As the title says, it seems like Nokia WP7 phones will be powered by a different manifacturer in the near future, while the other WP7 OEMs will stick with Qualcomm. Personally I don't see the point. Why would they want to change? I can't be happy with that, and I'm kinda worried: will this lead to fragmentation? Share your thoughts, but only if you REALLY care: no trolls allowed. Thanks.
Source: http://m.engadget.com/default/artic...vices-l/&category=classic&icid=eng_latest_art
This will cause as much fragmentation as AMD vs Intel as CPU in the PC-world, i e basically none at all. This is one of the main reason why we have OS's, to abstract hardware from software.
In many ways different Qualcomm generations are more different than a ST-ericsson and a Qualcomm of the same generation.
Of course the WP7-kernel must add support for ST-ericsson, but that is the same work as is needed for a new Qualcomm-SOC as well. And this is a pretty easy work for MS/Nokia since ST-ericsson will likely provide the basis for the drivers.
tjtj4444 said:
This will cause as much fragmentation as AMD vs Intel as CPU in the PC-world, i e basically none at all. This is one of the main reason why we have OS's, to abstract hardware from software.
In many ways different Qualcomm generations are more different than a ST-ericsson and a Qualcomm of the same generation.
Of course the WP7-kernel must add support for ST-ericsson, but that is the same work as is needed for a new Qualcomm-SOC as well. And this is a pretty easy work for MS/Nokia since ST-ericsson will likely provide the basis for the drivers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
pretty much sums it up nicely
Basically most of these processors are based on ARM's architecture. In another word they're very similar
Also, from what I understand, this is just for low-end phones. ST ericson is providing the tango-friendly chips so windows phone can hit the low-end market as well.
Good to know then, i feel much better now heh...thanks for pointing that out.
z33dev33l said:
Also, from what I understand, this is just for low-end phones. ST ericson is providing the tango-friendly chips so windows phone can hit the low-end market as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That has been rumored, but looking back at the Nokia ST-Ericsson partnership that started back in 2008 when Symbian was supposed to get U8500 (was pretty much made for the platform) i would be very surprised if Nokia doesn't use U8500 and maybe U9500 in the future.
ST-Ericsson says on it's press release that is sees huge opportunity for it's NovaThor platform(U5500, U8500, U9500), all quite serious SoC's.
We are pleased to have been selected by Nokia as a key partner for Windows smartphones, in line with our goal to be present in all segments and major operating systems,” said Gilles Delfassy, president and CEO of ST-Ericsson. “Our NovaThor platforms continue to gain traction as they enable customers to bring great smartphones to the market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.stericsson.com/press_releases/st-ericsson_nokia.jsp
Nokia does not love Qualcomm...
(would have been a link to a Nokia / Qualcomm legal settlement here)
-> nytimes.com/2008/07/24/technology/24qualcomm.html
They had to swallow a lot to join the WP train...
GGPlena said:
Nokia does not love Qualcomm...
(would have been a link to a Nokia / Qualcomm legal settlement here)
-> nytimes.com/2008/07/24/technology/24qualcomm.html
They had to swallow a lot to join the WP train...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To be fair, MS has sued HTC and Samsung before...
Sucessfully.
jeremyshaw said:
To be fair, MS has sued HTC and Samsung before...
Sucessfully.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true its all a big game and you cant hold grudges. One day your partner the next your at each other sometimes at the same time. The worst case though is Apple Google who used to have a cosy relationship and are now fighting like an old couple. Its all about whats best for now forget old ties and bad blood the game moves to fast for grudges.
Related
Recently ive been wondering why android is so different compared to windows?
I mean, although android 2.2, 2.3, (2.4) is out and running, only a small percentage of the phones actually got the upgrade, and most of em are still running 2.1 or lower for the time being, so what is the point in having a new firmware available if you cant run it on your phone anyway ?
Android is just a firmware right ? So why cant it be like windows, when there is a new version, no matter what specs or brand of PC, you just install and your up and running... And phones are just like small computers right ?
