Over the past month, Divine_Madcat and myself have seen a steady increase of new users join our forums. While this is a good thing, they all seem to suffer from the same thing... they cant read.
D_M and myself are constantly tending to reported posts (thank you BTW for those of you that do report posts to grab our attention to something that needs attending to) and threads. We seem to accumulate a lot of new threads which are basically questions like "How do I root my phone" or "I flashed 4.0.3 and now I cant make phone calls" or "How do I flash back to Stock?" which could have all been answers if two minutes were taken to look at the sticky threads...
We are in the process of trying to remedy this and have a few ideas up our sleeves. When more develops on this, we will let all of you know.
Speaking of Sticky threads, those are about to get a facelift too. Instead of having a huge plethora of sticky threads, we only need a few. Expect some new sticky threads to go up that encompasses the same information that is already there... it will now just be easier to see, refer to and be in one place.
Red5 said:
Speaking of Sticky threads, those are about to get a facelift too. Instead of having a huge plethora of sticky threads, we only need a few. Expect some new sticky threads to go up that encompasses the same information that is already there... it will now just be easier to see, refer to and be in one place.
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Good to hear, I always thought we had way too many stickies that just confuses people.
I think there should be a test to verify that you can read and use the search function before you are allowed to post. And a probationary period where if a mod catches you asking a stupid question, you get sent back to the tutorial.
Though to be accurate, like my old sergeant used to say, "There are no stupid questions, only stupid people who ask questions".
SmittyRN said:
Though to be accurate, like my old sergeant used to say, "There are no stupid questions, only stupid people who ask questions".
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LOL....i love this.
we have a quote on our wall at the office:
'You can't fix stupid'
It would be great if new users couldn't post for a month. They would then be forced to search for the answers they need.
As I said, we have a few options we are throwing around... determining on which ones are actually possible and can be done on XDA is still being planned out. However, something should come out of it that will help with this issue.
Yeah, the idiots that CAN'T EVEN READ THE DAMN STICKIES and then whine about why they were attacked for NOT READING THE DAMN STICKIES are frustrating.
There is, across the Internet, at least one piece of forum etiquette that is almost universal:
READ ALL STICKY THREADS BEFORE POSTING. Why can't users learn this?
Entropy512 said:
There is, across the Internet, at least one piece of forum etiquette that is almost universal:
READ ALL STICKY THREADS BEFORE POSTING. Why can't users learn this?
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We're going to try and beat that into Users who have 10 posts or less on one way or another.
Entropy512 said:
Yeah, the idiots that CAN'T EVEN READ THE DAMN STICKIES and then whine about why they were attacked for NOT READING THE DAMN STICKIES are frustrating.
There is, across the Internet, at least one piece of forum etiquette that is almost universal:
READ ALL STICKY THREADS BEFORE POSTING. Why can't users learn this?
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stop being mean and just give me a link that tells me the answer i am looking for....psha
First offense, they get rickrolled.... 2nd offense, 2 girls/1 cup.... 3rd offense, OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!!!
Don't change a thing. I need this place to counteract my chronic low blood pressure.
SmittyRN said:
First offense, they get rickrolled.... 2nd offense, 2 girls/1 cup.... 3rd offense, OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!!!
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I think we need to be aggressive - 2g1c on first offense.
Entropy512 said:
I think we need to be aggressive - 2g1c on first offense.
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+1 No mercy!!
Entropy512 said:
I think we need to be aggressive - 2g1c on first offense.
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I demand retribution for commonly asked questions. I say when someone asks for something that's searchable, give them a CWM flashable zip that changes all of their app's icons to 100% transparent and removes the app names under the icon. That'll show 'em!
I like to suggest making the stickies stand out more. Right now the only difference is the little pushpin, which I admit I miss sometimes myself. Yes they are at the top, but it always looks likes there's a ton of them.
Some grouping box around them that says "STICKIES!! - READ THESE BEFORE POSTING ANYTHING!"
Highlight them a different color or something even.
Granted, that probably requires forum coding, which I don't know if mods can do (not skill, just accessibility).
Just my opinion. Take it for what it's worth.
This is no different than the sign on a storefront that says "please use other door"... about half of the people will invariably try to walk in the locked / faulty door anyway.
I've seen this same thing on literally every forum I've ever been a part of so I for one look forward to seeing what the "powers that be" come up with to eliminate or at least minimize stupidity and redundancy once and for all.
SmittyRN said:
First offense, they get rickrolled.... 2nd offense, 2 girls/1 cup.... 3rd offense, OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!!!
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after the second offense...there would be no third...
alex4lex said:
after the second offense...there would be no third...
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I'm probably the only person in my gang that has never actually seen the vid. Everyone tried to get my to watch it, told me how gross it was, and I was like "why the frack would I want to watch it then?". To me, it's kinda like, "I think this milk is spoiled, taste this". Uhm, no thank you, I'll take your word for it.
A few things to consider -for a tough problem -
Moderators spend more time enforcing accurate post subjects. "Help Me" "I have a question" etc.
Close the stickies when they become redundant, off topic, or terminally "thanks", "that worked" etc.
A newcomer's forum. Those who want to help bring up the novices can check into this forum along with the newcomers helping each other out. Moderators can move posts that should be in this forum from forums where they don't belong. This could the "one month quarantine" forum for new registrants. Moderators could move posts to appropriate forums if the feel topic has wider appeal
A user moderation system like slashdot. slashdot isn't a question forum, but the user moderation system could be used for browsing over unwelcome posts tagged as newcomer, duplicate, etc
A forum that welcomes everyone and belittling of anyone for any reason isn't tolerated: hometheatershack. You will see newcomer questions handled only by those who really want to help; some members gently encourage newcomers to be more resourceful. The forum rules strongly encourage everyone to search around first. You will see the grizzled titan patiently answering the dumbass questions for the umpteeth time. Others obviously pass over them silently.
A middle ground like diyaudio, a forum populated by the world leaders in audio electronics. There is the occasional frustration at the newcomer but most just pass over or pitch in and keep teaching.
It is a tough issue. Just a few ideas from a long time forum user and newcomer to phone hacking. I've learned a lot from xda. Thanks!
Red5 said:
We're going to try and beat that into Users who have 10 posts or less on one way or another.
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I must admit I am guilty of this. The problem I have is while using the xda premium app , the search tool doesn't seem to let me search a specific forum , it searches all of xda. It is quite possible i am missing something but maybe this is something that can be changed in the app. Entorpy thanks for all your DD work, GTG thank you for unnammed , red and m.c. ty for being decent and understanding mods , and of course miami thanks for the criticism.
Related
I was wondering if someone knew off the top of their head where text under icons on the notification pull down come from. Are they hard code or pulled from a sys var. I want to delete them. If they are code in a file what is the file name?
I have looked in a few files and I have either missed it or have not looked in the right file yet. My eyes are going cross from reading hex code.
Thanks
It's within the twframework-res.apk. I have forgotten which xml though.
Questions of this nature should be asked in Q&A section.
good day.
chopper the dog said:
It's within the twframework-res.apk. I have forgotten which xml though.
Questions of this nature should be asked in Q&A section.
good day.
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Thanks. I'll go through there again.
I was going to put it in the Q&A but its not a general question. Since it is about dev. I went ahead and put it here. Sometime its hard to decide where to post a question.
Thanks again
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=979224
"Currently people are asking quite a few questions in the development section. Starting today (3/3/2011) any new question threads made in the development sections WILL be moved to the Q&A section without a redirect thread. DO NOT POST QUESTIONS IN THE DEV FORUM."
BrwnSuperman said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=979224
"Currently people are asking quite a few questions in the development section. Starting today (3/3/2011) any new question threads made in the development sections WILL be moved to the Q&A section without a redirect thread. DO NOT POST QUESTIONS IN THE DEV FORUM."
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And you needed to do this why? Make yourself feel like a mod? Some people need to grow up here. jeez
MSHancock said:
And you needed to do this why? Make yourself feel like a mod? Some people need to grow up here. jeez
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He needed to do it because you obviously still believed that this question belonged in the development forum. It doesn't, as pointed out without any flaming and in a totally innocuous way. As far as I can tell the only one who needs to grow up here is you.
You made a mistake, instead of defending that mistake in the face of irrefutable proof that you are wrong, just admit it and move on. You only make yourself seem more ignorant when you get upset that people are doing their best to keep posts where they belong. Your question was a good one, just please post it in the correct board next time so we can keep the development board open for development topics.
Nothing against you man, just really getting tired of people getting so pissed off when someone tells them they are in the wrong section.
I agree, my post was in the wrong section. I thanked chopper for pointing out where I should have put it. I went back and went over ashasaur's new posting rules and saw the section he posted way before BrwnSuperman posted it.
