[Q] Lost in Device Manager Trying to Downgrade from 12b to 10b - Verizon LG G3

Hello wise XDAers....
Ok so my goal is to get my new vs985 12b to CM12 or something cooler. So first step I need to downgrade the phone in order to root. I've been trying to follow the instructions here http://www.androidrootz.com/2014/07/how-to-unroot-lg-g3-all-variants.html?m=1 but I seem to be stuck at step 4 - getting the phone to be recognized by Windows in firmware update mode. I have tried 3 Windows 7 machines and a VM W7 machine. Granted the 3 machines are similar HP laptops. I think they are all 64 bit. I don't have a COM/LPT in the Device Managers, not after showing hidden devices and there does not seem to be a BIOS setting which affects.
In firmware update mode I've got yellow flags on CDC serial, lge android phone and vs985 4g. Are these even the right and complete list of device manager items I am to install? I'm hoping one of these I can edit to get the COM port setup? Some have said to enable debug mode or ethernet USB mode - but these options are only available in normal boot mode in the phone; I did try and turn on debug nonetheless (though it was greyed out, it did seem to check the box??) and I could not find ethernet mode. I do see some posts on the internet that others seem to lack this option, perhaps in 12b it was removed. Further it does seem that many new machines lack a COM/LPT port, so I don't know if there is a way to emulate this or if the drivers for the LG set this up? I am using the LG's dedicated usb cord and have tried multiple usb ports.
I am trying the Windows drivers available on the LG support page for the phone but there also seems to be Verizon LG drivers. Not sure if I am supposed to use one or both or if once installing it one or the other it screws things up and how you are to remove? The VZ drivers seem to be removable under "uninstall programs" but not the LG drivers. I also have been trying to get Windows update to auto install the drivers, but does not seem to work. Here are the two I have been trying:
LGUnitedMobileDriver_S51MAN313AP22_ML_WHQL_Ver_3.13.2.exe
LG_VZW_United_WHQL_v2.14.1.exe
Am I doing this all wrong? Is there an easier way? Help!

Hi, just a quick reply that's not all inclusive as I'm at work and I'm going to hurry. You don't have to bother uninstalling the regular drivers. Installing the Verizon drivers is what you need to do, and it'll be fine if you installed the other drivers first. I'll try to get back about the rest of your post later.

roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Hi, just a quick reply that's not all inclusive as I'm at work and I'm going to hurry. You don't have to bother uninstalling the regular drivers. Installing the Verizon drivers is what you need to do, and it'll be fine if you installed the other drivers first. I'll try to get back about the rest of your post later.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks roirraW "edor" ehT! I've got the LG_VZW_United_WHQL_v2.14.1.exe installed now, so I guess the issue is in firmware update mode I've got yellow flags on CDC serial, lge android phone and vs985 4g. On my virtual machine w7 I do have a lpt/com in device manager, but none of those 3 items are in that parent item. I guess if I figure out how to install them properly, they might "go under" the lpt/com parent entry? I've tried all the USB ports and tried rebooting the phone and computer several times. Tried letting Windows update search for drivers to update (if you rmb/properties on these items with yellow flags it says the driver is not installed despite the installed Verizon drivers). Not sure what else to do.

OK! Think I figured it out! Got the right device installed with the latest Vzw driver from LGs site - seems to be version 20.

abexman said:
OK! Think I figured it out! Got the right device installed with the latest Vzw driver from LGs site - seems to be version 20.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Excellent! Glad to hear it. I couldn't resist coming back to try to give you more ideas (I was going to suggest rebooting with the phone unplugged, and then plug it back in). I work with VMs a lot so that aspect interested me.
Cheers!

roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Excellent! Glad to hear it. I couldn't resist coming back to try to give you more ideas (I was going to suggest rebooting with the phone unplugged, and then plug it back in). I work with VMs a lot so that aspect interested me.
Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks mate! I am not out of the woods yet - now having an issue in the flash tool, posted here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/verizon-lg-g3/help/q-t3035198

Related

[Q] Need some unbricking recommendations...