So why doenst google make android just as compatible as windows, and as soon as a new version comes out, we just install it and were good to go ? I know this is sort or less the whole point of it being open source, but there has to be a solution to this.
This would actually make so much more sense than it is right now! I know all phone-brands want to add there personal touch to there android phones like SE did with timescape and mediascape etc, but its all just based on the same firmware right ? So why cant these things like timescape and mediascape be seen like an update ? rather than fully integrated in the firmware ?
In my opinion, phone brands should go back to what they are actually good at.. manufacturing phones, and google should go back to what they are good at, designing new android versions, this shouldn't be the other way around.
Could one of you pls explain this to me ?
As a master student in economics, IF android could actually be compared like windows as I just explained, this would only have positive effects on the android/phone market, instead of all these angry and disappointed customers...
http://gizmodo.com/5733556/the-complete-state-of-android-froyo-upgrades
this threat is what made me write this, it is clear we are not the only ones stuck with 2.1 (but the gods at XDA are doing their best to fix this!)
I understand your point. My take on it is about the fragmentation. I'm not commenting whether it is good or not, but here's what I think. Windows machine have a much higher memory where they can store drivers, settings, etc. Just Windows XP alone took approx 6GB? I don't think phones can have that much internal memory at the moment. Also, PC's have interfaces where everything comes out to the correct machine language (PCI, SATA, etc) While these lacks on phones. They have different architectures and peripherals that supports only that architecture. Therefore, to keep it lightweight, it is the manufacturer's responsibility that if they are using OS such as Android, that the OS works with their hardware, while on PC, it's more hardware to work with the OS.
I'm sure if there's a universal hardware interface for mobile devices and enough internal memory, your wish will come true
unknown13x said:
I understand your point. My take on it is about the fragmentation. I'm not commenting whether it is good or not, but here's what I think. Windows machine have a much higher memory where they can store drivers, settings, etc. Just Windows XP alone took approx 6GB? I don't think phones can have that much internal memory at the moment. Also, PC's have interfaces where everything comes out to the correct machine language (PCI, SATA, etc) While these lacks on phones. They have different architectures and peripherals that supports only that architecture. Therefore, to keep it lightweight, it is the manufacturer's responsibility that if they are using OS such as Android, that the OS works with their hardware, while on PC, it's more hardware to work with the OS.
I'm sure if there's a universal hardware interface for mobile devices and enough internal memory, your wish will come true
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what you are saying, but then again, why dont we just manufacture android phones based on the same architecture ? So they will all be compatible with every version of android ?
If this could be accomplished in some way, manufacturers wont have to deal with the lack of compatibility of newer versions anymore, and every phone will run optimal with any given firmware.
Android is at the same development stage as windows when it was win.dos, effectively; the future development was not foreseen. The aggressive marketing by ms changed that, obviously, but pcs from that era are hopelessly outdated. Mobile manufacturers are keeping up with Google rather than being dictated to by them. Eventually, a physical threshold will result in Android updates being software instead of hardware.
I think...
Sent from my X10i using XDA App
android is a fairly new n young operating system... its hardly 2 yrs old....
give it time... the way its goin now it headed in the right direction (same as windows)... compatibility issues will be sorted as time progresses... bare in mind that android devices span vast array of price ranges (and thus diff hardware as suited for that price) so compatibility will be an issue which will be sorted out in time...
clintax said:
I understand what you are saying, but then again, why dont we just manufacture android phones based on the same architecture ? So they will all be compatible with every version of android ?
