Related
Which company do you think?
Samsung
Apple
Motorola
ZTE
LG
HTC
Kyocera
RIM
HP Palm
Sony
Pantech
Dell
Nokia
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Also which chip manufacturing company will produce Tri-Core or Quad-Core First?
Qualcomm
Nvidia
Texas Instruments
Samsung
Apple
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Submit your vote!
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
Nvidia already has the Kal-El near complete.
Sent from my Fascinate with MIUI Gingerbread
What's the point of this thread?
Technically, all the "dual core" phones have been tri-core all along... there's a tiny third arm core hidden inside, controlling the radio!
And yeah, nVidia is more than likely going to be the first to get tri and quad core processors, they appear to have by far the most aggressive roadmap. They'll likely also appear first in tablets, before phones (at least that's the sane thing to do!), but which manufacturer will be first out the door is a total crapshoot.
FDro said:
What's the point of this thread?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd imagine the same "point" as the "Who's going to be the first company to use THz Processors" (except slightly less insane- still pointless, though).
FDro said:
What's the point of this thread?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no point... just another general bs thread by enyo
Who cares? When somebody gets a hold of them everybody will, and they will be the next standard thing in high end phones. It will probably be a while before anything like that will be worth it though, some people need to spend less time on battery-consuming chips and more time on making batteries last longer.
Sent from my MIUI SCH-i500
End of this year. Most possibly a Google phone.
Sent from my ADR6350
While is sounds fun, I'm not sure people consider the power required. More processors requires more power, that's fairly obvious, and the performance benefit may not really be worthwhile. Android has a way to go in terms of performance compared to the iPhone.
I have to give the iPhone props in this dept. The interface is incredibly snappy in terms of responsiveness. Animations are simply smoother (think when pulling down the notification pane or flipping through app pages) (than 2.2 anyway) and there are fewer laggy moments, at least from what I've seen.
If the iPhone can do it on a 1GHz ARM processor, Android should be able to as well.
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
antigenx said:
While is sounds fun, I'm not sure people consider the power required. More processors requires more power, that's fairly obvious, and the performance benefit may not really be worthwhile. Android has a way to go in terms of performance compared to the iPhone.
I have to give the iPhone props in this dept. The interface is incredibly snappy in terms of responsiveness. Animations are simply smoother (think when pulling down the notification pane or flipping through app pages) (than 2.2 anyway) and there are fewer laggy moments, at least from what I've seen.
If the iPhone can do it on a 1GHz ARM processor, Android should be able to as well.
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
they need to make batteries that are more efficient and last longer. If smartphones actually lasted more than a day of real usage of data and everything they would be much more appealing to the consumer market.
Sent from my MIUI SCH-i500
antigenx said:
IMO there are lots of improvements that could be made with single (and I guess I have to include dual-core now) processors, and I would prefer to see them take that route first.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's really a software issue (inc drivers).
Apple has a major advantage in this department. There's a grand total of four iPhones (5 if you count the CDMA iPhone 4), 4 iPod Touches, and 2 iPads, for a total of 11 devices, and only 7 of them (counting CDMA iPhone 4 as a separate device) are still supported in new OS updates.
Lets just take the Galaxy S to compare: How many variants of it are there? Every major carrier in the US has their own version, plus a second one on Verizon... that's five right there! And that's totally ignoring all the international variants (which usually stick much closer to the i9000)! And those are all from a single generation!
I kinda doubt Samsung has as many people working on hardware-software integration as Apple for their phones, and they quite stupidly spread them out far thinner, to countless different devices!
That is the reason that the iPhone's performance crushes Android's. The Android carriers put far less effort into the software side of all their devices, thinking that the specs are all that matters, totally forgetting that specs mean nothing if the software can't take advantage of them!
Compare the stock Fascinate software to MIUI/CM7/AOSP. The alternative ROMs have some reliability issues, but that's largely due to our devs having to figure out the hardware entirely on their own, with limited to no access to the actual documentation! And yet, Samsung's ROMs often have worse issues!
This is Android's fragmentation issue. Quantity (of models) over quality.
I'm not to much of a tech head and i know the quad cores help things run faster and smoother... but without ICS, it seems like the quad cores are not being used. What proof is there that ICS will even make full use of the quad cores? Does this
tablet use the quad cores to there full potential with anything? or are the cores just a marketing tool? As far as i can tell, the ipad has faster internet surfing and better a better gpu.
im not here to bad talk the asus or anything, I just want some... reassuring.
blaziner18 said:
I'm not to much of a tech head and i know the quad cores help things run faster and smoother... but without ICS, it seems like the quad cores are not being used. What proof is there that ICS will even make full use of the quad cores? Does this
tablet use the quad cores to there full potential with anything? or are the cores just a marketing tool? As far as i can tell, the ipad has faster internet surfing and better a better gpu.
im not here to bad talk the asus or anything, I just want some... reassuring.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your right but when ICS roles out with NATIVE HARDWARE acceleration it will kick even the ipad 3's butt!
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
From what I've heard, ICS fixes a lot of issues. The SunSpider tests (browser test) on the Galaxy Nexus running ICS was faster than the iPhone 4S.
But there is really no comparison between the Prime or any Android Tablet to the iPad. Assuming that you have the money, if you want an iOS tab, get the iPad. If you want an Android tab get the Prime.
This was discussed in a couple of earlier threads (here's one: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1377519). ICS doesn't really improve on Honeycomb when it comes to hardware acceleration or multi-core support. It will, however, likely be more optimized and a better overall experience.
I think most folks are hoping for a better browser experience, mostly. Otherwise, I think performance will be similar.
Here's a great video that shows how the five cores work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1qKdBX4-jc&feature=player_embedded
xGary said:
From what I've heard, ICS fixes a lot of issues. The SunSpider tests (browser test) on the Galaxy Nexus running ICS was faster than the iPhone 4S.
But there is really no comparison between the Prime or any Android Tablet to the iPad. Assuming that you have the money, if you want an iOS tab, get the iPad. If you want an Android tab get the Prime.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People need to stop quoting sunspider benchmarks they are extremely unreliable and you never get the same results!
Also those benchmarks where preformed with the stock ics browser! And who uses stock! If they used another browser it would been way faster!
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
What is a better browser?
Wordlywisewiz said:
Your right but when ICS roles out with NATIVE HARDWARE acceleration it will kick even the ipad 3's butt!
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I enjoy a little Apple bashing as much as the next guy, lets not lose touch with reality:
Dianne Hackborn - How about some Android graphics true facts?
https://plus.google.com/105051985738280261832/posts/2FXDCz8x93s
It woNt even matter. The extra cores will help regardless of optimized for it or not. There's been a few videos showing how the extra cores kick in to iniate actions faster, or make apps or games run a lot better. Who cares if the GPU not the most powerful out of all tablets. It's the most powerful in Android at the moment. Plus ipad2 is only slightly better. nOW, the CPU in tegra3 blows away any other CPU in the mobile tech market today, as far as tablets like iOS or Amdroid goes. The extra power in CPU can make up for any shortcomings on the already powerful gpu. Several reviewers said the best graphics ever seen on a mobile device was shown powered by tegra3 Prime, not ipad2. Browsing experience is subjective to the user. 3rd party apps are always better than native ones. Opera mobile will more than likely be best for prime, as it's the best for Android at the moment. Dolphin HD is great also.
Stop feeding into the so called negative hype so much. iPad browser not so fast n I have one. Safari sux but I have ICab and atomic browser which are much better than IOS stock safari browser.
