value and Nokia are doing everything to make this phone one of the best out there, as you can see on the adverts, as well as the amount of time they're putting into the Lumias. You get what you pay for, oh if you're coming from SGS2, it's a little on the heavier side.
Really tempted. Can these be developer unlocked?
slugger09 said:
Really tempted. Can these be developer unlocked?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At the moment, no, we haven't heard anything from Chevron sadly, only via App Hub ($99) or student dev unlock. But we can always hope it comes soon. Test the phone out first, to see if you can stick without homebrew as you are coming from an Android (the mother of all customization).
I changed from sgs2 and I have to say that I haven't looked back. This phone is brilliant and finally a good phone with excellent usability.
I came from a Mozart and it was a relief. The design is so much better, and it's quite much faster as well. I have never owned an Android, never wanted one, and with my Lumia I'll never want one.
WP7 is a genuinely different beast compared to iOS/Android. I'm not going to tell you that it's better, because that all depends on taste, but if you're getting a WP7 phone then the Lumia 800/900 is an excellent choice.
As a developer I'd never go back to Android simply because it's so horribly buggy and the software design so godawful that even a dualcore gigahertz processor isn't enough to make it render things smoothly. What's more, bugs and security exploits don't get fixed unless you install your own rom or wait a year for a carrier-approved update. There's so many bugs that it's almost impossible now to write an app that doesn't crash on at least 10% of the devices out there
As for downsides to the Lumia, there's no internet tethering at the moment, although WiFi tethering has just been announced. Battery life isn't great, but it seems to differ from phone to phone. When I just got mine I had 8-10 hours of battery life, but after two or three charge cycles my phone lasted a full day, and I really haven't had problems since then. As far as I know this is all fixed with the new update though. Also, WP7 doesn't have all the apps you're used to having on Android, and the ones that are there aren't always the best. Spotify for instance is totally unusable for me, and I've uninstalled it about a month ago and downgraded my account. Things like Facebook and twitter seem fine though, and it's nice to have people's Facebook pictures show up in your contacts. The browser is also great and fast, although I'm not too happy with Bing and rather use Google. Nokia maps also isn't as good as Google maps, but a third-party app fixes that pretty quick.
Imho, if you want a phone that just works, get either a WP7 phone or an iPhone. If you're getting a WP7 phone, get a Lumia 800.
Definitely! And two of my friends are already ordered after i show em what you can do with unlocked device
an awesome phone, i love this phone, iv tried android, iphone blackberry, and id rather use this phone than any other phone.
i can definitely recommend this phone to everyone after the latest update. most bugs have been sorted our( not that i was having problem with it previously) but in general the 12070 update really does make this a valid choice..
on the other hand if you could wait for the lumia 900 it would be a good idea..but as long as you dont need a huge display..and a fornt facing camera the 800 should be cheaper and it does feel more comfortable in the hands
would recommend the lumia 800 yes
imho way better than iphone and android platform the 800 is so nice to hold in your hands its the best phone i have ever used, and i have had a lot from iphone 4 to 4s to galaxy nexus and sg2 the lumia is a much nicer phone to use and looks better.
I wouldn't recommend it. I've been through 3 of these devices all with different hardware faults. And the 900 is close to release, it's got the same features, a bit bigger and better screen (Not PenTile) and FFC.
Agreed here.
I feel the same way. My girlfriend has my old iPhone 4 and I sent the HTC Sensation packing to pay for my Lumia. This phone is ****ing amazing. I have had zero problems except the camera. I figured out that to counter this I can turn up the exposure value in the camera settings and the pictures are fantastic!
Note: I imported a HK model here to Beijing (we have sweet markets) and do not have Nokia Music.... this is lame otherwise, the phone is great.
BlitterTwisted said:
I feel exactly the same way about the SGS2, Android and iOS.
I originally bought the Lumia as a stop gap - I was sick of flashing roms onto my Galaxy S and thought the Lumia would be nice to own until the iPhone 5 comes out. But after having the Lumia for a month, Apple will need to do something drastic with iOS as well as the hardware to get me away from my Lumia. I love it to bits.
You're picking the right time because the annoying bugs - terrible battery life and bad audio quality are now fixed. I'm sat here listening to music off the Lumia via a set of Sennheiser HD555's and it sounds brilliant.