If this could be accomplished in some way, manufacturers wont have to deal with the lack of compatibility of newer versions anymore, and every phone will run optimal with any given firmware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is there's too many architecture to go for. A universal architecture means we're eliminating many companies. For example, say we choose snapdragon as our universal. That means ARM, NVIDIA, will all be taken out the competition. Of course ARM cannot build a microcontroller based on snapdragon's design either, this is due to licensing and such. I'm sure manufacturer wants something like you said, it will be much easier to manage, but chip makers are doing things their own way. Also, you have to consider how much new technology is being introduced to phones in just one year. It is massive. Even if phones have the same architecture, the problem that comes about is the memory size to store all the drivers. Either way, it will have to go through the manufacturer to strip it out, which would be back to where we start again. So it will not work out anytime soon...However I did heard Google is aiming to make a flexible Android where it can do something like you said, but looking at the hardware change, it's impossible for now
FWIW - I think that it's more to do with USP's - Each manufacturer could, quickly and fairly easily just bung stock android onto their hardware, and therefore make it extremely easy for us all to upgrade to the latest OS.. but they think.. "hang on, if we do that then all the phones will look and work in the same way.. why would anyone want to buy ours, over xxx competitors phone... no that simply won't do.. we must make our phones special, different and more appealing to XYXY subset of the market... that way we'll sell more phones than our competitors and eventually.. if we're lucky, we might just compete with Apple"..
Or something along those lines!
Gawd - I thought for a minute you actually wanted Android to be "like" Windows...
I nearly pooped myself.
k1sr said:
Gawd - I thought for a minute you actually wanted Android to be "like" Windows...
I nearly pooped myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was thinking the same way! Windows? Nah! Windows itself is a bloatware OS...
Deleted...
I came across some information today basically stating that any phone Microsoft allows to use Windows needs to meet certain requirements, which are pretty high.
These phones must have at least a 480x800 multitouch display, a 5 megapixel camera, minumum 256mb RAM and 8gb storage, DirectX compatibility, FM Radio, and some other requirements.
Now, as far as I know about Android, any device that will be able to run it, is allowed.
Would Android devices be better if they were required to meet certain requirements, or would quality suffer as manufacturers tried to cut cost while keeping the requirements? Any opinions?
We already have great high end phones. But why should google exclude the less serious user?
Sent from my HTC Desire Z
There's no reason why we shouldn't have a whole range of Android phones.
And plus, why would Android steal a page out of WP7's strategy? It's not like Microsoft's limitations have brought them great success.
uhm because that goes against everything "open source" stand for????
Enhanced said:
There's no reason why we shouldn't have a whole range of Android phones.
And plus, why would Android steal a page out of WP7's strategy? It's not like Microsoft's limitations have brought them great success.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google already has, with the new Android market. The Metro UI WP7 uses is prevalent throughout the Android market.
MartyLK said:
Google already has, with the new Android market. The Metro UI WP7 uses is prevalent throughout the Android market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Everything that has rectangles is now "Metro UI"? Holy eff. It's rectangles, people! It's not a Microsoft invention.
And to address the topic of this thread, as others have already mentioned, why not allow a full range of android phones? If you want high quality, you'll have to spend some money, but I don't see what's wrong with having cheap less powerful phones around at the same time. Diversity is good.
Gusar321 said:
Everything that has rectangles is now "Metro UI"? Holy eff. It's rectangles, people! It's not a Microsoft invention.
And to address the topic of this thread, as others have already mentioned, why not allow a full range of android phones? If you want high quality, you'll have to spend some money, but I don't see what's wrong with having cheap less powerful phones around at the same time. Diversity is good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watch what you, I heard that Apple invented rectangles...not MS, no doubt there's a patent court case pending....
Which company do you think?
Samsung
Apple
Motorola
ZTE
LG
HTC
Kyocera
RIM
HP Palm
Sony
Pantech
Dell
Nokia
--------------
Also which chip manufacturing company will produce Tri-Core or Quad-Core First?
Qualcomm
Nvidia
Texas Instruments
Samsung
Apple
-------------
Submit your vote!
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
Nvidia already has the Kal-El near complete.
Sent from my Fascinate with MIUI Gingerbread
What's the point of this thread?