Not to sound funny but this thread is another rehash of jeiwongs or others. You don't need no reassuring, unless you a child. I thought I saw one of your other posts saying you was an adult. Stop trying to compare everything to iPad. iPad so simple anyways so it should run fast as he'll. There is a lot more going on in Android OS like widgets n so on. For android to have all the extras and have the The Prime perform just as fast is an amazing feat. Ipad2 Only won a couple categories, Tegra3 blew all the other categories away.
As other more knowledgeable members have stated here before, don't be so fixated on spec numbers, like gpu. Nvidia and tegra3 has tricks up their sleeve to produce amazing results. Just like cars, just because you have more. Horsepower, doesn't automatically mean you will be faster or win. Other factors come into play. Weight, efficiency , etc...don't focus on gpu so much as it's the most powerful out for android anyways. Be amazed how more powerful the CPU is than any other tablet out now. The CPU will push anything extra needed the gpu can't handle on it's own. That's why Prime has all the extra capabilities like micro SD card support, USB host functions, game controllers, etc..
Apple, even though they make great tech devices, fool people. They could of easily implemented everything in ipad2 into ipad1. But no, they want to add a few extra features and make you want newer device. Especially with iPhones and all the different versions. Each upgrade could've easily been implemented into the last/previous one. At least with tegra3 is will have more longevity than any apple device. I have an iPad n love it but tired of having to hack ot just to do the simple tasks most others do out the box. Like people said before, iPad is for someone who loves simplicity and not too keen on technology. Android is a nerds dream and the customizations are very numerous. T the point of personalizing it. iPad, all you do is change wallpaper. Wow..lol. Even jail broken n adding themes, it still the same look really. Although I do have honey pad on iPad which changes it up to honeycomb UI. Completely makes iPad feel like a new device with widgets n everything. But ipad1 only has 256mb of RAM so I run out of ram quick when adding several widgets. Even ipad2 only has 512. Most Android devices now run 1GB of Ram. Newer ones will have even 2GB. The future lies with Android. The Prime will be the beginning of the new Android Revolution. 2012 will he tegra3 year, year of The Android. Once ipad3 announced, it will be cool n get lot of hype but now for the first time, us Android owners have devices to truly compete with Apple on all fronts. So the hype for Apple won't be as strong as before. People know now they have more choices of great products out there. Not just Apple.
Apple can optimize iOS in a way that Android cannot be optimized because Apple controls every aspect of their devices--hardware and software. Hell, I'd be shocked if an iPad 2 wasn't more optimized than any given Android device. And even then, it should be noted that Apple achieves their vaunted fluidity because iOS does far less than Android--lesser multitasking, no widgets, etc.
I'm more than willing to accept a little worse performance because I can do so much more with my Android devices, at least as far as the OS itself is concerned. Just the ability to stock up my Transformer's (and soon to be Prime's) home screens with functional elements like widgets means that I get far more overall functionality out of my Android tablet than I'd get from an iPad 2.
The apps situation is different, of course, but that will change. Already, I can't think of a single task I'd like to do with my tablet that I can't because of a missing app. So, the fact that the iPad 2 might be a little smoother in some things is pretty much irrelevant to me.
wynand32 said:
Apple can optimize iOS in a way that Android cannot be optimized because Apple controls every aspect of their devices--hardware and software. Hell, I'd be shocked if an iPad 2 wasn't more optimized than any given Android device. And even then, it should be noted that Apple achieves their vaunted fluidity because iOS does far less than Android--lesser multitasking, no widgets, etc.
I'm more than willing to accept a little worse performance because I can do so much more with my Android devices, at least as far as the OS itself is concerned. Just the ability to stock up my Transformer's (and soon to be Prime's) home screens with functional elements like widgets means that I get far more overall functionality out of my Android tablet than I'd get from an iPad 2.
The apps situation is different, of course, but that will change. Already, I can't think of a single task I'd like to do with my tablet that I can't because of a missing app. So, the fact that the iPad 2 might be a little smoother in some things is pretty much irrelevant to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes... all of those words.
Ectoplasmic said:
While I enjoy a little Apple bashing as much as the next guy, lets not lose touch with reality:
Dianne Hackborn - How about some Android graphics true facts?
https://plus.google.com/105051985738280261832/posts/2FXDCz8x93s
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I edited/deleted what I originally wrote. I'm sure he saw what I wrote. Regardless of how I feel, everyone entitled to their own opinions. If everyone thought the same this world would be a boring place. Just because I don't agree with opinion doesn't mean i need to counter and rag on the person.
That link does show some very interesting facts n details on how Android operates. This has been posted before but still good info.
I believe Android is more a focus on strengths than on shortcomings. android is getting better n better with every release. I know iOS structure and environment very well but I see the future potential in Android. iOS will always be locked down.
Cool story bro...
I used to take sides on the android vs. iOS debate, till the day I took an Arrow in the Knee.
Ectoplasmic said:
Cool story bro...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I editEd my OG post.
blaziner18 said:
I'm not to much of a tech head and i know the quad cores help things run faster and smoother... but without ICS, it seems like the quad cores are not being used. What proof is there that ICS will even make full use of the quad cores? Does this
tablet use the quad cores to there full potential with anything? or are the cores just a marketing tool? As far as i can tell, the ipad has faster internet surfing and better a better gpu.
im not here to bad talk the asus or anything, I just want some... reassuring.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Theory says: A processor (a core) can only run one thing at a given time. OSs use priority systems and give each running process a short time to do something before passing to the next process in a cycle. Having more cores would mean that each app would go in a specific core, so if you have 4 apps running at the same time, the 4 cores would be used. If you have more than 4 apps, each app would be assigned to a different core so they are distributed instead of acumulating them into just one.
And this should happen even if they aren't prepared for multicore, the system will send each app to a different core so they can run at the same time and be smoother. If an app is ready for multicore, then it can use the different cores to get the same result 4x faster. And even in games, as the GPU only fills textures. Yes, the iPad2 will fill the textures faster, but everything else will be faster on the tegra3 because of the 4 cores loading the game itself and each level faster, calculating each movement faster, and so on.
As browsing goes... read the link given by Ectoplasmic and try what is said there (i beliave it was that article) on your iPad. While loading a complex webpage, if you try to do anything with the tablet, the loading will stop until you release it. There, if it was at least dual core, one core could handle the user interaction and the other the browsing. Being a multitask system, android also has the problem of browsing with possible background apps using the connection (that only has one channel) limiting your speed and performance. Having more cores would soften this effect (because of what i stated first) but never eliminate it. On the other hand, your Twitter, fb, g+ could be getting updates while you load a webpage (it would take 1.1 secs instead of 1.0) but it wouldn't happen on the iPad.
Another day another Ipad (iOS) vs Prime (android) discussion.
So eat this, trollz!
If you ever thought about getting or did get an iPad you're not worthy of the Transformer Prime man.
I'd say if you cant decide between the two: ipad2&prime, get the iPad. Why? Because if you dont have an ipad, you dont have an ipad.
If for some reason after reading this post you're under the impression that I suggested to you to get the iPad. Get the iPad. Or read it again.
And dont take me too seriously i'm a friendly guy. And i just had some yummie beers and some red stuff out of a strange bottle^^
[Looking forward to the moment when "Sent from my TransformerPrime" is written in this spot]
demandarin said:
Stop feeding into the so called negative hype so much. iPad browser not so fast n I have one. Safari sux but I have ICab and atomic browser which are much better than IOS stock safari browser.