The OS is great, it has a couple of minor usability issues compared to iOS which is very good in this respect, but it blows Android out the water.
Go for it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My Lumia Experience
Hi,
after using a Lumia 800 for a couple of weeks, here's my two cents:
I have gone through all iPhone-Generations (and some symbian-stuff before) and currently own a bunch of current phones, among them the SGS2 (custom firmware, admittedly) and an Lumia 800. My company is developing apps, that's why I get to play around with smartphones a lot.
The Lumia 800 is hands down one of the best looking phones around. The size is perfect and it feels just right. I also dig the responsiveness of the user interface and I really like the approach of smart tiles in Windows Phone. Not as cluttered as android widgets and much smarter than the iOS counterpart (there is no such concept).
Unfortunately, there are a lot of real show stoppers that make me pick up my SGS2 in the morning, instead of the Lumia. Let's start with basics like calendaring and e-mails. Handling of calendar invitations does not work most of the time, the phone does not even handle .ics-files, which makes me pin down invitations, then go to the calendar and create a new entry manually - c'mon, this is basic stuff!
If you are setting up Google Mail on the phone, you will see only the first level of tags (a.k.a IMAP-folders). If a tag has sub-tags, it won't be displayed in the list, making the whole concept useless - bummer.
Syncing your contacts with google works in such a way that all your contacts do actually appear on the phone - except for random phone numbers that just will not be synchronized. If you really want to have all your contacts' phone numbers on the Lumia you better go through all those contacts and make sure the phone numbers are labeled in a way the Lumia can understand. I am not sure which labels work reliably. Updating all contacts just for a bug like this really is a tedious task!
The integration of facebook is pretty well done, unless you have a name that is so common that there are other people you know on facebook that have the same name. In this case, messages and profile pictures of the other people of your name are displayed as _your_ messages and profile pictures. Guess some developer decided to ditch unique IDs and go for names instead - another bug!
Talking about bugs: most apps that I really got used to on other platforms are sub par or not available at all on Windows Phone. Remember The Milk, evernote, spotify, rdio or even facebook - those apps are in no way comparable to their counterparts on iOS or Android in terms of features and stability.
And then there are a lot of other, small things:
- No tethering (ok, this is supposed to come in a future update)
- no image scale-down possible when sending via e-mail
- mute does not mute all sounds
- no ABC-bar in contacts list, you have to search or scroll a thousand times to find a contact
- Marketplace is slow and often inresponsive. Is there a way to list the apps I have bought? I have not found such an option
- battery runtime: though much better after last update, it is still tough to get through an entire day
- Once you install many apps (like I do) you will start to miss folders or other means to organize your smart tiles and the application list - a general problem of Windows Phone.
I have to admit that some of the trouble is certainly due to the fact that I use google services instead of Exchange, which might yield a better experience on Windows Phone. Then again, this phones' target audience is more likely to use free google services than Exchange.
That being said, I still like the phone, but it has way to many quirks to be a reliable business phone. I really hope Nokia and Microsoft get these wrinkles straightened out because the interface surely has a lot of potential.
Until then I will stick to my ugly Android that gets the job done ;-)
Cheers,
Dan
Brewn said:
- No tethering (ok, this is supposed to come in a future update)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My theory is that since carriers hate tethering, this is part of Nokia's strategy to entice carriers into selling more Lumia devices during the initial launch period. Delivering an update (much, much later?) is a compromise to appease users who need tethering.
Brewn said:
- no ABC-bar in contacts list, you have to search or scroll a thousand times to find a contact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My contacts list has always had the alphabet labels.
Brewn said:
- Marketplace is slow and often inresponsive. Is there a way to list the apps I have bought? I have not found such an option
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Marketplace sucks. The only way to get a list of apps that you have bought (and re-install them) is through the www.windowsphone.com site. Lots of app reviews aren't shown either.
CervezaPorFavor said:
My contacts list has always had the alphabet labels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but how do you quickly jump to, say, "M". Aaah, I found it: double tap on a label and you will get the entire alphabet! So this one can be scratched due to user dumbness
Cheers,
Dan
Brewn said:
Yes, but how do you quickly jump to, say, "M". Aaah, I found it: double tap on a label and you will get the entire alphabet! So this one can be scratched due to user dumbness
Cheers,
Dan
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of your list can be scratched due to user dumbness
oskariunit said:
Most of your list can be scratched due to user dumbness
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would you mind to enlighten me?