Technically, all the "dual core" phones have been tri-core all along... there's a tiny third arm core hidden inside, controlling the radio!
And yeah, nVidia is more than likely going to be the first to get tri and quad core processors, they appear to have by far the most aggressive roadmap. They'll likely also appear first in tablets, before phones (at least that's the sane thing to do!), but which manufacturer will be first out the door is a total crapshoot.
FDro said:
What's the point of this thread?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd imagine the same "point" as the "Who's going to be the first company to use THz Processors" (except slightly less insane- still pointless, though).
FDro said:
What's the point of this thread?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no point... just another general bs thread by enyo
Who cares? When somebody gets a hold of them everybody will, and they will be the next standard thing in high end phones. It will probably be a while before anything like that will be worth it though, some people need to spend less time on battery-consuming chips and more time on making batteries last longer.
Sent from my MIUI SCH-i500
End of this year. Most possibly a Google phone.
Sent from my ADR6350
While is sounds fun, I'm not sure people consider the power required. More processors requires more power, that's fairly obvious, and the performance benefit may not really be worthwhile. Android has a way to go in terms of performance compared to the iPhone.
I have to give the iPhone props in this dept. The interface is incredibly snappy in terms of responsiveness. Animations are simply smoother (think when pulling down the notification pane or flipping through app pages) (than 2.2 anyway) and there are fewer laggy moments, at least from what I've seen.
If the iPhone can do it on a 1GHz ARM processor, Android should be able to as well.
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
antigenx said:
While is sounds fun, I'm not sure people consider the power required. More processors requires more power, that's fairly obvious, and the performance benefit may not really be worthwhile. Android has a way to go in terms of performance compared to the iPhone.
I have to give the iPhone props in this dept. The interface is incredibly snappy in terms of responsiveness. Animations are simply smoother (think when pulling down the notification pane or flipping through app pages) (than 2.2 anyway) and there are fewer laggy moments, at least from what I've seen.
If the iPhone can do it on a 1GHz ARM processor, Android should be able to as well.
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
they need to make batteries that are more efficient and last longer. If smartphones actually lasted more than a day of real usage of data and everything they would be much more appealing to the consumer market.
Sent from my MIUI SCH-i500
antigenx said:
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's really a software issue (inc drivers).
Apple has a major advantage in this department. There's a grand total of four iPhones (5 if you count the CDMA iPhone 4), 4 iPod Touches, and 2 iPads, for a total of 11 devices, and only 7 of them (counting CDMA iPhone 4 as a separate device) are still supported in new OS updates.
Lets just take the Galaxy S to compare: How many variants of it are there? Every major carrier in the US has their own version, plus a second one on Verizon... that's five right there! And that's totally ignoring all the international variants (which usually stick much closer to the i9000)! And those are all from a single generation!
I kinda doubt Samsung has as many people working on hardware-software integration as Apple for their phones, and they quite stupidly spread them out far thinner, to countless different devices!
That is the reason that the iPhone's performance crushes Android's. The Android carriers put far less effort into the software side of all their devices, thinking that the specs are all that matters, totally forgetting that specs mean nothing if the software can't take advantage of them!
Compare the stock Fascinate software to MIUI/CM7/AOSP. The alternative ROMs have some reliability issues, but that's largely due to our devs having to figure out the hardware entirely on their own, with limited to no access to the actual documentation! And yet, Samsung's ROMs often have worse issues!
This is Android's fragmentation issue. Quantity (of models) over quality.
Of course this could be read as just a touch of FUD and sour grapes while Intel jump on the bandwagon driven by ARM, but the guy may have a point:
But Bell was scathing of existing implementations, which he partly put down to software issues with Android itself. “Android doesn’t make as effective use of multi-core as it could,” he said.