I might have missed the perfect advice in searching here and there, but I couldn't find it, so I'm asking here.
I tried applying a nightly build for Cyanogen for Vibrant and now the phone is basically bricked.
It starts up, shows the Vibrant logo, brightens a bit, then shows a screen that in a second or two fills with random color noise, then restarts. This cycle repeats until I pop out the battery.
My model apparently won't respond to vol/power keypress combos to activate recovery or download mode so that was out.
I bought a microUSB jig and was able to get in download mode but ODIN doesn't ever recognize it.
I tried the adbtool to send it into recovery but it doesn't see the phone either.
I tried the AIO Vibrant Toolbox to reinstall drivers/odin/etc and it didn't help.
Finally just watching device manager seems to indicate that plugging it in and out doesn't absolutely nothing. Windows XP never sees a connection. I tried on a Windows 7 machine with similar results.
Any suggestions? Out of warranty so that means no replacement.
Thanks.
Kermit Woodall
Since you flashed cm7 you will need to install the Nexus S drivers. The regular Vibrant drivers will not work so that is likely why ODIN wont recognize the device. If you can get into download mode you shouldn't be hard bricked. Here is a link to download the Nexus S drivers (I believe this is the one I used)
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8116690/Nexus S drivers.zip you might have to manually install this.
jordanjf86 said:
Since you flashed cm7 you will need to install the Nexus S drivers. The regular Vibrant drivers will not work so that is likely why ODIN wont recognize the device. If you can get into download mode you shouldn't be hard bricked. Here is a link to download the Nexus S drivers (I believe this is the one I used)
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8116690/Nexus S drivers.zip you might have to manually install this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. If you are able to enter into Download Mode, you aren't bricked (unless you have a really really really bad luck).
This was extracted from the CM7 Q&A Thread on the Q&A section:
atinm said:
Q: Where can I get the Nexus S drivers?
A: Download and install the Android SDK here then download "Google USB Driver package, revision 4"
Once downloaded, right click on "Computer", "Manage", "Device Manager", "Nexus S", "Update Driver Software", and point it to wherever you isntalled the SDK
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also, if the above fails, the member connexion2005 offers unbrick services, and he seems to be good at it, he have a website and everything, just shot me a PM if you need the link to the website.
djluis48 said:
This. If you are able to enter into Download Mode, you aren't bricked (unless you have a really really really bad luck).
This was extracted from the CM7 Q&A Thread on the Q&A section:
Also, if the above fails, the member connexion2005 offers unbrick services, and he seems to be good at it, he have a website and everything, just shot me a PM if you need the link to the website.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Djluis, Good write up and assist...........
Thanks - I did try the above but when my phone is connected via USB the computer doesn't react at all. It's like I haven't plugged anything in. My other phone, a Nexus One, is recognized though.
Any ideas on how to force the install of these drivers before I have to pay connexion2005 for his services?
Thanks.
Kermit Woodall
Uninstall Samsung drivers, reboot PC, install drivers from aio box found in sticky thread or from samsung website. It should work. Also try heimdall if odin still doesn't work.
Sent from samsung vibrant
Tried the uninstall - no luck.
One issue... I'm not sure that USB Debugging Mode was selected before this all started. Could that be my problem?
Kermit Woodall
Hi,
try a different usb port and different usb cable
No luck. I suspect that this unit has a slightly bad USB port as well. Fortunately unbricking is affordable so that's what I'll have to do.
Thanks everyone for your advice.
K
kwoodall said:
No luck. I suspect that this unit has a slightly bad USB port as well. Fortunately unbricking is affordable so that's what I'll have to do.
Thanks everyone for your advice.
K
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
go to best buy, get a blackberry or HTC usb cord. most if the "bad" usb ports are the sh*T%y korean cords ( not knocking the people, just the company )
Thanks - I actually tried several USB cables - including some HTC and a Motorola one. None worked w/the phone - but worked fine with any other phone.
K