With that said
You get pissed when someone tells a OP they are in the wrong section
I get pissed when I see people standing in line to play mod and ***** at someone
How about we agree to disagree. Everyone has a different opinion and we are all here for the same reason.
MSHancock said:
I agree, my post was in the wrong section. I thanked chopper for pointing out where I should have put it. I went back and went over ashasaur's new posting rules and saw the section he posted way before BrwnSuperman posted it.
With that said
You get pissed when someone tells a OP they are in the wrong section
I get pissed when I see people standing in line to play mod and ***** at someone
How about we agree to disagree. Everyone has a different opinion and we are all here for the same reason.
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"I was going to put it in the Q&A but its not a general question. Since it is about dev. I went ahead and put it here. Sometime its hard to decide where to post a question."
You seemed a bit confused so I thought I would just point it out in the rules, I didn't add anything personal in.
MSHancock said:
You get pissed when someone tells a OP they are in the wrong section
I get pissed when I see people standing in line to play mod and ***** at someone
How about we agree to disagree.
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How about we agree to not let forum posts actually make us angry.
Real life is the only thing that requires an emotional response, not internet land.
Relax guys. Nobody has even insulted someone else's mother yet.
BrwnSuperman said:
"I was going to put it in the Q&A but its not a general question. Since it is about dev. I went ahead and put it here. Sometime its hard to decide where to post a question."
You seemed a bit confused so I thought I would just point it out in the rules, I didn't add anything personal in.
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Agreed. You didn't and I did by snapping at ya. For that I will say sorry.
I should have went over the new rules again since it had been awhile since my last post.
Just do what I, and many others here have done.. stop posting on XDA. It seems no matter where you post nowadays, it's the wrong section.
A development section where you can't talk about development, only announce your releases, which you must know how to do on your own, since you can't ask questions. But no app or theme releases, those go somewhere else where you can't talk about themes or apps. General, where you can't ask questions, only state factual things about anything not having to do with development, or apps, or themes, or other phones, or anything having to do with issues with your phone, especially your battery life, or a development release not working correctly, or anything somewhat resembling a request for an expert opinion, such as a release date.
In short, the rules here could easily be shortened to:
Don't post anywhere about anything. Welcome to XDA.
Caution: This post may be moved shortly, as it contains a welcome to a fellow XDA member, which may require it's placement in the XDA member chat section, or general, seeing as there are no questions, or Q&A, seeing as it answers a question, or maybe the main Android section, seeing as it has to do with the XDA forums. Either way, it
'll be in the wrong forum and I'll yet again get a long line of people hopping on the "wrong forum, asshat!" bandwagon.
Here is a tip from me to the entirety of internet users:
If you ever feel angry about someone who has "wronged" you on an internet forum, immediately call someone who doesn't use the internet as much as you (parents, significant other, non-techie best friend).
Now attempt to explain the situation to that person.
Or maybe just imagine doing this in your mind, because that's all it usually takes to realize how incredibly dumb you will then feel for getting angry about anything that happens on the internet.
Grandma: "...he told you your thread was in the wrong forum... and that makes you angry..."
You: "Ya... ok so it's a bigger deal than it sounds like. My reputation is at stake here."
Grandma: "What is a forum? Get their mothers' phone numbers and I'll have a stern talk with them."
GizmoDroid said:
Here is a tip from me to the entirety of internet users:
If you ever feel angry about someone who has "wronged" you on an internet forum, immediately call someone who doesn't use the internet as much as you (parents, significant other, non-techie best friend).
Now attempt to explain the situation to that person.
Grandma: "...he told you your thread was in the wrong forum... and that makes you angry..."
You: "Ya... ok so it's a bigger deal than it sounds like. My reputation is at stake here."
Grandma: "What is a forum? Get their mothers' phone numbers and I'll have a stern talk with them."
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Or in a logical, realistic way:
You: "I spent hours upon hours learning, testing, fixing, coding and sharing something, for zero income, just to have someone nix it all out in a heartbeat for some bull**** reason."
Grandma: "I would be upset, too"
If you think real people are not on the other end of your posts, you are the reason people get angry.
MSHancock said:
Agreed. You didn't and I did by snapping at ya. For that I will say sorry.
I should have went over the new rules again since it had been awhile since my last post.
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I retract my sorry!
I went through some of your post and you do seem to have a "WANNA BE MOD" problem. Your constantly telling people where things should go.
Domush said:
If you think real people are not on the other end of your posts, you are the reason people get angry.
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The only time anyone gets upset by what I say is when they read a tone into what I'm writing that wasn't my intention. I am encouraging the reader to being less sensitive when reading posts.
If you look in other threads, you will see that I encourage the writers of posts to be concise and straight-forward but patient with requests for help or when reporting problems, instead of demanding someone else to solve their problem. Instead of getting angry about it, I let them know about how inefficient their method of approaching the issue is, and try to encourage them to make posts that help the flow of information, instead of hinder it.
Personally, I'm offended more by the fact that negativity slows down development, then that someone said something that hurts my feelings. Positive, well written posts = Better, faster development.
Let's face it, there are a lot of people in this world who, when put behind the anonymous barrier of a computer screen, lose their minds and do nothing but slow everyone down. Those people suck, but you have to find a way to deal with them.
Most other times, its just a normal person who writes something in an ambiguous way, and another person is overly sensitive when reading. Unfortunately, in android land, it seems like we attract a higher percentage of the uncouth, immature crowd who run their mouth without stopping to think about how the other person might feel. Often times, these people are also the overly sensitive ones (but not always).
So while your point is true, it really didn't apply to what I was saying. I hope this post clears that up, and also encourages a healthy attitude towards communication between developers and users.
Our forums are just full of whiney bossy people. I suggest when someone tries to correct your "error"... dont respond (unless the error is device related of course) bc when the op gets defensive in any way the other posters feel they need to defend themselves. End result.... threads like this. It is quite obviously through any persons daily routine, some people we encounter cant/dont/wont follow instruction.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
Awesome.
Not only was the question in the wrong section (and still is...), it will now get closed by a mod once one of them gets off their ass.
And one more person who needs to add thei 2 cents. This thread should have been trashed a log time ago.
clap clap clap clap (awesome content people). ataranine (good trolling).
But anywho, @OP you might find it easier to grab a twframework-res.apk that has been edited the way you want and change images if need be. Because if you find the edit that needs to be done you will still need to contend with the position and size of the other elements of the quickpanel. i.e. Once text is gone the background image for the buttons will still be drawn to the same size as if text were there and if you do edit the way that image is drawn then the padding of all other elements will need to be edited. So the lazy way will prevail on this one. Kang it.
good day.
This is an humble request to the mods to please clean up the sticky threads in the dev forum.... there are just way too many and most of them answering the same questions...
In fact the other forums have the same problem so please take a sec or a minute or an hour but please clean that up
I feel like this has been posted before. Has it?
DDiaz007 said:
I feel like this has been posted before. Has it?
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idk... may be if we sticky it people will know
thesparky007 said:
idk... may be if we sticky it people will know
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Haha,
..
It has definitely been posted before but I think the thread was deleted... Or native it just died out and got buried. I'm not completely sure.
Sent by my Supercharged dual core from the 3rd Dimension
Going to get banned for this; there are some power tripping, terrible, over zealous moderators on xda. They don't clean the threads and people needing a delete/ban when they should, and delete too many that they shouldn't. As far as I am concerned just about anything in a general forum is fair game and anything to do with Android, or xda definitely is. For a community that exists to spread freedom of information, freedom of speech, and open source there are a few mods that silence anything that is criticism of a mod, senior member, or xda. It is really oppressive.
/rant off
The stickies are way over zealous. They are redundant in many cases, and obtrusive. There should be stickies of same or similar stickies combined and organized and the rest deleted. There are people that put hard work into making an organized thread that is a map and place for all other important threads and guides that aren't stickied. That type of thread has now been rendered worthless.
Do I think I could do a better job? Um, yes in nearly every case God yes. In some instances no. We have a few good mods that put a lot of time and effort into moderating, organizing, and keeping the peace [only where absolutely necessary], but sorry most of the mods are worthless. They don't do their job, and when they do, they either suck at it or just don't do it. I know how much time and work it takes to manage a large community, I have done it. Some mods just aren't any good though.
Let the flames begin!
bumpity bump
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1326221
You know, you could always PM them and ask about it. That may be a little bit more effective than creating a thread that is most likely going to be missed.
It seems like every other posted question or comment lately is answered with a smart ass remark or the op is insulted for an honest mistake or posting a question that they didnt realize had already been asked. Yes we know we need to read before posting. Sometimes people just want to ask the question from their point of view. If half of the replies would be helpful answers instead of insulting comments the forums wouldnt get jammed up with "repeat questions". For the most part people seem cool on here and Im just wondering what some others think of this?