“In some of the use cases we’ve seen, [the] second core is detrimental because of scheduling.” Having looked at the multi-core options on the market, he said, the performance didn’t justify “the size and cost of putting in that part".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Full article at:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/06/07/intel_bell_mobile_launch/
Seeing how Intel's current affair with the Android mobile market is a single-core (although with HT) Atom CPU, I'm sure they're ever so slightly biased
That said, he might be on to something. I'm pretty sure Google (and the handset makers) could do a lot more to increase the efficiency and usage of multi-core CPUs. And, since Android is constantly in development, I'm sure they will.
I like intel, I own intel stock, if I were to build a server it would utilize intel parts. But this explaination is imo BS. Why include HT if it were so?
android can improve (and I wish google would stop tracking every program we ever use) but so can mobile x86. For my portfolio's sake I hope it does lol
>“Android doesn’t make as effective use of multi-core as it could,” he said.
It's a tempest in a teapot. Android is still mostly on phones--tablet-specific apps are few--so CPU performance isn't a big deal. You can see it in the usual X-vs-Y comparisons. Most of them use synthetic benchmarks rather than actual apps or games. We geeks get excited about which is the fastest phone, but it's irrelevant. The gating factor is perf-driven apps, of which there are few on phones.
This is no different to Nokia CEO Stephen Elop saying that multi-core is a waste of battery on a mobile phone, when his company has staked it's future on a mobile OS that doesn't currently support multi-core processors.
If they can't play "me too", just slag off those that can.
FUD pure and simple!
Regards,
Dave
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2
The guy's a chode. Intel can't into multicore so he's buttangery.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
I remember when the first dual core phones came out, there were naysayers saying exactly the same thing, android doesnt fully support it yet, its a waste of money and resources, yadda yadda yadda... Now android 4 DOES support multi core and support is going to get even better in further updates. Its like with windows 10 years ago saying that DVD or Blueray support was useless because most people only had CD drives.... well look where the tech is now nearly everyone has a DVD drive and half have a Blueray drive.
However lets have another look at hyperthreading.... came out about the same time as dual core CPUs and unfortunately more devices went withdual core instead of HT. now, several years later, we are seeing support for both dual cores and HT on the same chip.
Making my point: Saying Dual Core android devices are useless is shortsighted. Thats the direction the tech is headed, i love that extra power boost when i play things like Nova 3, and yes scheduler tweaking and other problems are still there but it doesnt mean the tech is useless, its just new, and like all new tech it still needs a chance to grow.
Today I have read an article that all currently running WP7 Smartphones will NOT receive an Update to WP8.
Instead they will get an Update to WP 7.8.
I am sooooo happy that we have finally running HSPL for our devices, so our talented devs will hopefully be able to make coustom roms WITH WP8 !!
Lets hope the best
The article is in german, if you understand that language check it out
http://www.chip.de/news/Windows-Phone-8-Das-kann-das-neue-Microsoft-OS_56171609.html
I don't think DFT or others can do something about this :
The main reason WP8 isn't going to current devices is that most of the new kernel will be built for multi core processors ...
I don't think this is something you or me or DFT could change ...
Of course I want to be wrong xD
Btw I am pretty satisfied with the 7.8 solution.
A nice WP7.8 custom ROM would be enough for me if we'll still be able to be part of the system.
The important question is about what features will be included in the 7.8 update other than the GUI change.
Yeah, we're screwed. I'm selling my Titan while I still can, nobody would want one a few months from now.
I will probably buy a freakin' iPhone because it holds its price pretty well and stick with it until WP8 phones become available. That is if I won't become an Apple guy in the mean time...
The question still remains.... Is 7.8 going to be the last update, and how long will it take devs stop making things and switch to native code???
Why develop apps for a old system? I know wp7x apps will run on w8, but w8 will have all new open api.
i heard so many times that there would never be a way to get wp7 on my hd2....... perhaps history will repeat itself
I can deal with the 7.8 solution. I just think its a bit awkward that they would market the hell out of the Lumia 900 (and rightfully so) knowing that a few months later they are going to announce that it is not upgradeable to 8. However, Microsoft had to do what they had to do and seeing the big picture, I think it is going to be even more phenomenal. What concerns me is that I wonder if HTC is going to even bother upgrading the Titan (which I currently own) and Titan II seeing that they really have no enthusiasm for the platform. And what surprises me is that they are on board with the initial fleet of WP8 phones. I think I may switch over to Nokia next time around. You can tell how wonderfully they treat their customers and they continuously get new stuff. We shall see.