---------- Post added at 04:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:50 PM ----------
@oskariunit: By the way: The alphabet in the contact list is nice but also has the bug that the first tap onto a letter does not open the alphabet-list if you have been scrolling the contact list before. Probably the first tap just sets to focus to the button and the second tap registers. One tap suffices if you open contacts and directly tap onto a letter without scrolling before, as the default focus is obviously on those letters.
And no, this is not user dumbness but a bug.
Hello to all! :fingers-crossed:
As you know, HTC has decided not to pursue certain MAJ who were scheduled yet on our beloved models. I invite you to sign the petition on line for validate your displeasure by HTC company policy to its customers. Click "sign" [/ b]...
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/petitions-recovery-update-htc-flyer/
Here is another link to a petition for SHD posted...
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/give-us-ics/
Here is the text of the petition posted for the flyer:
Distinguished leaders marketing HTC,
We call out to date show you our dissatisfaction your decision not to propose to the SHIFT ICS (where possibly another) Obviously your ad had the effect of a Treason in the world to the owners of Tablet Flyer famous who have seen this act deliberate killing programmed from HTC.
Indeed, the Flyer is your only so far shelf and it will not be entitled to benefit from last improvements in google.
We do not understand your approach knowing that this product has one year old! From a customer relations standpoint, it is totally outrageous.
There may be a technical problem because the Developers are most certainly the height to solve some technical problems. If it turns out that this is a business decision, we think this is a huge mistake and that it wrong in the sense of logic, why private that a better enchant owners.
Other products have also seen a change radical from you.
We ask you to please rethink your decision on the judgment of the SHIFT shelf Flyer because it is your duty as provider mobile phone to offer the best services and follow-up to these clients to be missed manner most who follow you from the beginning.
The angry customers! ...
thank @+ Kacaouet
People...HTC is not obligated to provide us anything besides basic hardware/software support. They are not required to give us a upgrade, heck they aren't even required to give us bugfixes. When you buy a tablet or phone you are buying it with the current software load, meaning you need to make sure you are happy with what it runs and how it runs. Can we PLEASE stop beating this horse?
thewadegeek said:
People...HTC is not obligated to provide us anything besides basic hardware/software support. They are not required to give us a upgrade, heck they aren't even required to give us bugfixes. When you buy a tablet or phone you are buying it with the current software load, meaning you need to make sure you are happy with what it runs and how it runs. Can we PLEASE stop beating this horse?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello,
It's your perspective and you've made, it is!
This is not the generality of people who think that, already after just seven months of existence, it simply removes purtement and the evolution of the tablet, this is not normal.
They are not obliged to provide it to us for free, okay, at least that we are proposing an alternative to évolution.
Knowing that the products were sold frozen and for the typical person, not necessarily easy to change OS as two shirts!
If you can afford to buy every two weeks, good for you and too bad for us ...
CDLT
@ + Kacaouet...
@thewadegeek:
As far as I recall, there is some kind of agreement between Google and the main manufacturers to give proper support/updates for products for at least 18 months after its initial release.
Now, as the HTC Flyer has been released < the mentioned 18 months I expect HTC to honor that agreement.
And please do not forget that the HC update was rubish and should not be called an update but a downgrade (as some features do not work (as well) as they did before).
If you would own a car, and for some reason they upgraded some kind of software @ the garage which resulted in non functioning blinkers/signal lights and you had to put your hand out of the the window everytime you are about to switch lanes or make a turn in order to warn the other drivers about your actions, would you accept that? I WANT MY HARDWARE BUTTONS BACK!!!
Everyone is free to make his voice heard and if you don't like topics like this one, than please .. by all means .. stay out.
Yucko said:
@thewadegeek:
As far as I recall, there is some kind of agreement between Google and the main manufacturers to give proper support/updates for products for at least 18 months after its initial release.
Now, as the HTC Flyer has been released < the mentioned 18 months I expect HTC to honor that agreement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's SUPPORT not upgrade, and in no way does SUPPORT entail a UPGRADE.