Get your flame suit on cause you're about to get toasted for this thread.
But I agree with you. I'm kinda tired of the attitude here but this has been my home for 2 years and I don't plan on leaving. I wish people would drop the attitudes and be more helpful sometimes. It is what it is though. I just turn a blind eye to it.
Cheers
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
I dont care about being flamed. I see others get flamed all the time on here. If someone is going to post another smart ass comment to my post then they should not bother. I understand people are people and I am not going anywhere either. But it just gets old...
I've noticed, and I agree with you. Unfortunately, it seems as though our forum is slowly starting to turn into most others I've seen. Let's hope it doesn't get worse.
There is absolutely no use in the way some people respond. For some reason, they don't seem to realize that the time they wasted on creating a snarky remark took up more time than just passing the thread by. Usually, someone will be kind enough to provide help or direction. I understand the frustration some times, and think users should be educated on how to go about finding information that already exists. BUT, when it's done with an unnecessary attitude, or worse, attitude is given with no useful help, it accomplishes nothing. It creates an atmosphere that doesn't lend itself to building our community.
I'm normally really quiet on here unless I have some constructive comment or help those that are in need who really need it.
But, the main problem for all the noob question is the lack of direction for noobs to find the info they really need to seek out. Common problem on any type of forum, but is part of how community forums work. Microsoft's community does a good job in controlling this with great help with constructive help on posts given by the moderators and links from others who shared the same type of problem.
Just my 2 pence worth.
Simba501 said:
I've noticed, and I agree with you. Unfortunately, it seems as though our forum is slowly starting to turn into most others I've seen. Let's hope it doesn't get worse.
There is absolutely no use in the way some people respond. For some reason, they don't seem to realize that the time they wasted on creating a snarky remark took up more time than just passing the thread by. Usually, someone will be kind enough to provide help or direction. I understand the frustration some times, and think users should be educated on how to go about finding information that already exists. BUT, when it's done with an unnecessary attitude, or worse, attitude is given with no useful help, it accomplishes nothing. It creates an atmosphere that doesn't lend itself to building our community.
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You just hit the nail on the head!
capathy21 said:
It seems like every other posted question or comment lately is answered with a smart ass remark or the op is insulted for an honest mistake or posting a question that they didnt realize had already been asked. Yes we know we need to read before posting. Sometimes people just want to ask the question from their point of view. If half of the replies would be helpful answers instead of insulting comments the forums wouldnt get jammed up with "repeat questions". For the most part people seem cool on here and Im just wondering what some others think of this?
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The reason is that XDA is traditionally a DEVELOPER forum. Not a CONSUMER forum.
Yes, the original purpose of XDA has expanded, however back in the day, this site was mostly focused on technical issues. Rather than asking a simple and probably already answered question, *everyone* searched and searched again to find an answer. And if that didn't work, it was preferably to PM someone a question over starting a whole thread titled: "X thing that I'm trying to do doesn't work. Please help me!!! Sorry I'm a n00b!!!"".
There are no "stupid" question per se (though really, some folks around here push that boundary to its absolute limit), but there are plenty of already answered questions floating around. Even the OP's question/comment has been addressed millions of times before around here. Experienced XDA users get annoyed when people ask those same questions over and over again. And even though everyone says "I searched but couldn't find an answer for X", usually that's not really true. They may have quickly tried a single search term in the Vbulletin search, then probably gave up. They almost certainly haven't read the official XDA rules, and certainly haven't tried creative ways of finding the answer they are looking for.
This IS A DEVELOPER COMMUNITY. If you can't be bothered to try more than a few minutes of searching, then you are lazy, and it's not really worth the time of others to respond. Hence the flaming, and the anger, and the people attacking n00bs for already-answered questions. This is not a "community support forum" for those people who just picked up a new device and what to "r00tz that ****z" so they can play pirated games and tether for free. This is a community for people to work together on technical aspects of our amazing devices, and squeeze every drop of power from the silicon/glass/plastic devices we all love so much. Yes, people are people, not everyone will search properly, and yes, the majority user-base of XDA has changed a lot over the past 3-4 years. That doesn't mean you can just do whatever you want and not follow the clearly posted XDA rules. And it doesn't mean you have the right to post threads of "OMFG I can't believe how mean all these people who donate their time for free to the community are". Get over it. If you want to idly chat and whine about this that and the other, there are plenty of other places on the internet to do that. XDA is not the place.
Originally, there was very little hostility around XDA over stupid or silly threads. This was because they were so rare, and were often honest mistakes. I don't want to read about your whining and complaining about people being mean. You're right, I *could* just skip over the thread and not say anything (which, undoubtedly, many folks are given the responses so far). But you posted it in the Galaxy S2 i777 General Forum. This thread has nothing to do with the i777 GS2. Whine elsewhere, or be flamed. That's the long and short of it.
Good luck and welcome to XDA!
I have noticed this and commented on it in other threads also. The forum has went to **** the past few months.
I have been on this account for almost 3 years on here and 2 before that with another account so i have seen the changes. The reason there are so many newbs and questions is because Android and tablet use has exploded in the past year and half.
Sent from my SGH-I897 using xda premium
Agreed with OP, I am an active member on the NOOKcolor forum and I've tried to help newbies over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Yes, today newbie A asks a question, next week, newbie B ask the same question, and so on. Not only me but entire XDA members in NC room politely answering all and guide them through each step. Coming into this SGS2 room, geez, reading posts/responses really disappointed. Developers are great but power users seem to be God and expect every newbie has to know before asking. Duh, really?
I don't know if before they know about those stuff, when they were still newbie, didn't anyone showed them nicely step by step or just yelled at them like they do now
People can be assholes. Yes, most of the time it is uncalled for. i try to help when I can, because I hope someone will help me when I need it. But, at the same time, people need to learn to try to help themselves. See my sig.
We were all newbs at one point - even still, it's expected that everyone, newb and veteran alike are to read the rules and use the search function.
It's all well and good that someone makes an honest mistake by posting the same threads over again, but when it happens by every Joe Blow that comes in here, two or more times a week, and there's already 10 threads on the same topic, and said person never thought to use the search function, has **** grammar and syntax even asking their question or making a "Galaxy S II vs. ?" for the 18th time, it pisses those of us off that actually used our brain when we came here.
See, you got it all wrong: XDA wasn't made for you and I - it is a DEVELOPER'S forum. They were kind enough to let the average user sign up, expecting us to be knowledgeable enough not to be asshats that make a hundred of the same threads. Being self-entitled, thinking that the users who want to keep the developers actually developing, not answering bull**** questions for the 15th time are in the wrong for being firm, even harsh with people that don't, then there's the door. You either help the developers or get out of the way. If the developers or power users are kind enough to help answer certain questions once or twice, then count it as a blessing. DON'T even get mad when those people are then annoyed because the newb doesn't abide by rules or use their brain.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using xda premium
votinh said:
Agreed with OP, I am an active member on the NOOKcolor forum and I've tried to help newbies over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Yes, today newbie A asks a question, next week, newbie B ask the same question, and so on. Not only me but entire XDA members in NC room politely answering all and guide them through each step. Coming into this SGS2 room, geez, reading posts/responses really disappointed. Developers are great but power users seem to be God and expect every newbie has to know before asking. Duh, really?
I don't know if before they know about those stuff, when they were still newbie, didn't anyone showed them nicely step by step or just yelled at them like they do now
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When I was a n00b I read XDA for hours and hours before I would consider posting. And I tried very hard to read as much as possible before asking questions. That's how a n00b becomes a power user. By learning on their own. Plus, if asked with humility, and a sincere effort to "search before posting", you'll find people tend to not actually get flamed. It's only when people express their feeling of entitlement to an answer they could have probably discovered themselves that problems begin to brew...
Shammyh said:
The reason is that XDA is traditionally a DEVELOPER forum. Not a CONSUMER forum.
Yes, the original purpose of XDA has expanded, however back in the day, this site was mostly focused on technical issues. Rather than asking a simple and probably already answered question, *everyone* searched and searched again to find an answer. And if that didn't work, it was preferably to PM someone a question over starting a whole thread titled: "X thing that I'm trying to do doesn't work. Please help me!!! Sorry I'm a n00b!!!"".
There are no "stupid" question per se (though really, some folks around here push that boundary to its absolute limit), but there are plenty of already answered questions floating around. Even the OP's question/comment has been addressed millions of times before around here. Experienced XDA users get annoyed when people ask those same questions over and over again. And even though everyone says "I searched but couldn't find an answer for X", usually that's not really true. They may have quickly tried a single search term in the Vbulletin search, then probably gave up. They almost certainly haven't read the official XDA rules, and certainly haven't tried creative ways of finding the answer they are looking for.