Flytetymex said:
What concerns me is that I wonder if HTC is going to even bother upgrading the Titan (which I currently own) and Titan II seeing that they really have no enthusiasm for the platform. ... I think I may switch over to Nokia next time around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the 7.8 update (if that's what you mean) is coming directly from MS so all current 7.5 handsets will be able to get it.
I'm almost 100% sure my WP8 will be from Nokia. I may even get a Lumia now, just because they look so cool & the apps are top notch. (hopefully prices on ebay will plummet after this announcement) Right now I've got a Titan II.
antaed said:
Yeah, we're screwed. I'm selling my Titan while I still can, nobody would want one a few months from now.
I will probably buy a freakin' iPhone because it holds its price pretty well and stick with it until WP8 phones become available. That is if I won't become an Apple guy in the mean time...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sutt359 said:
The question still remains.... Is 7.8 going to be the last update, and how long will it take devs stop making things and switch to native code???
Why develop apps for a old system? I know wp7x apps will run on w8, but w8 will have all new open api.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Guys don't talk like those trolls are WPCentral. We are on XDA-DEVELOPERS.
As an developer I would want to target mass market. When WP8 launches, even if with excellent traction what will be one's target market? 4 million? 5 million? in first 6 months?
WP7.x has 10 million+ strong.
WP7.x apps WILL run on WP8.
So I will be making apps for 15million target audience i.e. make an app for WP7.x and serve and earn more.
Only certain games that need multi-cores might be native coded but then we don't have that hardware, so MSFT hasn't screwed us.
drupad2drupad said:
Guys don't talk like those trolls are WPCentral. We are on XDA-DEVELOPERS.
As an developer I would want to target mass market. When WP8 launches, even if with excellent traction what will be one's target market? 4 million? 5 million? in first 6 months?
WP7.x has 10 million+ strong.
WP7.x apps WILL run on WP8.
So I will be making apps for 15million target audience i.e. make an app for WP7.x and serve and earn more.
Only certain games that need multi-cores might be native coded but then we don't have that hardware, so MSFT hasn't screwed us.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with what you say and I'm sorry to act like a troll but I'm angry because:
- WP7 lacks some important functionality which I hoped to get with the WP8 upgrade (VOIP integration, location background tasks, universal search, HTML5/CSS3 compatible browser, etc.)
- I wanted to keep my Titan for at least 1 year and now I have to sell it (while it still holds some value)
- if I knew the Titan would not get the update I wouldn't have bought it (I was naive, so my fault here)
antaed said:
I agree with what you say and I'm sorry to act like a troll but I'm angry because:
- WP7 lacks some important functionality which I hoped to get with the WP8 upgrade (VOIP integration, location background tasks, universal search, HTML5/CSS3 compatible browser, etc.)
- I wanted to keep my Titan for at least 1 year and now I have to sell it (while it still holds some value)
- if I knew the Titan would not get the update I wouldn't have bought it (I was naive, so my fault here)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since you are on XDA I am presuming you know that the dev community will probably port in custom ROMs with WP7.8 before even officials are rolled out! Yesterday's "dev summit" means nothing to the end user. No end user features are released officially. We've gotta wait for the customer focused annoucements. Surely WP7.8 won't be a start screen only update. It will plug in most of the non-hardware dependant gaps.