[Q] LG P769 Security Error (Using Win8.1

I have searched (I have 12 tabs open as I type) these forums. I see a few similar cases but I am not finding a solution. I have use CMHENDRA's guides but I am having no luck. (It is my daughters phone so I will give you what information I know) BTW, I contribute in the Note II galleries, I have rooted and flashed HTC One X, Several Nexus 7's, my Note II, Galaxy SII, Galaxy S, HTC Sensations, Nexus 4 and a few older ones. I can currently see all those phones on my laptop. Not the L9.
I believe my son tried to flash CWM for my daughter. She is notoriously rough on phones and he was trying to make sure she was protected. The phone boots into the LG Security Error screen. I can get it to boot into S/W Upgrade mode. I have completed or can complete all the steps to most of the guide. I CANNOT get my Win8.1 laptop or my sons Win7 laptop to recognize the phone to complete any of the guides. B2C, Fastboot, etc. I can see various entries in the Device Manager, I uninstall and reinstall with Driver Signing turned off. I have now reached the point where I have done so many things that I have probably confused myself.
When it did get the security error, the software had been set to USB Debugging and Unknown Sources was allowed. The firmware was 20H. B2C cannot get the phone information (I know it is probably the drivers as is everything else).
Any help, ideas, etc. would be great. I would love to be a hero for my daughter.
dsore1218 said:
I have searched (I have 12 tabs open as I type) these forums. I see a few similar cases but I am not finding a solution. I have use CMHENDRA's guides but I am having no luck. (It is my daughters phone so I will give you what information I know) BTW, I contribute in the Note II galleries, I have rooted and flashed HTC One X, Several Nexus 7's, my Note II, Galaxy SII, Galaxy S, HTC Sensations, Nexus 4 and a few older ones. I can currently see all those phones on my laptop. Not the L9.
I believe my son tried to flash CWM for my daughter. She is notoriously rough on phones and he was trying to make sure she was protected. The phone boots into the LG Security Error screen. I can get it to boot into S/W Upgrade mode. I have completed or can complete all the steps to most of the guide. I CANNOT get my Win8.1 laptop or my sons Win7 laptop to recognize the phone to complete any of the guides. B2C, Fastboot, etc. I can see various entries in the Device Manager, I uninstall and reinstall with Driver Signing turned off. I have now reached the point where I have done so many things that I have probably confused myself.
When it did get the security error, the software had been set to USB Debugging and Unknown Sources was allowed. The firmware was 20H. B2C cannot get the phone information (I know it is probably the drivers as is everything else).
Any help, ideas, etc. would be great. I would love to be a hero for my daughter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't get mine to work either. Closest thing I've gotten is using omap4boot-for_optimus-v1.21
its different from some of the others, in that its a blue background and it doesnt actually list the p769. However, after selecting option 5, and following onscreen instructions, I was able to get my front capacitive buttons to light up, but nothing else. I can't enter S/W upgrade mode, I can't get LG recovery tool to recognise my phone, I am absolutely **** out of luck. I dont know if using omap4boot-for_optimus-v1.21 will help or hurt you, but im just explaining my experiences.
Have you installed the omap driver for fastboot?
Thanks for your replies. Windows 8.1 is installing the OMAP driver and when I try to update it, Windows says it has determined that I have the best one installed already or some BS like that. That seems to be the last piece of the puzzle. I am not getting it to use the fastboot commands and when I am in the LG upgrade thing, it cannot connect on the first of the three calls so it says to check the USB cord and connection. ( I have tried 5-6 cords including the OEM cord ).
Thanks again for your help. I will uninstall the OMAP drivers when I get home and see if I can't get the ones I downloaded to install.
I don't have Windows 8.1 so I'm not sure how to address the driver issue. I reer as wel.commend you uninstall the driver, both of them. The one under Android Phone in the device manager and the one called TI Boards in the device manager.
1. Uninstall all OMAP drives (Two of them)
2. Disconnect from the internet (to preventing Windows update from selecting its own driver.
3. Follow steps to fastboot. When connecting your phone have device manager open and right click the device that is flashing on and off (you will see the device manager refreshing and stuffs. It will dissappear after about two seconds but if you get the right click in and the option to install the driver, do it, point to the fastboot driver.
4. Disconnect phone after driver install and pull the battery.
5. Fastboot again, using option 1.
6. Quickly install same driver on the new device in device manager. Be quick.
7. Disconnect, Pull battery
8. Fastboot again
9. Flash ICS U and X
10. Make sure your LG drivers are installed.
11. Reboot PC.
12. Now you should be able to get into SW UPGRADE MODE with the plugging in of the USB
Should not lock up at 15%, make sure you have drivers installed for this.
13. Should work and reboot to home screen automatically.
14. If you really must, fastboot again and install JB U and X
dsore1218 said:
Thanks for your replies. Windows 8.1 is installing the OMAP driver and when I try to update it, Windows says it has determined that I have the best one installed already or some BS like that. That seems to be the last piece of the puzzle. I am not getting it to use the fastboot commands and when I am in the LG upgrade thing, it cannot connect on the first of the three calls so it says to check the USB cord and connection. ( I have tried 5-6 cords including the OEM cord ).
Thanks again for your help. I will uninstall the OMAP drivers when I get home and see if I can't get the ones I downloaded to install.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've heard fastboot (and several other programs) aren't working on Windows 8. You need windows 7
Sent from my LGMS769 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