Not to sound funny but this thread is another rehash of jeiwongs or others. You don't need no reassuring, unless you a child. I thought I saw one of your other posts saying you was an adult. Stop trying to compare everything to iPad. iPad so simple anyways so it should run fast as he'll. There is a lot more going on in Android OS like widgets n so on. For android to have all the extras and have the The Prime perform just as fast is an amazing feat. Ipad2 Only won a couple categories, Tegra3 blew all the other categories away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
me the child? I see all of your posts, and if anyone says anything negative about your god of a device you turn into a sad little fanboy. I don't feed into negative hype, I know what i see and i know that the apples internet browsing is faster. I was simply wondering what the cores do.
Android fanboys don't own iPads. I have an iPad and Android devices. So I can say I have experience comparing the two browsing experiences. Like I said before, in a sense, it was already stated before what the cores can and cannot do. This nothing more than a rehash of old thread that got closed. Grow some $&@@- and learn to research first, as your question been answered in several other threads here. XDA is not here to hold your hand n tell you everything OK. Get a grip, use search function, don't take everything so seriously . If you want to be seen as posting meaningful/informational stuff, then take it easy on the fluff filled threads..lol mr. hype man
demandarin said:
.. If you want to be seen as posting meaningful/informational stuff..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've never seen you post anything meaningful.
A lot of this is starting to feel connected to the tegra3.
So, my guess is the ones that rebooted needed more voltage and could not deal with switching cpu's on and off.
So now that we have all 4 on all the time, the ones that can't handle that are showing flaws.
To me it seems like this could be a manufacturing issue with the tegra3.
I'm sure some of the issues could be ICS+tegra3 as well.
Is there someplace that has info on the tegra3? Not many devices have it yet.
fenturi said:
A lot of this is starting to feel connected to the tegra3.
So, my guess is the ones that rebooted needed more voltage and could not deal with switching cpu's on and off.
So now that we have all 4 on all the time, the ones that can't handle that are showing flaws.
To me it seems like this could be a manufacturing issue with the tegra3.
I'm sure some of the issues could be ICS+tegra3 as well.
Is there someplace that has info on the tegra3? Not many devices have it yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been saying for at least a month now this is all because of hardware and manufacturing differences with the processor. In other words everyone is screwed because this is not something where software can just magically make all of the Primes play nice which they already proved with the latest update it fixed some Primes with original lockup issue while borking ones that were perfectly fine..... not only that they are degrading our battery life severely trying to get the firmware to play nice with all the Primes this is a losing battle mass recall is the only real fix at this point.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra-superchip.html
http://www.techradar.com/news/mobile-computing/nvidia-tegra-3-what-you-need-to-know-1039584
http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile...-fifth-core-that-helps-increase-battery-life/
I agree completely. Do you see any other Tegra 3 tabs on the market? Nope. The nearest android tablet coming out is the Toshiba Excite X10, which is an older OMAP 4430 dual-core running @ 1.2GHz (which is undeniably stable). But I don't think its Tegra 3 alone.
A lot of the issues we see with lockups/reboots/battery issues could be how ICS and the apps deal with Tegra 3. But I'm speculating...
Do we have any way of knowing if it's falling back to the 5th low power core? Seems like it's staying with the other 4 on at 475mhz, meaning it does not swap to the 5th core.
I found this as well:
"NVIDIA handles all of the core juggling through its own firmware. Depending on the level of performance Android requests, NVIDIA will either enable the companion core or one or more of the four remaining A9s. The transition should be seamless to the OS"
So was this "fix" ASUS or did it come from NVIDIA? If so then something is broken.
It definitely was nvidia. We wonder why no other tablet is experiencing this problem. Prime is the only one with Tegra 3!
fenturi said:
Do we have any way of knowing if it's falling back to the 5th low power core? Seems like it's staying with the other 4 on at 475mhz, meaning it does not swap to the 5th core.
I found this as well:
"NVIDIA handles all of the core juggling through its own firmware. Depending on the level of performance Android requests, NVIDIA will either enable the companion core or one or more of the four remaining A9s. The transition should be seamless to the OS"
So was this "fix" ASUS or did it come from NVIDIA? If so then something is broken.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was from them both bit nothing to loose sleep over. They will be releasing another update soon to revert back to lower speeds. But this issue wasn't new to latest update. The lowest speeds have been raised since .11 update. The raised lower speeds is not the main contributor to excessive battery drain. Something else is at play and causing excessive CPU use and not allowing prime to stay in deep sleep for extended periods of time. Its being discussed in battery drain thread that has me, lock n load, buthx, and g37 discussing it with hard data to back up some claims.
Well it could be worse... at least the Tegra3 is not in my car!
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/nv...nt-and-digital-instrument-clusters-2012-01-11
Another trogdor thread....
People.... come on... just cause a bunch of people who have issues with their prime assemble on XDA doesn't mean that the entire prime is useless. i'm pretty positive that 80%+ is happy with the prime.
Besides, a lot of people have been experiencing the lock-ups since the new firmware updates. (so doesn't seem like a hardware issue imo)
SexyAndIKnowIt said:
Another trogdor thread....
People.... come on... just cause a bunch of people who have issues with their prime assemble on XDA doesn't mean that the entire prime is useless. i'm pretty positive that 80%+ is happy with the prime.
Besides, a lot of people have been experiencing the lock-ups since the new firmware updates. (so doesn't seem like a hardware issue imo)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually the lockups started with ICS the Primes effected at that time were fixed with 1.13 and now Primes that were perfectly fine are muffed this definitely IS hardware.
What other tab is running ICS? The only ICS/quad core/tegra 3 tablet is the prime. The argument "no other tab is having these problems" is irrelevant. There is no good comparison. Asus promised an update this month and I still expect it.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
I couldnt disagree more! If it was a hardware problem it would have been a problem the whole time even with Honeycomb. I'm sure they will get it right soon. Basicly when Asus updates they need to do a better job of wiping out the old software before the new is programmed in, as a lot us that did 2 or 3 factory reset after the upgrade saw our problems go away. You should also do a factory reset and a cold boot just before upgrading.
The Good
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5072/nvidias-tegra-3-launched-architecture-revealed
The Bad and the Ugly
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/11/09/tegra-3-missed-performance-goals-by-wide-margins/
---------- Post added at 08:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 PM ----------
G37 said:
A lot of the issues we see with lockups/reboots/battery issues could be how ICS and the apps deal with Tegra 3. But I'm speculating...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dianne Hackborn, a Google engineer, has actually commented on the differences between HC and ICS and Google's roll in adapting to different processors. On the former, she said there's no low-level changes between HC and ICS; HC is the base for ICS. On the latter, she said Google doesn't adjust or tune the OS on a per SoC basis. It's up to the manufacturer to create any unique bridge code that's necessary. If you think it would help, Google her and ask her any questions you might have via G+. She's also joined certain threads before.
BarryH_GEG said:
The Good
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5072/nvidias-tegra-3-launched-architecture-revealed
The Bad and the Ugly
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/11/09/tegra-3-missed-performance-goals-by-wide-margins/
---------- Post added at 08:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 PM ----------
Dianne Hackborn, a Google engineer, has actually commented on the differences between HC and ICS and Google's roll in adapting to different processors. On the former, she said there's no low-level changes between HC and ICS; HC is the base for ICS. On the latter, she said Google doesn't adjust or tune the OS on a per SoC basis. It's up to the manufacturer to create any unique bridge code that's necessary. If you think it would help, Google her and ask her any questions you might have via G+. She's also joined certain threads before.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-A quote from the bad n ugly link. Its in the comments that stuck out very loud n clear on Semi-Accurate Anti-Nvidia bias
NeelyCam Nov 9, 2011 at 4:01 pm #
My guess is that Charlie is quite a bit off target (as he tends to be with NVidia, with Bumpgate being THE exception).