And - if MSFT doesnt, XDA will.
drupad2drupad said:
Since you are on XDA I am presuming you know that the dev community will probably port in custom ROMs with WP7.8 before even officials are rolled out! Yesterday's "dev summit" means nothing to the end user. No end user features are released officially. We've gotta wait for the customer focused annoucements. Surely WP7.8 won't be a start screen only update. It will plug in most of the non-hardware dependant gaps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm aware, of course
drupad2drupad said:
And - if MSFT doesnt, XDA will.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but to what extent? Supposing that current devices were used for WP8 testing, there is hope for test build leaks. If not, the kernel/driver related gaps will almost certainly never be filled. Very difficult challenge to overcome and few developers will be interested to do it - especially true for the Titan which is far from being a popular device...
The way I am looking at this scenario is that any device was to be supported for 2 years.
I got my Titan Nov 2011 (launch was Oct 2011?)
So ideally, MSFT should support my titan till April 2013. The so called WP7.8 will add features, may be not high tech, most advanced features, but surely those that will make my Nov 2011 Titan much better than what I purchased. This WP7.8 won't actually hit our phones till Nov-Dec 2012, if that's when WP8 phones are to be in the wild.
Surely that refresh can last my phone for next 6 months. MSFT has repeatedly said they will be giving 2 major updates. Only the Lumia 900 and HTC Titan2 owners will see just one WP7.8, but all of us have seen Mango and now WP7.8
And what says, that we won't have a Tango-like minor update after WP7.8?
The fact that 7.5 is being pushed to 7.8 and not 8.0 shows that its two iterations lower than 8.0 (one being kernel change, second being ?) and THREE iterations better than 7.5. Surely a new start screen isn't worth making it 7.8. It could easily have been 7.6 unless ofcourse MSFT devs like fooling us with numbers (I don't doubt it! )
Also, MSFT will support us with apps for that period too. Devs won't make apps for an OS with zero user base. They will want it to start off with 10 million of us first. At least till June-July 2013, I don't see lots of WP8 exclusive apps that are not hardware dependant. Ofcourse there will be a huge influx of apps come this Christmas that will be exclusive to WP8 to show off its hardware capapbilities.
All in all, it is an excellent thing if you want WP to succeed and want to benefit from the whole "ecosystem" experience unmatched by any other OS! I am loving my phone and won't buy a WP8 till next summer. I am in love with my Titan and the custom ROMs have just started... possibilites are endless. We might be looking at a new HTC HD2
---------- Post added at 10:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:18 AM ----------
Here found this:
http://conversations.nokia.com/2012/06/20/new-nokia-apps-zynga-games-to-make-your-lumia-even-better/
Part that is of our interest -
"Elsewhere, you may have read about the new Windows Phone 8. How does this affect your Lumia? Well, you are not being left out. All Lumia smartphones will be getting an update to give you some of the features of Windows Phone 8, including the new Start screen, as well as a pattern of ongoing updates going forward."
When the summit was summarised, it was told that we will get continuing support from OEMs. I am inclined to believe that OEMs will dish out a range of updates for another 12-15 months or so for WP7 to bring it as close as possible to WP8. When WP8.5 is released, WP7 will truely be dead, which is OK.
drupad2drupad said:
Also, MSFT will support us with apps for that period too. Devs won't make apps for an OS with zero user base. They will want it to start off with 10 million of us first. At least till June-July 2013, I don't see lots of WP8 exclusive apps that are not hardware dependant. Ofcourse there will be a huge influx of apps come this Christmas that will be exclusive to WP8 to show off its hardware capapbilities
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's really clear to me with my ics xoom tablet that gingerbread has not been abandoned. there are still few apps in the google play store that only work on ics or honeycomb. i'm pretty sure the same will apply for wp7.5/8 - as has been said before. why limit yourself to the people with one system when most apps will work on both. the only time this will change is if wp8 is a massive runaway success, which i'd be equally happy about
As far as markets go, being able to use native code means an easy port of games and apps to and from Android and iOS. If you could serve 3 markets with your app or just 1, which would you choose? WP8 means the end of apps for WP7 devices.