[Q] My G3 Isnt coming up in windows when in Download Mode

So I made the stupid desicion to update over the air and now I am attempting to get back to 10B So I can root my phone. However when my phone is in download mode my computer will not recognize it. I am on Windows 8 (If it makes a difference) and have tried both USB ports and everything. I have done this once So I know it works, but it wont let me do it again for some reason. Please help! I have installed and reinstalled drivers a bunch, and everything!
Claythegreat said:
So I made the stupid desicion to update over the air and now I am attempting to get back to 10B So I can root my phone. However when my phone is in download mode my computer will not recognize it. I am on Windows 8 (If it makes a difference) and have tried both USB ports and everything. I have done this once So I know it works, but it wont let me do it again for some reason. Please help! I have installed and reinstalled drivers a bunch, and everything!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you checked in Device Manager, specifically, to see if it comes up there? If it does, does it recognize that the device has the drivers loaded?
If you haven't already, try a different cable? Reboot the computer?
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Have you checked in Device Manager, specifically, to see if it comes up there? If it does, does it recognize that the device has the drivers loaded?
If you haven't already, try a different cable? Reboot the computer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does come up, but under "Other Devices" and with Yellow Triangles on them signifying there are no drivers, but I installed Drivers!
Claythegreat said:
It does come up, but under "Other Devices" and with Yellow Triangles on them signifying there are no drivers, but I installed Drivers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The driver's from here http://www.lg.com/us/support-mobile/lg-LGVS985? It's a common mistake if not. There's a driver package somewhere that (I think) is for all the other G3 variants - it has a version number starting with 3, and then there's this one specific for our G3 - the version number starts with 2. I have no idea if that version number of the package corresponds to the version number seen in Device Manager, sometimes for various things on the computer, they're not the same, especially when there's multiple entries for various things in Device Manager all for one device.
You don't have to uninstall the wrong drivers. Install this one with your phone unplugged, reboot the computer after just because, and then open Device Manager and plug in your phone and see if the drivers load. If they don't or they still have yellow triangles, then there's some other problem going on with your Windows.
It can take 5-10 minutes total to load the drivers the first time, once you plug in the phone, but it should tell you almost immediately that it's trying to load the drivers with a notification icon in the right of the taskbar. You can double click it for progress.
Ignore any of this you already know.
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
The driver's from here? It's a common mistake if not. There's a driver package somewhere that (I think) is for all the other G3 variants - it has a version number starting with 3, and then there's this one specific for our G3 - the version number starts with 2. I have no idea if that version number of the package corresponds to the version number seen in Device Manager, sometimes for various things on the computer, they're not the same, especially when there's multiple entries for various things in Device Manager all for one device.
You don't have to uninstall the wrong drivers. Install this one with your phone unplugged, reboot the computer after just because, and then open Device Manager and plug in your phone and see if the drivers load. If they don't or they still have yellow triangles, then there's some other problem going on with your Windows.
It can take 5-10 minutes total to load the drivers the first time, once you plug in the phone, but it should tell you almost immediately that it's trying to load the drivers with a notification icon in the right of the taskbar. You can double click it for progress.
Ignore any of this you already know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah these are not the drivers I had installed. Im installing them now and it seems to be working! Thank you so much!
Claythegreat said:
Yeah these are not the drivers I had installed. Im installing them now and it seems to be working! Thank you so much!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great! I'm glad it seems to have been something easy. Just search for "VS985" on LG's website and go to the support page whenever you're looking for the latest drivers.
Glad to have helped!
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Great! I'm glad it seems to have been something easy. Just search for "VS985" on LG's website and go to the support page whenever you're looking for the latest drivers.
Glad to have helped!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never mind its working!!! Thank you so much for your help!
Claythegreat said:
Never mind its working!!! Thank you so much for your help!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool! Whew! If I might request, please add back in your original text to your post above so when others search for the same problem (obviously not your original problem), they'll find out that it might still be working after all. Thanks for updating, it's good to know something worked completely.
You're welcome again!
Well it did work! But when using LG Flash tool 2014 my phone is stuck at %7.. Have you any experience with this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Cool! Whew! If I might request, please add back in your original text to your post above so when others search for the same problem (obviously not your original problem), they'll find out that it might still be working after all. Thanks for updating, it's good to know something worked completely.
You're welcome again!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh it just took a while before it went
For future reference
[How to fix] Windows 8/8.1 is not detecting my LG G3 device
TonyStark said:
For future reference
[How to fix] Windows 8/8.1 is not detecting my LG G3 device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting! Thank you! I'll have to thank your post later from TapaTalk.