“According to numbers shown to SemiAccurate, basically every upcoming competitor beats Tegra 3, most by wide margins.”
Yeah, because they’ll be A15 and on 28nm. The problem is, they are 28nm and they aren’t here yet… 28nm yield issues most certainly don’t speed up the introduction of these chips. “On track” my ass.
Last time with Tegra2, NVidia chip was THE game in town for a really long time before others got their act together, and released their own dual A9 chips. And Charlie is a fool if he’s saying Tegra2 was a failure, when instead it was a huge success.
Now, Tegra3 is out well before others (again) AND it doesn’t take a risk with 28nm process/yield failure. My guess is that it will again be a six-month success story before Krait starts yielding well enough.
Dear readers (and analysts alike) – try to see through Charlie’s incomprehensible anti-NVidia bias.
-Another well put comment:
Max Nov 9, 2011 at 6:17 pm #
Terrible article. Tegra 3 is pretty good. I had a hands on with the Transformer Prime and it was very good. I expect ICS will bring further optimisations and use of the extra cores too. The power gating function means it is rated at 13h battery life, that’s pretty damn good.
You are a one man smear machine Charlie, it’s time for you to stop these hatchet jobs on Nvidia because they killed your dog and ate it rebel style. Give up man. Life is too short to hold these types of grudges, what will you be saying when Kal-El 2 comes out at 28nm and it is super competitive and low power? Same rubbish or new rubbish. Seriously, get some perspective on all of this, you are ruining the website with this rubbish because you can’t get serious news or insight on Nvidia because you have some kind of first option on all Nvidia articles and they are all full of crap.
-This one puts everything into perspective thinkn other companies will have the upper hand..lol;
Noone Nov 14, 2011 at 5:34 pm #
I just don’t think nVidia can come in an supplant the ARM chip makers that have been in this space for 15+ years. Qualacomm has more than a decade experience building chips for this market AND they understand the market from almost every aspect.
Yes, even Silicon Graphics was a monster in graphics market but was blown away by nvidia. You forget that being on the market for 15+ years does not help when you cannot innovate as fast as a new competitor. nvidia came with a dual core ARM 18 months before anyone else. Everyone said it was useless to have 2 cores on phones. Now everyone is making dual core SoCs and try to put them in tablets (which were not existing when Tegra2 was presented, that is even before the iPad). nvidia is now out with a quad core design. Yes, it is on 40nm, but some competitor has still not shown in their roadmap a quadcore SoC. nvidia competitors rely on 3rd party GPUs improvements, made by players that have been relegated into mobile market since they were born. nvidia dominates the professional graphics market and knows how to build really powerful GPUs competitors can just dream. Ask yourself why there’s not a big SGX GPUs as complex as a Fermi/Cypress if their architecture is so much better. Simply because not everyone is able to design so complex architectures even though they have a winning part. When you scale up, you have to know how not to make the chip melt down. SGX MP+ GPUs are great, but they are huge (and really huge) and hot. nvidia final target are not smartphones. Qualcomm and TI may be happy to end in that market segment, seen their limited design capacities. nvidia target are much more powerful SoCs that can be used outside mobile market. They are passing through the mobile market, will leave some product there (that’s why they bought Icera) but they will go on on beyond that. Quad core, eight core, more and more powerful and power angry SoC will be created. Not all them will be able to compete in the mobile market for power consumption. But nvidia is and probably will be the first one to introduce new design in the ARM market pushing it in new markets (mids, netbook, notebooks, low end desktops and up). Competition has nothing to give to producers till 28nm transition is complete, and that will happen in few months. At that point they’ll be happy producing their dual core 28nm SoCs while nvidia will come with quad core Cortex-A15 and a completely new GPU design.
When competition will be able with quad cores, nvidia will be one generation ahead. If you have not understood, or you were too young/sleeping at that time see what happened since Riva128 was presented. A no stop innovation made of small steps every 6 months till the competition died just after the first GeForce was announced: none could keep nvidia innovation pace, neither ATI which was saved by AMD before bankruptcy. That market could sustain a 6 month upgrade rate. The mobile probably a little slower pace. But you can see 15+ years actors in this market have 18-24 months design cycles, which is really too slow, even though they come with great design when they arrive (too late).
There are no words Charlie can say about how good/bad Tegra3 is against a no present competition. If you want more power in an ARM SoC you need Tegra3. There are not alternatives up to now and for the next 6-8 months. If you want to stay with the competition, you just can keep using 1 or 2 cores again for a few months. You can make money as well, but you will lose the 15+ market leading position, that is mobile market development and progress will be in the hand of someone else and all you can do is following the trail.
demandarin said:
A quote from the bad n ugly link.
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I know you hate that article. But if you take off your rose colored glasses, even by eliminating the anti-Nvidia opinion of the author, he explains the architecture, compromises, and risks well. It's ironic that one of the biggest risks he pointed out appears to be happening. That's Nvidia having to tinker with the s/w that controls the various cores to meet both their performance and battery saving goals. You can still love something and admit it has faults. Is your wife or partner faultless? Mine's sure not but I'd make the same decision again.
BarryH_GEG said:
I know you hate that article. But if you take off your rose colored glasses, even by eliminating the anti-Nvidia opinion of the author, he explains the architecture, compromises, and risks well. It's ironic that one of the biggest risks he pointed out appears to be happening. That's Nvidia having to tinker with the s/w that controls the various cores to meet both their performance and battery saving goals. You can still love something and admit it has faults. Is your wife or partner faultless? Mine's sure not but I'd make the same decision again.
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Of course it has faults. Just like anything else. But in this business you have to be a risk taker and come with something new and innovating. That's why apple is the monster it is now, for the most part. Apple loved tl make things already created even better but still innovating in alot of aspects. I still it was a good move on Nvidia part. This quad core / 5 core is all brand new. That's why they have patent pending on that software technology nvidia uses that allows the cores to communicate in such a fashion. Its a risk that will yells great results sooner than you think.
demandarin said:
Of course it has faults. Just like anything else. But in this business you have to be a risk taker and come with something new and innovating. That's why apple is the monster it is now, for the most part. Apple loved tl make things already created even better but still innovating in alot of aspects. I still it was a good move on Nvidia part. This quad core / 5 core is all brand new. That's why they have patent pending on that software technology nvidia uses that allows the cores to communicate in such a fashion. Its a risk that will yells great results sooner than you think.
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Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
jdbaker82 said:
Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
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^^^^^^^^This guy^^^^^^^^^
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demandarin said:
-
Yes, even Silicon Graphics was a monster in graphics market but was blown away by nvidia. You forget that being on the market for 15+ years does not help when you cannot innovate as fast as a new competitor. nvidia came with a dual core ARM 18 months before anyone else. Everyone said it was useless to have 2 cores on phones. Now everyone is making dual core SoCs and try to put them in tablets (which were not existing when Tegra2 was presented, that is even before the iPad). nvidia is now out with a quad core design. Yes, it is on 40nm, but some competitor has still not shown in their roadmap a quadcore SoC. nvidia competitors rely on 3rd party GPUs improvements, made by players that have been relegated into mobile market since they were born. nvidia dominates the professional graphics market and knows how to build really powerful GPUs competitors can just dream. Ask yourself why there’s not a big SGX GPUs as complex as a Fermi/Cypress if their architecture is so much better. Simply because not everyone is able to design so complex architectures even though they have a winning part. When you scale up, you have to know how not to make the chip melt down. SGX MP+ GPUs are great, but they are huge (and really huge) and hot. nvidia final target are not smartphones. Qualcomm and TI may be happy to end in that market segment, seen their limited design capacities. nvidia target are much more powerful SoCs that can be used outside mobile market. They are passing through the mobile market, will leave some product there (that’s why they bought Icera) but they will go on on beyond that. Quad core, eight core, more and more powerful and power angry SoC will be created. Not all them will be able to compete in the mobile market for power consumption. But nvidia is and probably will be the first one to introduce new design in the ARM market pushing it in new markets (mids, netbook, notebooks, low end desktops and up). Competition has nothing to give to producers till 28nm transition is complete, and that will happen in few months. At that point they’ll be happy producing their dual core 28nm SoCs while nvidia will come with quad core Cortex-A15 and a completely new GPU design.