Microsoft could have chosen to port the kernel to our devices. People are like "well, the kernel needs multicore". Bull****. Windows 8 will run on a Pentium 4. You telling me they can get their desktop OS to run on 6-8 year old hardware but mobile can't run on less than a year old? The kernel doesn't matter any goddamn way. They could choose to port native support to our device. Apple did it with 68k to PPC and PPC to Intel, and with considerably less money and human resources. Embedded NT already runs on WP7 chipsets.
Microsoft is telling too many partners too many different things. First they say they are changing the OS to run on lower spec hardware, now they are saying the higher-end hardware can't run the next OS.
Sent from my PI39100 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
dragon_76 said:
As far as markets go, being able to use native code means an easy port of games and apps to and from Android and iOS. If you could serve 3 markets with your app or just 1, which would you choose? WP8 means the end of apps for WP7 devices.
Microsoft could have chosen to port the kernel to our devices. People are like "well, the kernel needs multicore". Bull****. Windows 8 will run on a Pentium 4. You telling me they can get their desktop OS to run on 6-8 year old hardware but mobile can't run on less than a year old? The kernel doesn't matter any goddamn way. They could choose to port native support to our device. Apple did it with 68k to PPC and PPC to Intel, and with considerably less money and human resources. Embedded NT already runs on WP7 chipsets.
Microsoft is telling too many partners too many different things. First they say they are changing the OS to run on lower spec hardware, now they are saying the higher-end hardware can't run the next OS.
Sent from my PI39100 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think it is about hardware at all and MSFT never suggested so either. What they've said is the whole WP8 which can be scaled up and down is a big task and effort. From update point of view, packaging this whole new kernel update via Zune to us also means, that the noob on the other hand (not you and me) needs to know what to do. To wipe devices, to get the new drivers on, the new ROM and radio - not a normal update. I think MSFT could have spent a few months trying and testing things so that current gen phones can get this new kernel with "super update". But frankly, only a few thousand of us out of the suspected 12 million are tech-savvy for such an update. The bricks, the admin to support bricks would be an endless affair.
Also, OEMs. Convincing them to make new drivers to update current hardware would mean they can't sell more phones. OEMs want to sell phones. They want money, they will never choose update v/s new hardware. OEMs would also have to have support channels open for such bricks etc - again not good enough reason to put that effort on negligible number of users of this platform.
Above all, what I think the real, REAL reason is: Hardware. Current hardware although not outdate by any means isn't good enough to "exploit" WP8 kernel that powers a PC. The choice was:
Should we have a PC software run by mediocre hardware or should we launch it with awesome hardware that will exploit the new kernel? From business point of view, new hardware, new software = more attention grabbing.
My 2p
Then by your logic, Microsoft should never release anything but bug fixes. In fact, the opposite is happening. Microsoft is planning on bypassing vendors and carriers starting with Windows 8. As far as hardware goes, no ATT rep is going to push Windows Phone now, and it is already well-known that has been a problem as it is.
In fact, it would behoove vendors if Microsoft supported current generation phones because they could work on streamlining current production instead of spending the money on new designs. Do you think the most valuable company in the world (Apple) doesn't understand this? The 3GS will run iOS 6! Other smartphone platforms are basically saying if you want your hardware supported the life if your contract, you need to buy an iPhone...
Also, just an FYI, windows phones are all the same. They all use 100% identical chipsets and have almost no custom hardware. The only difference they have is in the camera and those are high-level drivers. Microsoft was notoriously strict with their hardware spec. Hardware partners did not write any drivers, the same way PC vendors do not write any drivers. It is all a partnership between MS and chipset manufacturers.
Sent from my PI39100 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
I recieved an e.mail from Microsoft stating my titan will be able to recieve the window 8 update. What's that about?.
fallenmonk said:
I recieved an e.mail from Microsoft stating my titan will be able to recieve the window 8 update. What's that about?.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
According to the site where I got that info, all currently devices which run WP7 wont get the update, so we should wait and see...