This IS A DEVELOPER COMMUNITY. If you can't be bothered to try more than a few minutes of searching, then you are lazy, and it's not really worth the time of others to respond. Hence the flaming, and the anger, and the people attacking n00bs for already-answered questions. This is not a "community support forum" for those people who just picked up a new device and what to "r00tz that ****z" so they can play pirated games and tether for free. This is a community for people to work together on technical aspects of our amazing devices, and squeeze every drop of power from the silicon/glass/plastic devices we all love so much. Yes, people are people, not everyone will search properly, and yes, the majority user-base of XDA has changed a lot over the past 3-4 years. That doesn't mean you can just do whatever you want and not follow the clearly posted XDA rules. And it doesn't mean you have the right to post threads of "OMFG I can't believe how mean all these people who donate their time for free to the community are". Get over it. If you want to idly chat and whine about this that and the other, there are plenty of other places on the internet to do that. XDA is not the place.
Originally, there was very little hostility around XDA over stupid or silly threads. This was because they were so rare, and were often honest mistakes. I don't want to read about your whining and complaining about people being mean. You're right, I *could* just skip over the thread and not say anything (which, undoubtedly, many folks are given the responses so far). But you posted it in the Galaxy S2 i777 General Forum. This thread has nothing to do with the i777 GS2. Whine elsewhere, or be flamed. That's the long and short of it.
Good luck and welcome to XDA!
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Click to collapse
I did not post this to "whine". I posted it because if I am reading something I get sick of smart ass responses. It may have been a developer only forum at one time but it no longer is. I along with many other people here are in no way developers, but know a little bit about it compared to the average joe and want to learn more. I greatly appreciate the hard working devs who donate their time and genius minds so that we can get the most out of our devices. Its not my first rodeo on a device forum by any means. They are designed for people to help others and learn. There is no place for the attitude. Period.
Shammyh said:
The reason is that XDA is traditionally a DEVELOPER forum. Not a CONSUMER forum.
This IS A DEVELOPER COMMUNITY.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been on XDA for a little over a year, I think...ever since I got the captivate. I think I may have 1 or 2 posts in the development forum and 10 or 11 in the general forums. I have spent countless hours searching, reading, searching some more and reading some more until I got the answer I needed for my particular question. Almost 100% of the issues people ask about have been answered before.
That said, I think you're off of on a couple of your bolded comments. This is just as much of a consumer forum as it is a developers forum. The developers themselves have made it that way.
Nearly all google searches about android issues point to some XDA thread. Developers work hard and are often times compensated for their work (donations.) Although, I do not think the main driving force for their hard work is donations. They do it because they love it and they want to share their work with the CONSUMERS that frequent this site.
Flaming an unsuspecting consumer, who may not have done enough research on their own, into oblivion only has negative effects. That person may be a donator that decides to leave, for example. I've used the forum search on a number of occasions and to be honest, it is quite cumbersome...there is just so much data to go through. That doesn't stop me but it is quite frustrating some times.
I think a more effective strategy for dealing with consumers, who may not be as diligent at researching as most, would be to simply ignore the post. This will force them to do more research on their own. Now, you have a user who does more research on their own and you don't look like a ****.
Flaming is pointless. Those that do it are jerks.
Shammyh said:
When I was a n00b I read XDA for hours and hours before I would consider posting. And I tried very hard to read as much as possible before asking questions. That's how a n00b becomes a power user. By learning on their own. Plus, if asked with humility, and a sincere effort to "search before posting", you'll find people tend to not actually get flamed. It's only when people express their feeling of entitlement to an answer they could have probably discovered themselves that problems begin to brew...
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Click to collapse
Yup, in addition to one of the links in my sig being STRONGLY recommended reading:
Whenever I purchase a device, I always spend at least an hour or two a day for 2-3 days reading the forums for that device to learn its ins and outs before I post ANYTHING. Actually, in many cases, I do that before even purchasing.
XDA has clearly stated rules, and Rule #1 is to search before posting. In addition, any new users has to watch the infamous "Noob on XDA" video as part of the registration process now.
So there is NO excuse for not searching. Especially when a user posts a new thread with:
1) A question from the FAQ - it is there for a reason
2) A question that has already been covered in MULTIPLE topics that are still on the first 1-2 pages of the forum. It takes 30 seconds to skim through a page of thread titles - but users insist that someone else spend 2-3 minutes digging up a thread for them instead of spending a minute to read thread titles.
Yes, sometimes we can spend almost as much time on the flame - but at least that lets us relieve our stress at yet another user who thinks they deserve special treatment and doesn't have to follow the rules.
Edit: As to just ignoring a post - A user that didn't bother to search won't go away. They'll do something even more annoying like creating yet another NEW thread, posting a thread in Development because it wasn't answered in General or Q&A, or bumping their thread after only 12 hours. They only way they'll learn any lesson is to get a little toasty.
While donations are nice, the kind of user who comes with the kind of sense of self-entitlement that gets them flamed isn't going to donate anyway. Plus I could get quadruple the donations I've received in 3 months, and I'd still wind up with less than half a week's pay at my real job.
The amount of time one will spend searching and reading will be FAR less than the time you waste because you didn't read and screwed something up.
"Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, you feed him for life." (Yeah, I mangled that slightly...)
This is a DEVELOPERS forum, it always has been and always will be. Without developers, it's no different than Android Central or any other forum.
Ok there wouldnt be anyone giving noobs attitude if they just followed the rules. **** they even make you watch a video b4 becoming a member here. If you have a question chances are someone has already asked/answered it. There is a search bar for a reason. USE IT! If not the by all means go ahead and post Im 100% sure you wont get **** for it. They even have a suggested thread dropdown when creating a new one, hoping someone sees that there has already been a threat opened pertaining to that particular subject. Its frustrating to other uzers who read these fourms day in and day out seeing some kid with one post asking the same question someone had already posted 3 times now. simply put quit being lazy and search just like everyone else here has b4 they asked a question.
Shammyh said:
The reason is that XDA is traditionally a DEVELOPER forum. Not a CONSUMER forum.
Yes, the original purpose of XDA has expanded, however back in the day, this site was mostly focused on technical issues. Rather than asking a simple and probably already answered question, *everyone* searched and searched again to find an answer. And if that didn't work, it was preferably to PM someone a question over starting a whole thread titled: "X thing that I'm trying to do doesn't work. Please help me!!! Sorry I'm a n00b!!!"".
There are no "stupid" question per se (though really, some folks around here push that boundary to its absolute limit), but there are plenty of already answered questions floating around. Even the OP's question/comment has been addressed millions of times before around here. Experienced XDA users get annoyed when people ask those same questions over and over again. And even though everyone says "I searched but couldn't find an answer for X", usually that's not really true. They may have quickly tried a single search term in the Vbulletin search, then probably gave up. They almost certainly haven't read the official XDA rules, and certainly haven't tried creative ways of finding the answer they are looking for.
This IS A DEVELOPER COMMUNITY. If you can't be bothered to try more than a few minutes of searching, then you are lazy, and it's not really worth the time of others to respond. Hence the flaming, and the anger, and the people attacking n00bs for already-answered questions. This is not a "community support forum" for those people who just picked up a new device and what to "r00tz that ****z" so they can play pirated games and tether for free. This is a community for people to work together on technical aspects of our amazing devices, and squeeze every drop of power from the silicon/glass/plastic devices we all love so much. Yes, people are people, not everyone will search properly, and yes, the majority user-base of XDA has changed a lot over the past 3-4 years. That doesn't mean you can just do whatever you want and not follow the clearly posted XDA rules. And it doesn't mean you have the right to post threads of "OMFG I can't believe how mean all these people who donate their time for free to the community are". Get over it. If you want to idly chat and whine about this that and the other, there are plenty of other places on the internet to do that. XDA is not the place.
Originally, there was very little hostility around XDA over stupid or silly threads. This was because they were so rare, and were often honest mistakes. I don't want to read about your whining and complaining about people being mean. You're right, I *could* just skip over the thread and not say anything (which, undoubtedly, many folks are given the responses so far). But you posted it in the Galaxy S2 i777 General Forum. This thread has nothing to do with the i777 GS2. Whine elsewhere, or be flamed. That's the long and short of it.
Good luck and welcome to XDA!