And please do not forget that the HC update was rubish and should not be called an update but a downgrade (as some features do not work (as well) as they did before).
If you would own a car, and for some reason they upgraded some kind of software @ the garage which resulted in non functioning blinkers/signal lights and you had to put your hand out of the the window everytime you are about to switch lanes or make a turn in order to warn the other drivers about your actions, would you accept that? I WANT MY HARDWARE BUTTONS BACK!!!
Everyone is free to make his voice heard and if you don't like topics like this one, than please .. by all means .. stay out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First off I LIKED the upgrade, so you can't make a blanket statement calling it rubbish. The pen support with Honeycomb is pretty slick and I enjoy it. Second that's not a valid comparison, in that case they removed REQUIRED functionality, in this case they just replaced it with something else. And if you want your hardware buttons back then downgrade, or install Lee's Honeycomb. Viola. Your last statement is TOTALLY contradictory friend, first you says we can all make our voice heard, and then you tell me to stay out. Also the purpose of a forum is for discussion, you all seem to just want people to agree with you. I'm just getting tired with everyone starting a new petition or "HTC sucks" thread. If you feel betrayed then deal with it, HTC has done nothing legally wrong so everyone is stuck.
What are we talking about? What in the world is a SHIFT Flyer Ics? Is this a petition to ship Flyers with Need for Speed SHIFT on them? I'm confused
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using Tapatalk 2
Cor-master said:
What are we talking about? What in the world is a SHIFT Flyer Ics? Is this a petition to ship Flyers with Need for Speed SHIFT on them? I'm confused
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol. ( its just Google translate)
To all:
Something is not happening right. We are arguing on wrong issues. Some points I noticed and I would like to emphasise upon are:
1. Yeah they gave us honeycomb. But its not perfect. Chiefly the internet browsing experience. Internet is the soul of computers, tablets, smart phones, ipads etc. and we need a solid browser to experience it, which is not there. It leaves a lot to be desired considering:
a. Flyer has 1gb ram, a powerful processor, 1 GB system ROM, Enough Internal Memory
b. Initially it was sold for exorbitant price (700$+, though mine 32 gb, 3g cost $390)
c. It was told by Google about an year back that all devices should be supported till 18 months.
Yeah, flyer has beautiful features like pen, hd cams, srs, mhl out, brilliant screen, top battery. But it lacks a solid browsing experience. In my view what the majority of us want is a solid browsing experience. Now that comes with a HC update or ICS update will not matter to me.
Many people are talking of broken GPS. If its really broken, then its HTC's duty to repair it, not the developers'. If its not broken, we should forget about this issue. Now if someone says it requires just a change in config file to repair it, I agree to it but this small repair forces you to root and risk bricking.
On another note of doctorlirio campaign: he should not have raised the issue of GSM calls with HTC. HTC didn't give us calling functionality, xda did.
So, why we are always wanting better? Because it has become our need and habit to stay ahead and overcome the weaknesses of our devices. We can't stand any weakness in our devices. And for me, a solid browsing experience is my primary need where my flyer doesn't satisfy me fully. Whether its HTC or developers, we always want better for our devices.
( though opera mobile works a little better in browsing, but sometimes ( may be often) it also fails to function perfectly on high load web pages.)
Lastly, I feel that, its a little too late now for us to keep chasing HTC. ( though HTC is to blame for a weak internet browsing experience and those who paid exorbitant sums for buying this are even more right in blaming htc)
lekhwani said:
Lol. ( its just Google translate)
To all:
Something is not happening right. We are arguing on wrong issues. Some points I noticed and I would like to emphasise upon are:
1. Yeah they gave us honeycomb. But its not perfect. Chiefly the internet browsing experience. Internet is the soul of computers, tablets, smart phones, ipads etc. and we need a solid browser to experience it, which is not there. It leaves a lot to be desired considering:
a. Flyer has 1gb ram, a powerful processor, 1 GB system ROM, Enough Internal Memory
b. Initially it was sold for exorbitant price (700$+, though mine 32 gb, 3g cost $390)
c. It was told by Google about an year back that all devices should be supported till 18 months.