When competition will be able with quad cores, nvidia will be one generation ahead. If you have not understood, or you were too young/sleeping at that time see what happened since Riva128 was presented. A no stop innovation made of small steps every 6 months till the competition died just after the first GeForce was announced: none could keep nvidia innovation pace, neither ATI which was saved by AMD before bankruptcy. That market could sustain a 6 month upgrade rate. The mobile probably a little slower pace. But you can see 15+ years actors in this market have 18-24 months design cycles, which is really too slow, even though they come with great design when they arrive (too late).
There are no words Charlie can say about how good/bad Tegra3 is against a no present competition. If you want more power in an ARM SoC you need Tegra3. There are not alternatives up to now and for the next 6-8 months. If you want to stay with the competition, you just can keep using 1 or 2 cores again for a few months. You can make money as well, but you will lose the 15+ market leading position, that is mobile market development and progress will be in the hand of someone else and all you can do is following the trail.
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Click to collapse
Can you tell me how Nvidia is dominating professional graphics market? Dominating as in RIGHT NOW.. I'm sure AMD/ATI enthusiast will disagree.
Adreno GPU (developed by Qualcomm in-house), and Mali GPU.. (developed in house by Samsung)... Only Apple & TI uses 3rd party GPU from PowerVR (granted.. Samsung recently got some license from PowerVR and Sony uses PowerVR in PS Vita).
And by roadmap.. do you mean plans? I'm sure Krait is quadcore, same with Apple A6...
Or did you mean by roadmap with devices from OEM?? I'm sure we'll find out more in MWC..
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5118/qualcomm-announces-a-bunch-of-krait-based-snapdragon-s4-socs
"I'm not sure how much competition Krait will see until OMAP 5 devices show up in the latter part of 2012, unless Apple decides to put out a Cortex A15 A6 SoC earlier. NVIDIA has already shown its hand with Tegra 3, and Wayne won't show up until late next year as well."
So, we won't see Nvidia's 28nm quad core til later(or possibly next yr)...of which, it might be behind Apple, Qualcomm, TI... or at least in line with Krait & OMAP 5 launch.
And until we see some actual comparison between Qualcomm 28nm dual core & Samsung's A-15 SoC Exynos (which is just around the corner).... I'll hold my judgement on how it compares to Tegra 3.
jdbaker82 said:
Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
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No, this is a particularly sensitive issue for him and I get that. I'm not trying to put down Nvidia, they deserve huge credit for the innovation they've applied in the mobile market. But, they've gone 180 degrees in another direction from their competitors with Teg3 and it’s yet to be proven whether that was the right decision. Leaving out NEON in Teg2 was certainly not a great decision and one they made in deference to time to market. It's odd that, as of now (February), there aren't any other Teg3 devices in production or even imminent (next 60 days). Unless there are some big Teg3-based devices announced at MWC it would appear manufactures may be a little skeptical too.
In product management the success (or failure) of a product is measured in years not months. While we all wait eagerly for the "next big thing" manufacturers weigh short-term gains vs. long-term success with $’s trumping all. With everyone having equal access to Teg3, Asus being first may have been a choice intentionally made by their competitors. Like so many things with the Prime, only time will tell.
For all things Tegra4.
Early reports from MWC confirmed first Tegra4 chips-Multicore 28nm A15 Cortex chips(I think it may have 8 cores) have been stamped in December and already in hands of OEM for testing and use. With all the hot competition going on now, Nvidia is speeding up the process to bring these to market ASAP. with chips like Qualcomm S4, apple new chip, and Samsung Exynos, Nvidia is coming with all guns blazing to stay ahead of everyone. A version of Tegra4 codename Grey will eventually be released with built in LTE radio. this came from the assimilation of Icera. ill even admit, with tegra3 not currently having an LTE or built in radio, it might be overlooked by some companies if they want to make a data connection model. not all companies make those tablets so Tegra3 will still have a very large footprint of tablet devices as already seen from what's been announced at MWC and before. at least 11 devices so far will use the tegra3 chip.
with the competition getting fierce Nvidia is looking to stand strong behind the Tegra brand. So be on the look out in this thread for latest Tegra4/Wayne/Grey info and specs.
www.extremetech.com/computing/120201-why-nvidia-will-rush-to-tegra-4-as-fast-as-it-can
I will update this OP with Tegra4 news and specs. can't wait to see how much more powerful this puppy is than what's currently out or coming out.
until OP is updated with more Tegra4 news, here is a very good read for all you tech heads. Huge breakthroughs are about to be reached in CPU scaling and mobile computing.
FUTURE OF CPU SCALING: EXPLORING OPTIONS ON THE CUTTING EDGE
www.extremetech.com/extreme/120353-the-future-of-cpu-scaling-exploring-options-on-the-cutting-edge
More info: around October 2012 release @ earliest for Wayne/second most powerful version
1)Confirmation first version of Tegra4 will be 28nm Quad core A15 Cortex CPU @ 1.5Ghz and will have a 24 Core high powered GPU
2)SECOND version of tegra4 will be alot more powerful than the first. It will have no less than a 8 core CPU and have between a 32-64 Core GPU which will be DirectX compliant and more high standards. Look at screenshots for details
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UPDATE 3/30/2012: Tegra4 will more than likely be Keplar based. All indications point to it.
Some details and facts on the matter:
-" Nvidia’s Tegra 4, codenamed Wayne, included assertions that Nvidia’s next-gen SoC will use a Kepler-derived graphics core. That’s probably true, but the implications are considerably wider than a simple boost to the chip’s graphics performance. Tegra 4, also known as T40, could very well be a fundamental game-changer for Nvidia and the most important Tegra product to date"
-Improved Game Performance:
" The GPU that powers Tegra 2 and Tegra 3 has a fixed number of pixel and vertex shaders and is much more closely related to GeForce 7-era products than the Unified Shader Architecture Nvidia debuted with the G80 (GeForce 8). When Nvidia describes T2 & 3 as “fully programmable,” it’s true — but it’s not at all the same as being DirectCompute/CUDA/OpenCL-compatible. Current Tegra products are capable of running complex shader programs, but not the general-purpose code that makes things like PhysX or GPGPU calculations possible"
Unifying of Shader Architecture
-" GPUs with a Unified Shader Architecture (all Nvidia products from G80 onwards) have two advantages over their fixed-function cousins. First, they’re more efficient. A fixed-function GPU’s performance can vary considerably from game to game depending on whether a title emphasizes pixel shading or model geometry; this is quite visible when comparing performance between Tegra 2/3 and the SGX 544. A Kepler-based GPU would be much more flexible, able to allocate its execution resources to process either workload. This can indirectly lead to decreased power usage — a wide array of more efficient stream processors doesn’t necessarily need to run at nearly as high a clockspeed as a fixed-function chip.