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Click to collapse
And it's the responses like this that go on this 'better than you' mentality trip that are starting to make it not as enjoyable. It's a crock of crap. XDA wouldn't be as big as it is had it stayed strictly a developer community. And the devs wouldn't get as many donations either. I do agree that there are some that abuse that 'New Thread' button. But in all honesty, the search feature on forums isn't that great. Also, some of the contributing members here didn't start out knowing what they're doing. They aquired that knowledge here. So instead of flaming, giving a [email protected] comment, or telling then how to fix it, why don't more people 'teach them to fish'. I may not know a ton about the SGSII, but I sure try to help anyone I can. I am, however, probably one of the most knowledge people on here when it comes to the automotive field. You can only imagine the crazy stuff people come up with to ask on the auto forums, but I've never just blew them off cause they couldn't find it using search. I've just found it and pointed them the right direction. And if the info isn't out there already, I try to explain to them the mechanics behind it to try to educate them a little more than they already are. I can't stand the ones that just spit out some action to try with no explination as to why to try this or that. At some point, that extra knowledge may come in handy and hopefully save that person some coin on getting their transportation back on the road. So having said that, why don't we all get a long and help each other out? I initialy came here looking for help, but I stuck around because of the great community. I'd hate to see people never come back because of a few people ruining the atmosphere of the community.
bigblue95z said:
And it's the responses like this that go on this 'better than you' mentality trip that are starting to make it not as enjoyable. It's a crock of crap. XDA wouldn't be as big as it is had it stayed strictly a developer community. And the devs wouldn't get as many donations either. I do agree that there are some that abuse that 'New Thread' button. But in all honesty, the search feature on forums isn't that great. Also, some of the contributing members here didn't start out knowing what they're doing. They aquired that knowledge here. So instead of flaming, giving a [email protected] comment, or telling then how to fix it, why don't more people 'teach them to fish'. I may not know a ton about the SGSII, but I sure try to help anyone I can. I am, however, probably one of the most knowledge people on here when it comes to the automotive field. You can only imagine the crazy stuff people come up with to ask on the auto forums, but I've never just blew them off cause they couldn't find it using search. I've just found it and pointed them the right direction. And if the info isn't out there already, I try to explain to them the mechanics behind it to try to educate them a little more than they already are. I can't stand the ones that just spit out some action to try with no explination as to why to try this or that. At some point, that extra knowledge may come in handy and hopefully save that person some coin on getting their transportation back on the road. So having said that, why don't we all get a long and help each other out? I initialy came here looking for help, but I stuck around because of the great community. I'd hate to see people never come back because of a few people ruining the atmosphere of the community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Uhh, most of the developers and users here couldn't care less how "big" XDA is. And second, as Entropy512 pointed out, most devs don't care tremendously about donations. Yea, when I really like something, or have some extra cash, I'll kick a developer a few extra bucks. But it's not really about donations or popularity. And I don't think a single Dev here is actually living off of the donations from XDA users...
And further... if you check my post history, you'd see I in fact do try to "teach people to fish" all the time. And more often than not, I'll just answer a n00b question rather than flame. And yes, the Forum search isn't the best, hence why a Google "site:xda-developers.com YourSearchTermHere" is a useful alternative.
XDA is not a n00b friendly forum. If you're a new user looking to learn about Android or phones or whatever for the first time... there are other places to do that. It's called "xda-DEVELOPERS" for a reason.
Devs have holier that thou attitudes. They act like they shouldn't be bothered by stupid nub questions. Yet they feel compelled to answer them and ***** about doing so...
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using xda premium
use the search function and this will not happen.
/thread
10. You will be flamed if you post a question that could have been solved with a little effort searching.
9.1 Most questions can be answered with a little effort searching
9. Unlocking your phone will void your warranty for software issue claims and maybe hardware issues as well. (Nobody knows for sure--which means anything you do is at your own risk.)
8. It is easy to unlock the bootloader. Go to Htc.dev to do so.
7. There are not too many DEVS right now but those who are here rock it for free and they don't have time to answer stupid posts like, how do you flash a kernal or is this going to void my warranty.
6. DEVS and Moderators are no longer spoonfeeding us answers.
5. Using fastboot is easy. Read. Reread. Then reread again. I was convinced that I was right and spent 18 hours repeating the same stupid mistake. Turns out I can read and write an appellate court brief but I can't read three lines of a post.
4. I am more than double the age of one of the most active developers....and I'm still a young man at 37.
3. Of all the time I spend searching for answers half of it is wasted sifting through duplicate posts from people asking the same question another noob had just finished asking.
2. My wife hates my phone.
1. There is no S-OFF so F-OFF if you post a question about it.
And you also double counted 9
Ha, and I felt old compared to some of the people in these forums(I'm 30)..
Question about number 5 - what makes you say using fastboot is easy? Outside using the flashboot command for a few things, that was one of the things I found the least info about..
And yea, I agree with number 3. The worst part is the answer is usually "use the search button".. if even once in a while they just answered the damn question, me using the search wouldn't take so (#*%ing long! Considering I will find 30 different posts asking the question before I ever find the answer.. sigh.
Oh, and number 2 made me laugh. I have no wife, but pretty sure my roommate is starting to hate it
Post of the day for me!
It's nice to see some other non-nooby noobs around.
Hey dude, nice move, that post of yours!
Really surprised about number 2 tho- thought I'm the only one with a wife that has a problematic attitude towards my addiction...
Sent from my TBD Runny 3.1
Silentbtdeadly said:
And yea, I agree with number 3. The worst part is the answer is usually "use the search button".. if even once in a while they just answered the damn question, me using the search wouldn't take so (#*%ing long! Considering I will find 30 different posts asking the question before I ever find the answer.. sigh.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the second person who had the same question as someone else used search instead of just asking it, he would have an answer. And the third, and the fourth, and the 5th, and the 30th, etc.
Sent from my HTC Amaze 4G using xda premium
hasoon2000 said:
And you also double counted 9
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Click to collapse
That's why I made it 9.1.
Sent from my HTC Amaze 4G using XDA App
I LMAO at #4 I'm 65, rooted my Motorola Cliq 2yrs ago, didn't even know these kind of places existed lol. And I agree with read,read,read,reread and read again. Thanks for a nice article
More truths...
alrosal said:
10. You will be flamed if you post a question that could have been solved with a little effort searching.
9.1 Most questions can be answered with a little effort searching
9. Unlocking your phone will void your warranty for software issue claims and maybe hardware issues as well. (Nobody knows for sure--which means anything you do is at your own risk.)
8. It is easy to unlock the bootloader. Go to Htc.dev to do so.
7. There are not too many DEVS right now but those who are here rock it for free and they don't have time to answer stupid posts like, how do you flash a kernal or is this going to void my warranty.
6. DEVS and Moderators are no longer spoonfeeding us answers.
5. Using fastboot is easy. Read. Reread. Then reread again. I was convinced that I was right and spent 18 hours repeating the same stupid mistake. Turns out I can read and write an appellate court brief but I can't read three lines of a post.
4. I am more than double the age of one of the most active developers....and I'm still a young man at 37.
3. Of all the time I spend searching for answers half of it is wasted sifting through duplicate posts from people asking the same question another noob had just finished asking.
2. My wife hates my phone.
1. There is no S-OFF so F-OFF if you post a question about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I commend you for being so brave uncovering the 'truth'. However, there are still some more truths hidden beneath the XDA dungeon. What I am about to disclose must be kept here for the obvious safety reasons...
0.0. The 'Search' button is NOT as effective as those so called 'experts' want you to believe. In fact, when they say 'use the search button', they are essentially telling you (i.e. 'noobs') to 'just give up and try something else'.
0.1. The 'Search' button works perfectly if you KNOW what you're looking for. If you have no clue what the answer (for what you're looking for) might be, the search will only give you a list of some random threads which you go through for a while and eventually give up. When an expert says, "Here, I searched for you," he probably already knew the answer and used that 'key word' to get the right post, in order to make you look stupid.
0.2. There is an 'advanced' option in 'Search', which may or may not work well for noobs (hint: a sward with double edge).
0.3. Searching is a form of art. You'll need some intelligence to appreciate its effectiveness, which most noobs have not acquired. If they do have such level of intelligence, then they are no longer called 'noobs' by definition.
0.4. Most experts were noobs once when they started, but they earned the honoray title by not asking the same question that the noob next to him asked 10 minutes ago.
0.5. Noobs asking hundreds of 'stupid questions' are called Senior Members.
0.6. Reading (and reading (and reading (and reading))), after all, is the only effective medicine for noobs.
0.7. Seriously, we should require all OP's to indicate [Solved] in front of thread titles when they got an answer to their question. How often do you re-read old threads when people add a new comment to a 'beaten-up' question? Binary??
0.8. 'Search' functions in forums have not advanced in the last few decades. I'm 51 with 30 years of IT background, and, still, I am finding this subject interesting enough to post my own version. Someone, please stop me before I get banned for uncovering the secrets.