Yeah, flyer has beautiful features like pen, hd cams, srs, mhl out, brilliant screen, top battery. But it lacks a solid browsing experience. In my view what the majority of us want is a solid browsing experience. Now that comes with a HC update or ICS update will not matter to me.
Many people are talking of broken GPS. If its really broken, then its HTC's duty to repair it, not the developers'. If its not broken, we should forget about this issue. Now if someone says it requires just a change in config file to repair it, I agree to it but this small repair forces you to root and risk bricking.
On another note of doctorlirio campaign: he should not have raised the issue of GSM calls with HTC. HTC didn't give us calling functionality, xda did.
So, why we are always wanting better? Because it has become our need and habit to stay ahead and overcome the weaknesses of our devices. We can't stand any weakness in our devices. And for me, a solid browsing experience is my primary need where my flyer doesn't satisfy me fully. Whether its HTC or developers, we always want better for our devices.
( though opera mobile works a little better in browsing, but sometimes ( may be often) it also fails to function perfectly on high load web pages.)
Lastly, I feel that, its a little too late now for us to keep chasing HTC. ( though HTC is to blame for a weak internet browsing experience and those who paid exorbitant sums for buying this are even more right in blaming htc)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I came to that conclusion today about Web browsing actually. I wanted something that would be as useful as a laptop and Web browsing has never been stellar on it. And the best Android Web browser isn't available on it!
Senseless helps with browsing big time but unfortunately I still find myself grabbing the laptop and getting frustrated with the browser when I need to get something done.
As for everything else its perfect but the one thing I bought it for is its greatest weakness. I didn't buy it expecting any update, but I was hoping we'd get ics to fix the Web browsing. Web browsing is fully gpu accelerated in ics and my phone whether I'm running chrome or the stock htc browser is pc quality. The flyer is more akin to my old captivate.
Firefox might be the answer if they ever optimize it for tablets
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using Tapatalk 2
I received the below e-mail today. I did not appreciate being contacted out of the blue via e-mail; if you feel the need to contact me, use XDA's tagging feature. With that said, I thought I'd reply in public with my thoughts on the matter, hoping to drive a constructive conversation about Verizon Wireless' restrictions for devices on their network. My initial response is in post 2.
Please, think through your responses before posting. Make sure they ADD to the conversation.
What do you think of having everyone from XDA and the CM community using the DINC 4G LTE file Better Business Bureau complaints against verizon? It made a business decision not to give us updates, and has deliberately removed the DINC 4g from the HTC Unlock program. They shouldn't be allowed to abandon the platform and to remove unlocking ability that was there.
BBB asks them to respond within 14 days. [edit: link removed]
or have you already tried this route?
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I will leave it up to the writer of the e-mail if he/she would like to make himself/herself known here.
Can you point to a single advertisement by either HTC or Verizon that the Droid Incredible 4G LTE would ever be included in HTCDev's unlocked bootloader program? Even HTC's generic advertisements include disclaimers that some devices may not be included due to various restrictions (the most obvious being carrier refusal). HTC can justify the ability to unlock the bootloader pre-public availability as a means to let developers directly related to software development and quality assurance alter the ROM before release. To a handful of end users who get the device in the early days of release, they get to sneak in and use the unlocker under the "Other devices" category of the program. I suspect we owe HTC a thank you for dragging their feet for a week before disabling the unlock ability for this (and several other) device(s). There is no legitimate complaint that can be filed towards Verizon concerning this matter since they never advertised this as an available feature.
On the topic of abandoning the platform, software-wise, the last available software update for the Incredible 4G still works with reasonable stability and all advertised features are enabled. It is natural for technology devices to age and need replacement; a balance has to be struck between user content or disdain and extent of support. Verizon has apparently deemed there will be very little blowback by prematurely ending software updates. Considering the number of users I see in the XDA forum section for this phone, I'd guess they're right. About the only sticking point that could be leveraged to force a software update out of Verizon is if there are security vulnerabilities that are either being actively exploited or pose a real threat of being exploited in the near future.
Succinctly, we are at the mercy of Verizon's "generosity" concerning extended functionality of, and software updates for, the phones on their network. With these thoughts, I believe we can only ask them to help us out... with reason, anger, begging, or whatever tactic you find most influential. I don't think we can force their hand.