Second, and arguably more important, is their ability to handle functions that would normally be processed on the CPU. This is where we expect T40 to come into its own."
-" As a software SDK for physics calculation, Nvidia’s PhysX solution has been quite successful; it’s used in nearly 400 games across consoles and PCs"
Tegra4 Goes Beyond Gaming
-" Tegra 4 also gives Nvidia a fresh platform with which to bundle its Icera modem and DirectTouch products. Its Icera product family is a set of softmodems for LTE and WiFi, while DirectTouch is technology that “improves touch responsiveness by offloading some of the touch processing that is typically performed by touch controllers and touch modules onto the Nvidia Tegra 3 application processor [Companion Core]. The architecture also simplifies the implementation of touch based hardware and user interfaces, requiring less power while delivering more scalable performance.”
Speaking of the Companion Core, Tegra 4 will almost certainly include an enhanced version of the architecture. With Tegra 3, Nvidia chose to build an array of five Cortex-A9 cores — in Tegra 4, the company could opt to adopt the sort of hybrid strategy ARM introduced with big.LITTLE (Cortex-A15 cores for heavy lifting with a Cortex-A7 chip for low power) or use a hybrid A9/A15 arrangement"
-" A Kepler-based GPU will also likely improve Tegra 4′s video encode/decode capabilities as compared to Tegra 3. This is one area where the T2/T3 family is significantly more advanced than the GeForce 7-era hardware they resemble in other respects, but a GK104-derived chip could improve the situation further by either increasing power efficiency, supporting a wider variety of formats and standards, or providing an increased number of post-processing options"
-" Nvidia has always marketed CUDA as a capability that could exponentially increase performance, but the company’s efforts in this area have mostly been confined to scientific computing or high-end industrial applications" Opportunity for CUDA is in Tegra4
VERY IMPORTANT RIGHT HERE!
-" Nvidia can’t count on the Cortex-A15 as a differentiator, given that the likes of Samsung and Texas Instruments will have their own A15-based products out by the end of the year as well. Graphics are the logical area for Nvidia to emphasize; a mobile GPU based on Kepler would be far more advanced than anything currently offered by Imagination Technologies’ PowerVR, ARM’s Mali, or the aging Adreno core."
-" We expect the company will attempt to position Tegra 4 as a chip that can leverage its GPU in ways that are beyond its competition. If the hardware delivers and the software support is in place, it could give Nvidia a potent weapon against OMAP5, Exynos, and future Medfield products from Intel."
Source: Extreme Tech www.extremetech.com/computing/12433...could-revolutionize-smartphone-capabilities/2
updated OP with a great read on future of CPU technology, Scaling, etc.. for the tech heads who love this type of stuff.
2012 and the first half of 2013 are going to be interesting for Nvidia because their going to be battling some formidable competitors with Teg3. From the article the story was sourced from...
The silicon took some time to get back and the company is now starting to sample its OEM partners with the next generation parts which will be launched at the next years' CES and MWC. You can probably expect a repeat of the Tegra 3 launch - limited run of units through a single vendor (in case of Tegra 3, it was ASUS and Transformer Prime tablet), and mass availability in the second quarter of 2013.
MWC 2013 will also see the debut of Grey, a 28nm single-chip package which combines Cortex-A15 cores, the new GPU and the Icera 4G LTE baseband. Grey is a successor of T28, which is a dual-core Tegra 2 combined with an Icera 450 baseband chip. The Tegra+Icera debuted at the show in the form of ZTE Mimosa X smartphone.
http://vr-zone.com/articles/mwc-201...ra-4-to-oem-partners/15014.html#ixzz1njqVFXy0
demandarin said:
For all things Tegra4.
Early reports from MWC confirmed first Tegra4 chips-Multicore 28nm A15 Cortex chips(I think it may have 8 cores) have been stamped in December and already in hands of OEM for testing and use. With all the hot competition going on now, Nvidia is speeding up the process to bring these to market ASAP. with chips like Qualcomm S4, apple new chip, and Samsung Exynos, Nvidia is coming with all guns blazing to stay ahead of everyone. A version of Tegra4 codename Grey will eventually be released with built in LTE radio. this came from the assimilation of Icera. ill even admit, with tegra3 not currently having an LTE or built in radio, it might be overlooked by some companies if they want to make a data connection model. not all companies make those tablets so Tegra3 will still have a very large footprint of tablet devices as already seen from what's been announced at MWC and before. at least 11 devices so far will use the tegra3 chip.
with the competition getting fierce Nvidia is looking to stand strong behind the Tegra brand. So be on the look out in this thread for latest Tegra4/Wayne/Grey info and specs.
www.extremetech.com/computing/120201-why-nvidia-will-rush-to-tegra-4-as-fast-as-it-can
I will update this OP with Tegra4 news and specs. can't wait to see how much more powerful this puppy is than what's currently out or coming out.
until OP is updated with more Tegra4 news, here is a very good read for all you tech heads. Huge breakthroughs are about to be reached in CPU scaling and mobile computing.
FUTURE OF CPU SCALING: EXPLORING OPTIONS ON THE CUTTING EDGE
www.extremetech.com/extreme/120353-the-future-of-cpu-scaling-exploring-options-on-the-cutting-edge
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm actually surprised by the link. The author from Extremetech & VR-Zone both have.. or at least have pessimistic view toward Tegra...
For example, Extremetech is already pessimistic towards Tegra 3..
"Krait is a processing core that is unique to Qualcomm, and is designed to compete with Cortex-A15, not the older A9 used in Tegra 3. If this is indicative of what manufacturers can do with A15, OMAP5 and the revamped Exynos could also prove problematic for Nvidia’s Tegra 3"
Another quote from VR-Zone:
"unlike the roadmap which we have here, we've been told that there might be some delays for the T40 since NVIDIA has to attack Qualcomm Snapdragon, and if the company won't offer Tegra 4+Baseband - Qualcomm will get (most) of the design wins.
"
Wordlywisewiz said:
Yes it was but he posts a thread every hour about how cool and awesome nvidia/asus/prime/tegra3/Tegra4 and links to news sources I mean find something better to do man
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
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Funny you would say that he should find something better to do
He's one of the only guys not whining and complaining like most people do in this forum... +1 from me and thx 4 the news.
demandarin said:
With all the hot competition going on now, Nvidia is speeding up the process to bring these to market ASAP.
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I find the stuff you post to be interesting and don't mind it at all. And posting about Nvidia in general in the forum of a device powered by their chip is cool too. What drives me crazy is your one-sided and selective characterizations of what you post. Based on the title of your thread and quote above, two months ago I could have posted "Exynos 5250 is here!" because it was in sampling even though mass production isn't until Q2. You'd have been all over me for misrepresenting the data and rightfully so. Based on what you posted, Nvidia's going to be going up against some impressive SoCs from Samsung, TI, Qualcomm, Intel, and Huawei for the entire year and part of next year with nothing but Teg3. That to me was the most interesting part of what you posted even though I had to dig it out myself. And don't forget they were months late with Teg3 so "speeding up the process" is relative.
BarryH_GEG said:
I find the stuff you post to be interesting and don't mind it at all. And posting about Nvidia in general in the forum of a device powered by their chip is cool too. What drives me crazy is your one-sided and selective characterizations of what you post. Based on the title of your thread and quote above, two months ago I could have posted "Exynos 5250 is here!" because it was in sampling even though mass production isn't until Q2. You'd have been all over me for misrepresenting the data and rightfully so. Based on what you posted, Nvidia's going to be going up against some impressive SoCs from Samsung, TI, Qualcomm, Intel, and Huawei for the entire year and part of next year with nothing but Teg3. That to me was the most interesting part of what you posted even though I had to dig it out myself. And don't forget they were months late with Teg3 so "speeding up the process" is relative.