0.9 Maybe it's time to develop a good wiki page for the Amaze... though there's no guaranty that people who need it the most would ever visit such place.
Questions??
ringochan said:
I commend you for being so brave uncovering the 'truth'. However, there are still some more truths hidden beneath the XDA dungeon. What I am about to disclose must be kept here for the obvious safety reasons...
0.0. The 'Search' button is NOT as effective as those so called 'experts' want you to believe. In fact, when they say 'use the search button', they are essentially telling you (i.e. 'noobs') to 'just give up and try something else'.
0.1. The 'Search' button works perfectly if you KNOW what you're looking for. If you have no clue what the answer (for what you're looking for) might be, the search will only give you a list of some random threads which you go through for a while and eventually give up. When an expert says, "Here, I searched for you," he probably already knew the answer and used that 'key word' to get the right post, in order to make you look stupid.
0.2. There is an 'advanced' option in 'Search', which may or may not work well for noobs (hint: a sward with double edge).
0.3. Searching is a form of art. You'll need some intelligence to appreciate its effectiveness, which most noobs have not acquired. If they do have such level of intelligence, then they are no longer called 'noobs' by definition.
0.4. Most experts were noobs once when they started, but they earned the honoray title by not asking the same question that the noob next to him asked 10 minutes ago.
0.5. Noobs asking hundreds of 'stupid questions' are called Senior Members.
0.6. Reading (and reading (and reading (and reading))), after all, is the only effective medicine for noobs.
0.7. Seriously, we should require all OP's to indicate [Solved] in front of thread titles when they got an answer to their question. How often do you re-read old threads when people add a new comment to a 'beaten-up' question? Binary??
0.8. 'Search' functions in forums have not advanced in the last few decades. I'm 51 with 30 years of IT background, and, still, I am finding this subject interesting enough to post my own version. Someone, please stop me before I get banned for uncovering the secrets.
0.9 Maybe it's time to develop a good wiki page for the Amaze... though there's no guaranty that people who need it the most would ever visit such place.
Questions??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I almost laughed myself out of my chair with 0.5
I know a lot of "senior members" that give out bad information and it only makes things worse. But don't think they get away with it for long! As a "senior member" I hold them to a much higher standard. Many members are post addicts just for that title though. We moderators call them "post pumpers." They tend to post a lot of off-topic stuff and ask really stupid questions. Then they give inaccurate information and I have to come in and save the day. Then of course when I see this type of activity I will demote the senior member down to junior member by removing all irrelevant and inaccurate posts. This is a quick way to piss off a post pumper.
In regards to the search feature. The feature is really active if the developers and OP's tag their posts with keywords. Example. Some good keywords for this thread would be 'NOOB' 'GUIDE' 'HELP ME' etc. There are a lot of theads without tags.
ringochan said:
I commend you for being so brave uncovering the 'truth'. However, there are still some more truths hidden beneath the XDA dungeon. What I am about to disclose must be kept here for the obvious safety reasons...
0.0. The 'Search' button is NOT as effective as those so called 'experts' want you to believe. In fact, when they say 'use the search button', they are essentially telling you (i.e. 'noobs') to 'just give up and try something else'.
0.1. The 'Search' button works perfectly if you KNOW what you're looking for. If you have no clue what the answer (for what you're looking for) might be, the search will only give you a list of some random threads which you go through for a while and eventually give up. When an expert says, "Here, I searched for you," he probably already knew the answer and used that 'key word' to get the right post, in order to make you look stupid.
0.2. There is an 'advanced' option in 'Search', which may or may not work well for noobs (hint: a sward with double edge).
0.3. Searching is a form of art. You'll need some intelligence to appreciate its effectiveness, which most noobs have not acquired. If they do have such level of intelligence, then they are no longer called 'noobs' by definition.
0.4. Most experts were noobs once when they started, but they earned the honoray title by not asking the same question that the noob next to him asked 10 minutes ago.
0.5. Noobs asking hundreds of 'stupid questions' are called Senior Members.
0.6. Reading (and reading (and reading (and reading))), after all, is the only effective medicine for noobs.
0.7. Seriously, we should require all OP's to indicate [Solved] in front of thread titles when they got an answer to their question. How often do you re-read old threads when people add a new comment to a 'beaten-up' question? Binary??
0.8. 'Search' functions in forums have not advanced in the last few decades. I'm 51 with 30 years of IT background, and, still, I am finding this subject interesting enough to post my own version. Someone, please stop me before I get banned for uncovering the secrets.
0.9 Maybe it's time to develop a good wiki page for the Amaze... though there's no guaranty that people who need it the most would ever visit such place.
Questions??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do not earn not to be a noob by asking 100's of questions, in fact, if you look at my posts before I started helping out this forum I pretty much had everything down, by reading, I was using my N1 for 2 years and I had to read read read read and read more everywhere not just xda to learn what everything was and how to do things.
With S-On things are a little different but, if you start reading and researching on your own, you'll learn a lot...see how many posts I have in october and november of 2010 when I rooted my Nexus one!! First time I ever rooted an android. all my posts just say thanks and I really don't ask questions; I had approximately 10 posts. In july I had some hardware questions and obscure questions regarding galaxy tab 10.1 since it was so new and could not find info online. !! by then I was familiar enough to root my galaxy tab 10.1 and very familiar with almost everything...still learning today!!! If you look at before november when I got my phone and started helping out the forum, I barely have any questions. sure, I might have had a stupid one here or there, but I did not ask 1000's of questions to not become a noob. I still don't consider myself to be a pro like binary and some others here!!!
seansk said:
You do not earn not to be a noob by asking 100's of questions, in fact, if you look at my posts before I started helping out this forum I pretty much had everything down, by reading, I was using my N1 for 2 years and I had to read read read read and read more everywhere not just xda to learn what everything was and how to do things.
With S-On things are a little different but, if you start reading and researching on your own, you'll learn a lot...see how many posts I have in october and november of 2010 when I rooted my Nexus one!! First time I ever rooted an android. all my posts just say thanks and I really don't ask questions; I had approximately 10 posts. In july I had some hardware questions and obscure questions regarding galaxy tab 10.1 since it was so new and could not find info online. !! by then I was familiar enough to root my galaxy tab 10.1 and very familiar with almost everything...still learning today!!! If you look at before november when I got my phone and started helping out the forum, I barely have any questions. sure, I might have had a stupid one here or there, but I did not ask 1000's of questions to not become a noob. I still don't consider myself to be a pro like binary and some others here!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't call myself a pro by any means. However I take time to read something that I don't understand. That taught me that in grade school. But lemme ask you this. How would I look if I was to wander into another forum with my several thousand posts and 500+ "thanks" and ask what they would consider a stupid noob question? Instant bad reputation!
I wonder if I can get admin privledges to rename some titles from Senior Member to Senior Noob. In fact it should go like this. Junior Noob (10-25 stupid questions), Noob (25-50 stupid questions), Senior Noob (50-100 stupid questions), Noob Forever (100+) and the questions being asked can be voted on by other members. That way even a Senior Member (like myself) can still be elected as a noob if I was to ask at least 10 stupid questions. So if you see someone with 5,000+ posts and is rated as a Senior Noob... maybe keep looking.
Binary100100 said:
I don't call myself a pro by any means. However I take time to read something that I don't understand. That taught me that in grade school. But lemme ask you this. How would I look if I was to wander into another forum with my several thousand posts and 500+ "thanks" and ask what they would consider a stupid noob question? Instant bad reputation!
I wonder if I can get admin privledges to rename some titles from Senior Member to Senior Noob. In fact it should go like this. Junior Noob (10-25 stupid questions), Noob (25-50 stupid questions), Senior Noob (50-100 stupid questions), Noob Forever (100+) and the questions being asked can be voted on by other members. That way even a Senior Member (like myself) can still be elected as a noob if I was to ask at least 10 stupid questions. So if you see someone with 5,000+ posts and is rated as a Senior Noob... maybe keep looking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This thread is funny, entertaining, true and slightly wonderful. I don't want noob forever!
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using XDA App
jjlean said:
This thread is funny, entertaining, true and slightly wonderful. I don't want noob forever!
I'm just happy that we are all having a good conversation. A lot of bad attitudes in some of the other threads.
I agree that the search feature is not great but it did force me to learn. Perhaps we should have a thread where noobs can post questions and feel safe. Hell, I'll start it. Nothing too technical but if only noobs read it we can help each other. Might give mods a break. Call it "Yo fellow noob- ask your stupid question here first before you post in another thread. It will become a filter of sorts."
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alrosal said:
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Okay so I proved that I'm a noob forever by somehow quoting my own post.
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I could call the thread "hey! Are you looking at my noobs."