Your thoughts XDAers?
I agree with mdmower. Having come from the OG Droid, I had zero expectation for HTC or Verizon to let me unlock the phone. While I did not expect this phone to be the left-handed, red-haired step-child twice removed orphan of Verizon, it is a great phone with a 4" screen. The size is good (still prefer OG Droid) and the processor and internet speeds are great. I personally am quite content with this phone. We have been blessed with some extremely talented developers and supporters who have
Developed a method to unlock despite HTC/Verizon
Developed two methods for s-off:
DirtyRacun - IMHO, unlimited.io did a great job
FacePalm - Haven't tried, but looks great
Two great recoveries:
Official CWM Recovery, Plus PhilZ
TWRP Recovery
Developed an Incredible Rock Solid Sense ROM in ViperLTE
Developed a solid, official CyanogenMod ROM .
There are probably more, but those are just off of the top of my head. I am also still seeing great ongoing development work for ROMs for this phone. Sure, this phone doesn't have the plethora of ROMs that the OG Droid, Dinc2, Rezound, or [insert model here], but what we do have is solid.
I'm not exactly sure what Verizon owes us. We have a great phone with a great 4GLTE network (at least in my area). It should also be noted that Verizon actually put out an OTA for the OG Dinc around 2+ years after its release with "Improvements and fixes". I would expect the same for this phone as well. I too believe that threats, anger, etc. will not do anything more than generate ill will.
Just my $0.03.
P.S. Why do we still care if there is an "official" bootloader unlock? As mentioned above, we have a proved method to unlock bootloader and/or gain s-off. Even HTC's site says that unlocking bootloader through their "official" site may void your warranty.
HTC Dev said:
Please understand that you will not be able to return your device to the original state and going forward your device may not be held covered under the warranty for all claims resulting from the unlocking of the bootloader. HTC bears no responsibility if your device is no longer usable afterwards.
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The only thing to take away from this is to avoid Verizon and HTC. They may not owe us anything more than we received, but they are clearly sub-par companies compared to others. Unfortunately, I can't ditch Verizon just now because I'm on a shared plan, but I will never buy an HTC phone again.
junkmail9 said:
I agree with mdmower. Having come from the OG Droid, I had zero expectation for HTC or Verizon to let me unlock the phone....
P.S. Why do we still care if there is an "official" bootloader unlock?
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Just to clarify, I'm not content with the support Verizon has offered for this phone, I just realize that we cannot expect them to continue support. I am still not sure about the best avenues of communication with Verizon Wireless, so in a feeble attempt to get their attention, I write a short #openletter on G+.
A far as the official bootloader unlock, it is a little important. An example is the recently advertised CM installer (by the way, I do not have any insider knowledge about CM Inc.). The installer will almost surely be available only to devices with legitimate unlock ability. While the fireball is pretty much "a bit"-out-of-luck even if it did get official unlock, due to the inability to flash the boot partition while in recovery, at some point users need to convince Verizon Wireless to allow unlocked bootloaders for phones on their network. This is especially relevant to the many, many users who are wise enough to not tinker with their phones because of lack of knowledge. They deserve the opportunity to safely replace the legacy operating system on their phone, and this will only be possible if the carrier and manufacturer allow it.
The open letter seems pointless, besides maybe allowing other people to see and take note that Verizon ignores certain customers. As far as our phone though, no point really. Anyone you reach through G+, Facebook, Twitter, Verizon's customer service contacts, etc. will have no real power to do anything. They just give the typical "sorry, we're doing our best" garbage. The message never reaches anyone important enough to actually do anything. The only way a message may get to them is if the user base is very large, but even if we all wrote to them everyday it wouldn't help. Not enough people for them to care. As you said, we're at their mercy. Just have to wait.
mdmower said:
A far as the official bootloader unlock, it is a little important. An example is the recently advertised CM installer (by the way, I do not have any insider knowledge about CM Inc.). The installer will almost surely be available only to devices with legitimate unlock ability. While the fireball is pretty much "a bit"-out-of-luck even if it did get official unlock, due to the inability to flash the boot partition while in recovery, at some point users need to convince Verizon Wireless to allow unlocked bootloaders for phones on their network. This is especially relevant to the many, many users who are wise enough to not tinker with their phones because of lack of knowledge. They deserve the opportunity to safely replace the legacy operating system on their phone, and this will only be possible if the carrier and manufacturer allow it.