Unable to connect to G3 using adb on Tesla Rom 5.1.1 Arc_Flash 101715 release

So after flashing 10/17/15 release of Tesla Arc_Flash I am unable to connect to the phone through adb without deleting the driver and adding it as an adb device. I have installed the LG G3 Verizon drivers but I am still not able to connect. In the device manager it shows that the drivers aren't there but also that they are there as a portable device. hxxp://tinypic.com/r/30ua82f/8
Also the command prompt is below. Brand new adb server started.
hxxp://tinypic.com/r/71myr4/8
Any help would be appreciated. If you need logs or anything else I am happy to provide it. Also since I feel this may get asked... Yes I have USB Debugging turned on. Have tried with Root for adb on and off and nothing seems to work. I can get it to connect through network but I don't want to constantly have to look for the IP address and port. This was also an issue in the previous release of Arc_Flash so please let me know.
Hi! Exactly what drive did you install and where did you get it from? Here is where I get the driver from http://www.lg.com/us/support-mobile/lg-LGVS985. Try rebooting the PC (without the phone connected) after installing the driver. Using the original cable that came with it, connect the phone to a different USB 2.0 port than you had tried previously - it can take up to 10 minutes to finish loading the driver. When it's complete Device Manager should have a listing for the phone in the Modem section, which isn't currently listed in your screenshot. Until you can get that solved you won't be able to reach it with adb.
Have you searched the Tesla ROM thread to see if anyone else has had the issue, in case it's specific to Tesla?
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Hi! Exactly what drive did you install and where did you get it from? Here is where I get the driver from. Try rebooting the PC (without the phone connected) after installing the driver. Using the original cable that came with it, connect the phone to a different USB 2.0 port than you had tried previously - it can take up to 10 minutes to finish loading the driver. When it's complete Device Manager should have a listing for the phone in the Modem section, which isn't currently listed in your screenshot. Until you can get that solved you won't be able to reach it with adb.
Have you searched the Tesla ROM thread to see if anyone else has had the issue, in case it's specific to Tesla?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I searched the ROM thread but found nothing matching what I am experiencing but I followed everything even close to it. I installed those drivers just now and restarted both computer and phone. Still comes up as an unknown driver. There is no modem section inside of the computer still. I can manually add the drivers but it still doesn't seem to help.
Also to add. I also have tried to add it as a modem and it gives Windows Error code (10) that it can not start the driver. I forgot to mention. Windows 10.
Well, I've connected to my phone via adb and used the LG flash tools on Windows 10 last week or the week before, although I have my insider updates set to Fast Ring and I kinda regret it because there was a recent huge push of a beta Windows, and they've broken how I had my video associations set up and I can't get my subtitles to work any more either. Sorry for off topic. My point is since Windows 10 is considered a constant "change in progress", and especially for people like me who joined to get "insider" builds, it's hard to tell what makes things not work. My main reason for even being on Windows 10 is to see what they come up with in their insider builds, but I guess when it mucks with my video enjoying ability, I start losing my patience.
I would seriously consider trying a different PC, or if you have the capability of performing a fresh Windows installation, even of Windows 10, that very possibly would fix it. Or if you just recently, within the last 30 days, upgraded from an earlier Windows to Windows 10, and didn't perform a clean installation, you can revert the upgrade through the the Windows settings. No idea if reverting would solve the problem, either, though.
As @bweN diorD pointed out in another similar thread just yesterday or the day before, when someone in your situation ends up trying a different PC, then everything goes smoothly. As far as the cause, there's too many variables.
If you can't use anyone else's PC, there's an outside chance that you could even do it at a library computer, as long as you don't reboot the PC (which I usually recommend after initially installing the driver, but sometimes things work fine without that). Rebooting a library PC usually undoes all changes, putting it back exactly the way it was.
Let us know how you make out.