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Very well worded that's what I was getting at his threads tend to be very fan boyish and always lean towards the prime being the best... Usually fan boyness happens in other fourms like you should post stuff like this in ipad fourms
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
demandarin said:
I partially agree but with all the other b.s. threads that has nothing to do with Prime, this will fit right in. plus there's a good chance Asus will use this chip since Asus claims to want to be first at things now. plus its related to Nvidia/tegra3. so its relevant
I'd suggest telling same thing to all the other non prime threads.
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Great... they couldn't get it right with the Prime so now they can blunder through & fiddle with a Tegra 4. "First at things"for Asus is proving to be half baked.
BarryH_GEG said:
I find the stuff you post to be interesting and don't mind it at all. And posting about Nvidia in general in the forum of a device powered by their chip is cool too. What drives me crazy is your one-sided and selective characterizations of what you post. Based on the title of your thread and quote above, two months ago I could have posted "Exynos 5250 is here!" because it was in sampling even though mass production isn't until Q2. You'd have been all over me for misrepresenting the data and rightfully so. Based on what you posted, Nvidia's going to be going up against some impressive SoCs from Samsung, TI, Qualcomm, Intel, and Huawei for the entire year and part of next year with nothing but Teg3. That to me was the most interesting part of what you posted even though I had to dig it out myself. And don't forget they were months late with Teg3 so "speeding up the process" is relative.
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Click to collapse
Agreed. Mostly about the blind, unsubstantiated support of teg3/prime and never considering anything could be better or outperform it. I like the guy but the level of fanboi is the highest I have ever seen. We all like to support put devices and tout them as the best, but it gets to a level of pure insanity at times...
You guys wouldn't believe what showed up at my door again today. lol...Let me just say that some C2's have bluetooth and wifi fixed. But wifi range is still garbage.
I don't care what anyone says, Asus International rocks! Welcome me back guys.
Did you buy another prime? Or did they send you another free tablet?
PM sent......
Op updated with more Tegra4 info and facts. First version will be 28nm Quad Core A15 cortex CPU @ 1.5Ghz and 24 core GPU. Along with confirmation of second version having 8 core CPU and 32-64 core GPU. Projected October 2012 release date. Now this is something to wait for.
Major update in the OP. Just scroll down to 3/30/2012 update.
TEGRA4 WILL LIKELY BE KEPLAR BASED! I'm keeping prime until this releases. No other chip announced to come out will come close to this kind of power, capabilities, and potential. Nvidia looking to revolutionize the industry again. Tegra4 will be the chip to be excited and anxious for.
To be honest each time Nvidia release a new chip it is overtaken shortly after... see samsung's new chip vis a vis tegra 3... so I disagree with your statement. also there is no point in increasing performance power if the software lacks proper support for it.
BuZzCoRe said:
To be honest each time Nvidia release a new chip it is overtaken shortly after... see samsung's new chip vis a vis tegra 3... so I disagree with your statement. also there is no point in increasing performance power if the software lacks proper support for it.
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here's the thing, Samsungs new chip is not out yet and won't be for at least a couple to few more months. So that'll mean Nvidia tegra3 held the title of most powerful Android chip for at least half the year or more. so that's not shortly overtaken. plus when these other chips come out, Tegra4 will be also. Tegra4 said to release q4/fall of this year. So nvidia will overtake those again.
show me a Android chip out right now considered and shown to be more powerful than Tegra3 then ill be quiet. Show me a release date on a product using any Android chip more powerful than tegra3. There is none shown to come within a month or two or even 3. Tegra3 will have then been dominant chip for half the year or more. Market is already about to be flooded with more tegra3 based tablets. So these other chipmakers are actually behind the curve. not Nvidia.
as far as no since in increasing performance power when no proper software support, that's not on Nvidia, that has been the story of Android as a whole its whole life. I've always said its better for software optimation vs. constant hardware spec war. Since all android manufacturers want to continue the spec wars, then Nvidia is making sure to bring the big guns. Android marketing is a different beast than apples. Android focuses more on hardware specs and features. It'll be on Google and developers to bring the software up to speed.
End of 2012 will be interesting, both the hardware news and software (W8).
Nice that it's coming faster hardware but what good does I makes when you don't can use it for any good. Is there any app that need more power then Tegra 3 provide? There isn't hardly any games out there that takes full advantage of all the hype around Tegra 3. All games that was said to come always being pushed forward in time.
Have always looked at the specifications and numbers on papper and like when there comes new hardware and stuff.. But for now I starting to feel that do we really need faster more powerful systems when we don't have any apps that can use it.
One thing were the extra power can come in handy is when browsing. But wtf we don't even have a good browser that give a stable and good experience.
And the main thing for tablets is just browsing.
Have had Galaxy Tab 7,Xoom, Galaxy Tab 10.1 and all this devices felt like beta products and i was fine with it because it was all new ground. And I thought a part of all problems was the hardware and that the software needed some time. It have now been a year and I now own a Prime that is the best device so far, But still it feels like parts missing when the software doesn't keep up to the hardware. Must be hard for hardware manufacturer when they make good components that need to run a beta software.
Android tablets are big phones trying to be a PC and it don't do it very well. If Google don't step up I think W8 will have a good chance to succeed.
The move to make ICS for phones and tablets wasn't a good move.. I think it would been better to have one phone OS and one Tablet OS. All development of apps just make the phone apps scale to bigger screen and it don't look good.. Would been better if the developer needed to make it look good and not just make it work.
Interesting time a heads, But I think that we need better software before hardware and that's why I'm pretty sure that my next tablet will run W8.
Looking forward to have a real file manager and Microsoft Office.
Went a little off topic now. But was what I had in mind and only a little make sense, The rest is just nonsens in Bad English.
A article that I agree to on what he is writing and thinking about android apps on tablets.. You can skip the parts that is about Ipad..
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2401676,00.asp
Asus Prime & Tapatalk
Andreas527 said:
End of 2012 will be interesting, both the hardware news and software (W8).
Nice that it's coming faster hardware but what good does I makes when you don't can use it for any good. Is there any app that need more power then Tegra 3 provide? There isn't hardly any games out there that takes full advantage of all the hype around Tegra 3. All games that was said to come always being pushed forward in time.
Have always looked at the specifications and numbers on papper and like when there comes new hardware and stuff.. But for now I starting to feel that do we really need faster more powerful systems when we don't have any apps that can use it.
One thing were the extra power can come in handy is when browsing. But wtf we don't even have a good browser that give a stable and good experience.
And the main thing for tablets is just browsing.
Have had Galaxy Tab 7,Xoom, Galaxy Tab 10.1 and all this devices felt like beta products and i was fine with it because it was all new ground. And I thought a part of all problems was the hardware and that the software needed some time. It have now been a year and I now own a Prime that is the best device so far, But still it feels like parts missing when the software doesn't keep up to the hardware. Must be hard for hardware manufacturer when they make good components that need to run a beta software.
Android tablets are big phones trying to be a PC and it don't do it very well. If Google don't step up I think W8 will have a good chance to succeed.
The move to make ICS for phones and tablets wasn't a good move.. I think it would been better to have one phone OS and one Tablet OS. All development of apps just make the phone apps scale to bigger screen and it don't look good.. Would been better if the developer needed to make it look good and not just make it work.