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This is an excellent point I had not considered. I was not thinking about the larger issue, (nor am I savvy with the upcoming CM installer). Unfortunately, I have run into a few companies that have seriously dummied down their products because, as one tech support person told me, "some users may have a problem with the advanced features so we removed them." While I can try and understand that point, it was really frustrating because some advanced features I had come to rely on were removed in the product upgrade. Simply because some people could not comprehend how to use it properly? Is Verizon trying to protect us from ourselves, dummy down the phones for "the uneducated masses," or simply trying to force their customers to live with Verizon-installed bloatware?
Okay I have My own say to this.!
Okay so I left AT&T network when I owned the HTC Inspire 4g and moved on to Verizon because there service was better in my area and I purchased the HTC Droid Incredible 4G LTE as my first phone with Verizon, I came to like the phone because it was fast, snappy, and good on battery....... But I constantly waited for update to jellybean ( Sense 4+ ) which in reality would make the device more efficient and smoother than it was on Ice Cream Sandwich... And finally I heard the news that we were going to get an update to jellybean in the beginning of 2013.. But after so much time of waiting I finally gave up hope and said ***k the device and went back to AT&T...... and bought the HTC One XL because it recieved updates to sense 5. The device is like an older sibling to the inc4g with close to the same specs. I sold the Incredible 4g because I hated the lack of support for this device... The only good thing going for it was CM10 and the amazing sense kernel. This community deserves more than what has been given to them so far... So my question is why Verizon drop support for us.???? If this community received jelly bean j defiantly would sell my XL and come back to this community......
This is my only my concern.
Sincerely,
24ky
Sent from my HTC One XL using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Here is a weird thought. let your money do the talking. leave Verizon. if enough of us leave we dont need to "change their minds". i brought this up in an HTC elevate detection not to long ago ( also how come htc bent over backwards because verizon wanted the bootload unlock for the ONE removed). instead of open letters or angry tweets and emails, just take your money to someone that appreciates you as a customer? put your money into a company that understands the development community and is willing to support you. how do you think verizon got so good? the used to listen to their customers. now that they are self sustaining they dont need to listen to us anymore. but i bet if their wallet was hit the would. they would bring back unlimited data, remove the block of google wallet, ect....
You wouldn't take your car to a mechanic that does great work but also makes you spend $$ money on things that don't need to be fixed.
my $.02
synisterwolf said:
Here is a weird thought. let your money do the talking. leave Verizon. if enough of us leave we dont need to "change their minds" i brought this up in an HTC elevate detection not to long ago. instead of open letters or angry tweets, just take your money to someone that appreciates you as a customer? put your money into a company that understands the development community and is willing to support you.
You wouldn't take your car to a mechanic that does great work but also makes you spend $$ money on things that don't need to be fixed.
my $.02
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This is my point from before. This is the only thing you can really do. I wish I could dump Verizon right now, but I can't. For now I'll just settle for never buying HTC again.
somerandomname1 said:
This is my point from before. This is the only thing you can really do. I wish I could dump Verizon right now, but I can't. For now I'll just settle for never buying HTC again.
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this too. maybe if HTC where to step in and help us it would be different.
OP not trying to troll or anything or start a war. i just wanted to get that out their. we do have an option to take our money somewhere else. or at least when this contract is over. ive said it before, i need unlimited data. i dont have wifi anywhere i work and im barely at home so if i have to give up my data plan i will give up my business too. im going to miss there unbeatable coverage but i cant stand to be hit in the balls over and over again with a smile on their face. :/
mdmower said:
I received the below e-mail today. I did not appreciate being contacted out of the blue via e-mail; if you feel the need to contact me, use XDA's tagging feature. With that said, I thought I'd reply in public with my thoughts on the matter, hoping to drive a constructive conversation about Verizon Wireless' restrictions for devices on their network. My initial response is in post 2.
Please, think through your responses before posting. Make sure they ADD to the conversation.
I will leave it up to the writer of the e-mail if he/she would like to make himself/herself known here.