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Improving XDA's Search function
Binary100100 said:
I almost laughed myself out of my chair with 0.5
I know a lot of "senior members" that give out bad information and it only makes things worse. But don't think they get away with it for long! As a "senior member" I hold them to a much higher standard. Many members are post addicts just for that title though. We moderators call them "post pumpers." They tend to post a lot of off-topic stuff and ask really stupid questions. Then they give inaccurate information and I have to come in and save the day. Then of course when I see this type of activity I will demote the senior member down to junior member by removing all irrelevant and inaccurate posts. This is a quick way to piss off a post pumper.
In regards to the search feature. The feature is really active if the developers and OP's tag their posts with keywords. Example. Some good keywords for this thread would be 'NOOB' 'GUIDE' 'HELP ME' etc. There are a lot of theads without tags.
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Hey, I'm glad you had a good laugh with my post. I read somewhere else that you had a bad day, so it's a good sign you still hadn't lost the sense of humor.
Actually, though, my intention for posting was more serious than to make people laugh. As you mentioned, for the search feature to work well, we need discipline. The system is just not smart enough yet to become noob-proof. You need to add tags, name thread title properly, consolidate and delete duplicates and inaccuracies (by mods like you), etc.etc.
BTW, I just found out that any one CAN add tags to threads opened by someone else. I just added 'noob' and 'guide' to this thread. 'help me' was rejected because the word 'help' was too common, it said.
Now, if we can request some new features to the XDA management, here's my take...
Question Thread Status: 'Actively Waiting for Answer', 'Answered but Needs More Info', 'Solved', 'Abandoned', etc.
Answer Post Rating: 'Best Answer', 'Additional Question', 'Additional info', etc.
Smart Post Tracking: 'Info in this post is Current/Obsolete', 'Supersedes/Superseded-by Post #999', etc.
Sub-Threads: Questions related or refers to certain threads can be nested so that they appear grouped together. It's similar to the 'Threaded Mode' but at the thread level.
Enhanced 'Threaded (Display) Mode': The current implementation of the 'Threaded Mode' is not useful, IMO. I want to see the entire page nested instead of just the post titles in a small window.
I don't think I need to explain but if someone up there is interested, I will for sure.
Binary100100 said:
I don't call myself a pro by any means. However I take time to read something that I don't understand. That taught me that in grade school. But lemme ask you this. How would I look if I was to wander into another forum with my several thousand posts and 500+ "thanks" and ask what they would consider a stupid noob question? Instant bad reputation!
I wonder if I can get admin privledges to rename some titles from Senior Member to Senior Noob. In fact it should go like this. Junior Noob (10-25 stupid questions), Noob (25-50 stupid questions), Senior Noob (50-100 stupid questions), Noob Forever (100+) and the questions being asked can be voted on by other members. That way even a Senior Member (like myself) can still be elected as a noob if I was to ask at least 10 stupid questions. So if you see someone with 5,000+ posts and is rated as a Senior Noob... maybe keep looking.
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Reputation certainly is a motivation for SOME people, not for EVERYONE (sigh...). The 'Noob meter/status' is a good one. But how we (the commoners) can vote/rate someone else's questions without causing confrontations?
alrosal said:
Okay so I proved that I'm a noob forever by somehow quoting my own post.
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Fortunately, you didn't ask a stupid question to qualify for the noob status. Make all your mistakes before they actually implement the 'Noob Meter'!!!
seansk said:
You do not earn not to be a noob by asking 100's of questions, in fact, if you look at my posts before I started helping out this forum I pretty much had everything down, by reading,
.....
...still learning today!!! If you look at before november when I got my phone and started helping out the forum, I barely have any questions. sure, I might have had a stupid one here or there, but I did not ask 1000's of questions to not become a noob. I still don't consider myself to be a pro like binary and some others here!!!
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My point exactly. I want the forum search function to be better so that people like you can learn and help others much more easily than it is now. History has proved many times that 'noobs who don't read' will stay 'noobs forever' even if you give them the best tool available on the planet.
jjlean said:
This thread is funny, entertaining, true and slightly wonderful. I don't want noob forever!
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using XDA App
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As I said above, you can only be 'noob forever' by not reading. As soon as you read through the thread and felt 'funny', you proved yourself to be a non-noob. And when you thought it to be true, you proved yourself to be a pro!! Hehe.
alrosal said:
I could call the thread "hey! Are you looking at my noobs."
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If I were you, I would change the OP title to 'Unveiling the Secrets of Searching' because that's exactly what you started with this thread (at least with some bullet points).
I'm glad that Binary is with us on these discussions. Some mods would object to these, I know. At least, we are being heard by a non-noob!
ringochan said:
snip snip snip
...I'm glad that Binary is with us on these discussions. Some mods would object to these, I know. At least, we are being heard by a non-noob!
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Of course! I'm a member too you know! It's not like I'm an XDA Automated Bot or anything.
I put my pants on like everyone else (not that I've been paying any attention to anyone dressing or anything.)
Yes I was having a bad day... couple of them actually. But I got (what I call) justice and closure. I'm satisfied with the result of the conflict and I'm moving on. Not everyone will be (or is) satisfied with the result but whatever. They can give over it.
0.5. Noobs asking hundreds of 'stupid questions' are called Senior Members.
Questions??[/QUOTE]
Hey,I resemble that remark!
I like small noobs with hard bipples, (sorry couldn't stop myself)
Amazingly awesome post!
So, I'm going to wait until the official ICS update appears for my SII. (supposedly 19th of March)
However, I still want root without flashing a custom kernel. (not wanting to increment the custom flash counter)
My understanding is that if I update to the official ICS update then the usb jig becomes useless in resetting the counter. Is that correct?
The current method I used to root was via superoneclick, however.. that no longer works with ICS right?
If for example I wanted to reset the counter (if I did use a custom kernel for root) could I downgrade from the official ICS back to GB (using odin) and then use the usb jig to reset it?
NB. I use root for titaniumbackup, adaway and lbe privacy guard.
About half of what you've written is incorrect, and you can find the correct information from a little bit of searching and reading.
FORUM RULES
1. Search before posting.
oinkylicious said:
About half of what you've written is incorrect, and you can find the correct information from a little bit of searching and reading.
FORUM RULES
1. Search before posting.
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Huh, that's the second post I've seen of yours that is entirely unhelpful.
You can only do so much searching and this sub-forum is called "Q&A"...
AFAIK you don't need to flash a GB Rom to make usb jig work you can just flash an old bootloader and usb jig should work like a charm after that
You got that response because this question is answered several times a day on here. And the answer can be easily found with a few minutes legwork. XReal is correct. You can flash the old bootloader & a jig will work. So it looks like you've got a bit of research/searching (to find said bootloader) to do.
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
Huh, that's the second post I've seen of yours that is entirely unhelpful.
You can only do so much searching and this sub-forum is called "Q&A"...
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MistahBungle said:
You got that response because this question is answered several times a day on here. And the answer can be easily found with a few minutes legwork. XReal is correct. You can flash the old bootloader & a jig will work. So it looks like you've got a bit of research/searching (to find said bootloader) to do.
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Still, there was no need for it. A better response would have been to either choose not to respond or post with a link to a post answering the questions. XDA has been getting a very bad reputation because of posts like the above. (hell I've been a lurker on here for quite a while opting instead to read information and posts rather than posting because of the above)
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
Still, there was no need for it. A better response would have been to either choose not to respond or post with a link to a post answering the questions. XDA has been getting a very bad reputation because of posts like the above. (hell I've been a lurker on here for quite a while opting instead to read information and posts rather than posting because of the above)
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Its getting a bad rep because people refuse to search and clog the forums up with already answered questions
There's even a sticky in general saying don't create ice threads...people still do it
This is a development forum, not a spoonfeed n00bs & lazy people whatever they demand forum. And it certainly isn't a democracy. If people want to gain anything from their time here, they need to read & learn.
People who don't like that can go to Sammobile for all I (and a lot of people here) care.
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
Still, there was no need for it. A better response would have been to either choose not to respond or post with a link to a post answering the questions. XDA has been getting a very bad reputation because of posts like the above. (hell I've been a lurker on here for quite a while opting instead to read information and posts rather than posting because of the above)
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Darkside Agent said:
Its getting a bad rep because people refuse to search and clog the forums up with already answered questions
There's even a sticky in general saying don't create ice threads...people still do it
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Sure, people are posting ICS threads in general. Sure, there are people who are a bit ignorant but nothing is achieved by being rude. If it's been said a million times then don't post, let the thread die rather or until a mod locks it.