LG G5 Bootloop

Hi there,
I recently bought a cheap lg G5 from eBay which said it was stuck on a bootloop. The seller said they weren't very tech savvy and I decided to give it a try, seemed fun. I have never done this before, so when searching on Google I stumbled upon threads saying it should be rather easy to fix by using LG Bridge and let it recover/repair the installation. However, after installing LG Bridge and LG Drivers from their website , every time I boot the phone in Download mode and it progresses into a firmware updating screen, my Windows 10 64bit fails to connect the device properly and prompting me with the following message:
USB device not recognized.
The last USB device you connected to this computer malfunctioned, and windows does not recognize it.
And in device manager it shows "Unknown USB Device (Device Descriptor Request Failed).
Is there anything I could try? Is it fixable like I thought?
Bump, anyone? Im stumped but would love tot learn about this
yointed said:
Bump, anyone? Im stumped but would love tot learn about this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have never had the experience to get a bootloop but my guess is that you have some driver problems, thats why its not well recognised by your computer.
Try to check if there is a youtube tutorial with some links to the drivers related to the G5.
Sorry if this isnt very helpful, but its the best I can add to this topic.
---------- Post added at 07:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:28 AM ----------
Pistacho123Lol said:
I have never had the experience to get a bootloop but my guess is that you have some driver problems, thats why its not well recognised by your computer.
Try to check if there is a youtube tutorial with some links to the drivers related to the G5.
Sorry if this isnt very helpful, but its the best I can add to this topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or try with another pc running windows 7, maybe your OS and compatibility is the problem!
Definitely a driver issue! I had a similar problem with moto x4! It was not being recognised by my pc! Uninstalling the previous usb driver fixed it for me! Try to remove any remnants of drivers you might have installed previously.
Thank you for the replies. I also thought it would be a driver issue, however I have already tried uninstalling and reinstalling the LG drivers for the LG G5 multiple times and I did not get it to work. Unfortunately, I do not have a Windows 7 computer. Would it be possible to install windows 7 solely for this, without a license key?
yointed said:
Thank you for the replies. I also thought it would be a driver issue, however I have already tried uninstalling and reinstalling the LG drivers for the LG G5 multiple times and I did not get it to work. Unfortunately, I do not have a Windows 7 computer. Would it be possible to install windows 7 solely for this, without a license key?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you can find a copy of it some where. You can use it for like 30 days or so before activation.
I do not know any coding, and have never even rooted a device, but i had this problem with stock rom 8.0, tried looking into flashing new stock rom installed all the drivers, still couldnt connect to pc. After 4 days with no phone i thought id throw my other battery in it, it booted up perfectly like it was out of the box, probably because i tried the restore in safe mode... Hope this helps... P.s. id like to learn

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