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My 2 cents on this from bitter experience. You will get zilch. You will waste precious amounts of your life trying hard to convince a rigid management who can care so little they'd be happy to break your phone to pieces and hand you another from their stockpile of dinc4g's just to get rid of them ASAP. I've gone through the whole lot with BBB complaints etc. for the Droid X2 by Motorola. haha, wasted my life there. And the countless pleadings to release the ICS ROM that HTC clearly developed for the Dinc2 (Incredible S, international variant got the ICS update) only to get on the Verizon chopping block and get its head unceremoniously severed, taught me one thing and that is we as consumers have knowingly chosen this path, that will give us limited to no flexibility on customization to stay on VZW and we have to "deal" with it.
With all good intentions, I request all to keep your expectations rock bottom. You have better chances of going to the moon on a future Russian spacecraft than convincing Verizon as to why this may be a good idea.
Sincerely,
A disgruntled Droid™ user.
here has been my android experience. started on og inc oct 2010 first droid phone considered ''high-end'' at the time (8 mp camera saaaaay whaaaat??!) then dinc2 great phone but compared to the galaxy S II and the galaxy nexus at the time it was a ''mid range" phone. now with the inc4g it is very ''mid range'' compared to what is out now. the galaxy notes and s4's and the 50 different htc One(s). if you want many different roms to flash to fix your ''addiction'' go nexus or one of the mainstream phones. you will find 100 different "Unofficial CM10.X" roms with "user tweaks" and "kernel tweaks" that in all actuality are nothing more then a reposync from source. yeah they might have a few different mods but they are usually so similar that you will not/could not tell the difference. like someone mentioned earlier I would rather have a few solid roms. a good sense (viper) or if you're an aosp guy like me there's cm. I think anybody who saw the specs of this phone (incredible 4g) and thought, "hey this is going to be the next BIG THING." I'm sorry to tell you that you were mistaken. xda dev support of a phone is only as good as the devs that own the device, and in our case we have a very small amount of active devs.
So I am the a-hole that emailed mdmower. I apologize profusely. When I saw your first post, I almost slunk away in shame, never to show my face here again. I am not even being a little bit facetious. You do great work for a community of people and I abused (what obviously is) an important rule. And I'm really sorry.
In an attempt to redeem myself just a little bit, let me point out one thing that you might not know:
mdmower said:
Can you point to a single advertisement by either HTC or Verizon that the Droid Incredible 4G LTE would ever be included in HTCDev's unlocked bootloader program? Even HTC's generic advertisements include disclaimers that some devices may not be included due to various restrictions (the most obvious being carrier refusal) [SNIP] There is no legitimate complaint that can be filed towards Verizon concerning this matter since they never advertised this as an available feature.
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Actually, some states may have more favorable law here. First and foremost, many states have an unfair/deceptive business practices law that are distinct from the false advertising law. Example: New York has GBL Section 349 (trade practices), and 350 (Advertising). These are consumer-oriented statutes and so they have some bite.
On this point, while Verizon has never said they would provide us with Jelly Bean, there are some nice facts here like how many people were locked into 2 year contracts on a phone that Verizon stopped updating during their two year period. I've seen suggestions that Verizon is pulling this with older phones in order to force upgrades, and if true, that would be the basis for a claim. But here, I think the HTCDev unlock is actually pretty damning. We should be entitled to take discovery into the real reasons why Verizon forced HTC to remove the phone from the program. Given the repeated warnings about waiver of warranty, and the presence of other VZW phones in the program, it's hard to believe it's a support issue.
Finally -- of note is that the ACLU has filed an FTC complaint on this subject earlier this year. Unfortunately I cannot post the link since I just registered for this post (long time lurker) but it's the 2nd hit for "april FTC complaint android" (see pages 6-9) Their basis is the potential for security flaws which go unfixed. The relief they are requesting is pretty broad. I'm actually surprised that there haven't been follow-on civil suits already.
Anyway, I am really sorry again. I'm going to crawl back under the rock I came from now.
If it's any comfort: my punishment is that my D4INC is a flicker model.
PrimePalaver said:
If it's any comfort: my punishment is that my D4INC is a flicker model.
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Haha burn! Just kidding... it's cool.