Interesting time a heads, But I think that we need better software before hardware and that's why I'm pretty sure that my next tablet will run W8.
Looking forward to have a real file manager and Microsoft Office.
Went a little off topic now. But was what I had in mind and only a little make sense, The rest is just nonsens in Bad English.
A article that I agree to on what he is writing and thinking about android apps on tablets.. You can skip the parts that is about Ipad..
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2401676,00.asp
Asus Prime & Tapatalk
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I agree completely. But since Android as a whole is stuck on throwing hardware specs around and being more powerful, we'll just roll with the punches then.
I've always said software is the key. Currently Im satisfied with android experience. I've already had the first Ipad for 2yrs. and experienced IOS. IMO Android is alot better and more productive. So i will be getting a tegra4 tablet once it does come. to me, only thing worth waiting for.
BuZzCoRe said:
To be honest each time Nvidia release a new chip it is overtaken shortly after... see samsung's new chip vis a vis tegra 3... so I disagree with your statement. also there is no point in increasing performance power if the software lacks proper support for it.
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Mobile SOC are one of the fastest moving industries in the tech world. A 4-6 month lead on release is HUGE because that is half the product cycle. I think Nvidia is doing a great job personally, but for them to get more design wins they have to be "in" the inner circle. Part of business is having a compelling product that is highly profitable and the other part is strictly relationship based.
This is the reason that my store in Virginia is slowly but surely taking off. We have a product that is better quality, 50% cheaper and have an industry leading return policy with a showroom that is LEAPS AND BOUNDS above what any competitors have to offer. With all that being said my employees are better trained and more knowledgeable.
BUT.... my competitors are still thriving.. Why? Because they have been the "big boys" on the block for the last 45 years and we have been here about 5..
Will our sales numbers over take theirs? Without a doubt, but it will take a while to "win" people over and establish our relationship with the community.
Assuming Intel or AMD doesnt get too serious about SOCs I think Nvidia will be a world leader, but it will take a bit to gain ground.
I for one think their 4 plus 1 architecture is brilliant. I would have liked to see a better GPU, but that will come. Fact of the matter is Tegra 3 is small, cheap, profitable, quick and drains not too much power for what it is capable of. THey just need to get their LTE chipset in line as that cost them a TON of business.
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Yep I have to agree about all this power & yet we lack on the software end of it.I may be looking at a tablet that Asus has with i think it's an I-5 or a I-7 processor in it.Yes it is a windows tablet & battery life isn't that good but the power & software are good.So if these Win 8 tablets or the new Tegra 4 isn't up to par then it's on to a windows tablet.
http://www.phonedog.com/2012/06/11/...really-detrimental-to-the-android-experience/
merp link isnt working for me so a second link
http://www.pcworld.com/article/257307/dual_core_processors_wasted_on_android_intel_claims.html
according to intels general manager dual cores are not doing us any good. That obviously means quadcores are going to do even less for us.
Just Intel propaganda as they are trying to get into the mobile processor market.
Hmm perhaps but at the same time makes sense. These phones should fly but I also know it has to do with the VM
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ckoadiyn said:
Hmm perhaps but at the same time makes sense. These phones should fly but I also know it has to do with the VM
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The thing we have to realize here is that Android was designed to cater to different hardware configurations vs let's say Apple's direction for mobile, they have control of the hardware so they can customize drivers with their software.It also depends how the application uses the hardware too. Dual-core "I believe" is about right, because these apps are not really going to utilize it.
Intel needs to "put their money where their mouth is." All they need to do is make a single core soc that competes with the s4 and tegra 3 AND within a reasonable budget for me to believe and trust them. Till then its just smack talk.
guy has a point there, and a valid one...I remember when we got the first dual core phone and it wasn't nearly optimized to take full use of it...So in the end it makes sense overall...Esp when you look at it from apps and everything else that doesn't take full advantage of everything available...least thats my thinking on it...
BUT I highly doubt Intel is scared and trying to pull a marketing scheme as some of the things they announced at CES for the future of mobile SoC line for them was amazing...down the the tiny nm processing to the features pushing for...
Also its Intel....their stuff wont be bad in the end of things, once they get solid footing here...
sgt. slaughter said:
guy has a point there, and a valid one...I remember when we got the first dual core phone and it wasn't nearly optimized to take full use of it...So in the end it makes sense overall...Esp when you look at it from apps and everything else that doesn't take full advantage of everything available...least thats my thinking on it...
BUT I highly doubt Intel is scared and trying to pull a marketing scheme as some of the things they announced at CES for the future of mobile SoC line for them was amazing...down the the tiny nm processing to the features pushing for...
Also its Intel....their stuff wont be bad in the end of things, once they get solid footing here...
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Thank you first logical post lol obviously its a marketing scheme not like they don't almost have a monopoly anyways. Lol and I think dual cores this gen anyways is somewhat better then the s3 and I'm sure they are better then the exynos.
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Not the right person to believe. It's like believing Steve jobs when he said people don't want phones larger than 3.5" screen.
Once their stuff is released and a third party with no ties, including advertising, can test it then i will believe.
ckoadiyn said:
Thank you first logical post lol obviously its a marketing scheme not like they don't almost have a monopoly anyways. Lol and I think dual cores this gen anyways is somewhat better then the s3 and I'm sure they are better then the exynos.
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Actually, Intel has maybe a 5% market share in chips. So they don't have a monopoly lol. There's this one company with a super high market share, I forgot the name.
But this is interesting. Reminds of the "S4 is faster because Android isn't made for quad cores!" argument.
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I'd bet that most lower-end dual-core Androids really aren't optimized for it. There are some pretty cheap handsets out there, and the experience with them sucks.
On the other hand, though, the manufacturers who make quality phones (HTC) know what they're doing.
It sounds just like the argument iPhans used to make two years ago - they'd talk about how Android was not a good OS because the phones they tried were laggy, slow, and stuttered... ignoring entirely the fact that they were playing with the cheap Android phones. Put a resource-intensive OS in cheap hardware and the experience will suck.
And to an earlier point, Intel is trying to get into the mobile space... and their mobile processors are single core. It's in their best interest to make people leery of their dual-core competition.
I agree with the article 100%, mostly. For now, all enabling dual cores does is inflate useless benchmarks and kill the battery.
The bad part of the article is trying to compare today's processor arch with old stuff.
My personal opinion... Taylor Martin is a moron. Most of his articles on Phonedog are useless!
Medfield is a single core. Maybe they are just trying to defend their product.
Ragster said:
Actually, Intel has maybe a 5% market share in chips. So they don't have a monopoly lol. There's this one company with a super high market share, I forgot the name.
But this is interesting. Reminds of the "S4 is faster because Android isn't made for quad cores!" argument.
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Even in the pc world? That's what I was referring to I understand mobile wise they don't have much or any... Hence the they don't need a scheme
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This article is about 99.99% right. There is some obvious bias in it, but it holds a lot of truth.
The fact is that Android wasn't built to be "silky smooth". Take a look at WP7 for example, those phones run as smooth as any phone can run and they are all single core processors, yesteryear android specs. The architecture of the OS is 100x more important than processing power and it's sad to say that Google absolutely did not focus on this when they started creating Android. Keep in mine that they started before Apple or Windows in building Android, so they probably just didn't have the foresight.
With that being said, I am as big of an Android fan as any of you and I don't plan on changing any time soon but the fact remains that our operating system will most likely never be as smooth as WP or ios. We win by a milestone though when it comes to functionality.