As to the bad rep, yep.. it's definitely because of people saying "use search" or "noobs". If you like I'd be perfectly happy to provide some examples? (oops, can't post urls at the moment until I've hit 8 posts)
There is a level of people keeping up with information and using search. And people who don't keep a constant watch on threads. (hence my post, I can't say I'm too enthusiastic about trawling through endless posts.. I did a bit of reading and searching, wasn't 100% sure so I thought I'd post in a question and answer sub-forum)
Anyway, I've derailed my own thread enough. xReal gave me the confirmation I was after.
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
As to the bad rep, yep.. it's definitely because of people saying "use search" or "noobs".
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its got nothing to do with that at all
Like i said, its because people refuse to search, refuse to read and refuse to educate themselves. Everyone just wants spoonfeeding.
Why do people insist on opening a new ICS thread when they could just ask their question in an existing thread? Theres plenty of them....it because people WONT search - they want the answer there and then like its something they deserve
Darkside Agent said:
its got nothing to do with that at all
Like i said, its because people refuse to search, refuse to read and refuse to educate themselves. Everyone just wants spoonfeeding.
Why do people insist on opening a new ICS thread when they could just ask their question in an existing thread? Theres plenty of them....it because people WONT search - they want the answer there and then like its something they deserve
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To be fair, search is pretty bad unless you know the exact terms to search for. And reading through threads can often span a significant number pages. People see those gigantic threads and can only read so much before they become either frustrated or disillusioned.
Pretty often I've just resorted to using google site search because it gives better results than the inbuilt site search. This is a problem endemic of all large forums.
Of course there are poorly worded, poorly thought out posts where the person has not read or searched. But nothing is ever achieved by jumping up and down whilst screaming about noobs and demanding they use search. In less time than it took to post about noobs and using search a reply could have been formed linking to a thread with the answer or simply it could have been left to die with all the chaff posts.
To be fair, search is pretty bad unless you know the exact terms to search for. And reading through threads can often span a significant number pages. People see those gigantic threads and can only read so much before they become either frustrated or disillusioned.
Pretty often I've just resorted to using google site search because it gives better results than the inbuilt site search. This is a problem endemic of all large forums.
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yep the search is bad on here, using google with XDA added in the search terms works fine though and provides 95% of required results
In less time than it took to post about noobs and using search a reply could have been formed linking to a thread with the answer or simply it could have been left to die with all the chaff posts.
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OR, if they read up themselves, they wouldnt have to wait for an answer or get flamed from other users...it works both ways.
The only reason you are seeing so many 'use the search function' posts is because these inane threads with questions that have already been asked ans answered pop up more now than any other kind of thread...put it this way....i no longer come to this forum to garner knowledge/info/mods/techniques or anything like that anymore, i just come here to see what other useless threads have been created and what the responses were to said thread...its becoming entertaining as well as frustrating (theres also a reason why a lot of oinkylicious' recent posts contain the copied pasted section from the forum rules:
1. Search before posting
If people aren't doing this, then they are breaking forum rules and should be given a 'vacation'
Darkside Agent said:
yep the search is bad on here, using google with XDA added in the search terms works fine though and provides 95% of required results
OR, if they read up themselves, they wouldnt have to wait for an answer or get flamed from other users...it works both ways.
The only reason you are seeing so many 'use the search function' posts is because these inane threads with questions that have already been asked ans answered pop up more now than any other kind of thread...put it this way....i no longer come to this forum to garner knowledge/info/mods/techniques or anything like that anymore, i just come here to see what other useless threads have been created and what the responses were to said thread...its becoming entertaining as well as frustrating (theres also a reason why a lot of oinkylicious' recent posts contain the copied pasted section from the forum rules:
1. Search before posting
If people aren't doing this, then they are breaking forum rules and should be given a 'vacation'
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Again, if people weren't so eager to be so rude this site would be much less frustrating for everyone involved. Case in point look at the tag added to this thread or oinkylicious' post. Not helpful to anyone in the least.
If someone can't contribute to a thread in a useful manner then don't post. The post rate is of a relatively high ratio that it'll quickly disappear into the ether.
And again, people can only do so much searching and reading. As you yourself said the site search is pretty bad and posts can often span a significant number of pages making reading up nigh on impossible unless you spend an inordinate amount of time obsessing over everything. You can't expect people to know everything.
I promised an example url earlier. Since I'm still not at 8 posts, I'll post it without the "http://" and hope the filter doesn't pick it out: pay.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/pse0m/rant_about_xda_short_and_angry_but_bear_with_me/
There is one heck of a lot of valid criticism in there.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1501719
this should work
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
Again, if people weren't so eager to be so rude this site would be much less frustrating for everyone involved. Case in point look at the tag added to this thread or oinkylicious' post. Not helpful to anyone in the least.
If someone can't contribute to a thread in a useful manner then don't post. The post rate is of a relatively high ratio that it'll quickly disappear into the ether.
And again, people can only do so much searching and reading. As you yourself said the site search is pretty bad and posts can often span a significant number of pages making reading up nigh on impossible unless you spend an inordinate amount of time obsessing over everything. You can't expect people to know everything.
I promised an example url earlier. Since I'm still not at 8 posts, I'll post it without the "http://" and hope the filter doesn't pick it out: pay.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/pse0m/rant_about_xda_short_and_angry_but_bear_with_me/
There is one heck of a lot of valid criticism in there.
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Bunch of whiny users in that link you posted. And the important word here is 'users'.
You, like a lot of people are clearly under the misapprehension that XDA is a users forum. It is not. It is a development forum where users are tolerated provided certain 'rules' are adhered to by said users.
On XDA, developers come first, second, third, fourth, fifth and seventh. People who are prepared to read, learn and put in a bit of effort beyond searching for 20 seconds & throwing their hands in the air because they can't find something come sixth. And people who demand everything to be given to them on a silver platter don't figure into the equation whatsoever.
And your criticisms are completely invalid in the case of the question you asked, the answer is easily found in a minute in spite of XDA's crappy search facility (anyone who has been here more than 5 minutes knows to use Google with XDA appended to search terms). Why ? Because it's asked on here several times a day.
You can keep on digging a hole for yourself if you want tho.
Edit to add - Looks like it's your lucky day that I have fat fingers :-|
EvilMonkeySlayer said:
Again, if people weren't so eager to be so rude this site would be much less frustrating for everyone involved.
Maybe but this is a developers forum not a fix my phone forum .
Search may well be hard but as 90% of troublesome posters dont even bother to read the stickies faqs or guides dont mind reading the posts on the page they post on why should they be helped .
You asked
My understanding is that if I update to the official ICS update then the usb jig becomes useless in resetting the counter. Is that correct?
Its been asked multiple times their is even a post covering the topic .
First post on Google
http://forum.xda-developers.com/archive/index.php/t-1296161.html
You asked
f for example I wanted to reset the counter (if I did use a custom kernel for root) could I downgrade from the official ICS back to GB (using odin) and then use the usb jig to reset it?
Yet another question that has been answered multiple times .
Noobs come on here and get help all the time but their is a massive uprising by those that actually take the time to help against the ones that totally ignore the rules and demand everything dumped in their lap . If you where one of a few you would have got an answer but you are one of many sadly for this forum and its getting worse day by day .
jje
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MistahBungle said:
Bunch of whiny users in that link you posted. And the important word here is 'users'.
You, like a lot of people are clearly under the misapprehension that XDA is a users forum. It is not. It is a development forum where users are tolerated provided certain 'rules' are adhered to by said users.
On XDA, developers come first, second, third, fourth, fifth and seventh. People who are prepared to read, learn and put in a bit of effort beyond searching for 20 seconds & throwing their hands in the air because they can't find something come sixth. And people who demand everything to be given to them on a silver platter don't figure into the equation whatsoever.
And your criticisms are completely invalid in the case of the question you asked, the answer is easily found in a minute in spite of XDA's crappy search facility (anyone who has been here more than 5 minutes knows to use Google with XDA appended to search terms). Why ? Because it's asked on here several times a day.
You can keep on digging a hole for yourself if you want tho.
Edit to add - Looks like it's your lucky day that I have fat fingers :-|
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If you can't address the points and complain about "whiny users" and so forth then why are you replying?
If this site was dedicated to purely developers then there would be a number of things for said developers. Namely things like an instance of bugzilla or other software for bug tracking and git (or something else like cvs *spit*) repositories for development to ensure versions and code submitting are kept on top of.
The fact that there are Q&A, Accessories etc sub-forums rather than just forums for development only counters your assertion.
Honestly, who is digging the hole? The ones who use Ad hominems and fail to address a single point or the ones raising the criticism?
You keep replying, so surely something I'm saying is quite valid.
A quick example of what a former mod classes this forum as;
link
Yes searching is in the rules and needs to be complied with, the problem most with non searchers is that they make the search harder as people search same thing and get another useless post asking the question and not the informative answers that they want.........!
Thread closed.