What are your thoughts on the "Anti Piracy Support" being implemented into their ROMS
ROM Developers are now starting to implement this "Anti Piracy Support" . Many of them do and some of them don't.
So what is AntiPiracySupport?
Meaning, this will block the installation of pirated apps, malware and patchers.
For you, is it good or bad?
Roms that have AntiPiracySupport builtin:
+ ACIP:
Commits in Github: YES
+resurrectionremix
Commits in Github: YES
+ Exodus:
Commits in Github: YES
+ BrokenOS
Commits in Github: YES
+ My Rom Builds(if no other info is added):
Commits in Github: YES
Roms that don't have AntiPiracySupport builtin now:
+ AOSPA
Commit in Gerrit: NO
+ Official OmniRom:
Commit in Gerrit: NO
For me it is very bad. Because in my country many of the apps I need are blocked and some of it wasnt compatible with mi3. So big no to Anti Piracy Support for me. Sorry developers.
Bitti09 said:
Roms that have AntiPiracySupport builtin:...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This might help guys :thumbup:
Any it should be AICP not ACIP hahaha!
Sent from my MI 3W using XDA Free mobile app
Here's my take on this blacklist idea.
At least 40% of the reason I bought my first Android after years of iPhones was for ad blocking. I just don't get the reason for clumsily trying to turn a custom rom into iOS. So I did a little digging and found a discussion about this blacklist from an Exodus dev who wrote "The only real reason not to support this is if you support piracy and stealing from developers."
Maybe someone can tell me whether it's a joke or Dave doesn't understand the issues. It takes little brainpower to deduce that app names can be trivially changed, as we've already seen and can even be seen in the blacklist code. So blacklisting apps by name and hardcoding that in your rom is a losing proposition from the start, right?
To stay up to date somebody would need to track package names and add them manually and hope everyone conveniently forgets the past 3+ decades of battles between malware writers and AV guys, eg when viruses started creating their own pseudo-random names to avoid the crummier scanners which Exodus is trying to emulate. We've already seen this simplistic blacklist approach can't possibly scale. Check the google+ link and you see that Kessler is trying to crowdsource a list of app names to blacklist. What happens when somebody maliciously or mistakenly adds a commonly used, objectively benign app? Who is the final arbiter of which apps get the boot? Quid custodiet ipsos custodes?
Factor in Exodus blocking my fave ad service disabler (probably an Irish app ) and debating whether to block Xposed and you have a powerful user motivation to bypass or completely avoid the blacklist and stop it from removing/disabling legit functionality. It seem likely that roms with Exodus' Anti-Adblock anti-feature will be forked if they're worth using. Not to mention, this blacklist only works if the blocked apps play along & their package names never change, and if the user has no motivation to bypass the blacklist. Extra bonus: v2 of the blacklist will be more like real malware, with obfuscated & closed source libraries.
Dave's false dichotomy is basically saying if you don't want spam or ads or closed source crapware clogging your device then you support piracy. I think Dave should've added, another reason not to support this endeavor is because poorly conceived code that goes against user wishes should ALWAYS be turfed.
tl;dr Why would anybody let this guy decide which apps are ok and which aren't, and using an old-school blacklist too? SMH.
XDA fully supports this. IF you cant pay for an app then you dont need it.
zelendel said:
XDA fully supports this. IF you cant pay for an app then you dont need it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What if you want to use app but first want to check the quality of app or you don't have money for every app?
Sent from my MI 3W using Tapatalk
ashish289 said:
What if you want to use app but first want to check the quality of app or you don't have money for every app?
Sent from my MI 3W using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well then you wait to have the money or use a free version. If there is no free version then you save up the money
Is this gonna be a requirement for rom developers?
I'm not against it. But I think it should be something optional. If the rom developer wants to implement it, that's ok. But I think the consumers should have a right to decide whether the rom supports this or not. I mean, like a democracy, the consumers vote, that's something fair...
zelendel said:
XDA fully supports this. IF you cant pay for an app then you dont need it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you speak for the whole XDA community? hehehe Anyways you've got a point there.
But I don't see the point of doing apps developer's job. If they want anti-piracy security for their apps they'll get it (built in), unless it's an offline app. So I wouldn't bother trying to prevent the inevitable...
ChazyTheBest said:
Is this gonna be a requirement for rom developers?
I'm not against it. But I think it should be something optional. If the rom developer wants to implement it, that's ok. But I think the consumers should have a right to decide whether the rom supports this or not. I mean, like a democracy, the consumers vote, that's something fair...
Can you speak for the whole XDA community? hehehe Anyways you've got a point there.
But I don't see the point of doing apps developer's job. If they want anti-piracy security for their apps they'll get it (built in), unless it's an offline app. So I wouldn't bother trying to prevent the inevitable...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well your first mistake was thinking you are a consumer. Not in the least. Nor do users have a say in what rom devs put in their roms. Roms are built by people for personal use and then shared to be nice. If you dont like it then you are more then welcome to build your own rom.
Second mistake was thinking it is a democracy. Its not. Users really dont have a say in what rom devs put in their roms.
All I can say is that XDA stands behind this and anything that is used to get around it is banned from the site for good.
zelendel said:
Well your first mistake was thinking you are a consumer. Not in the least. Nor do users have a say in what rom devs put in their roms. Roms are built by people for personal use and then shared to be nice. If you dont like it then you are more then welcome to build your own rom.
Second mistake was thinking it is a democracy. Its not. Users really dont have a say in what rom devs put in their roms.
All I can say is that XDA stands behind this and anything that is used to get around it is banned from the site for good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for the misunderstood, but I said it because I read rom developers ask for features and bugfixing. So I'll take it as it depends on the developer... some devs are like you said and some others "really care" about what users need/want.
ChazyTheBest said:
Sorry for the misunderstood, but I said it because I read rom developers ask for features and bugfixing. So I'll take it as it depends on the developer... some devs are like you said and some others "really care" about what users need/want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you really ever seen Real developers ask this? No. The only ones that do are the ones that do nothing more really then cherry pick other roms commits. There are very few real developer teams around. The rest are what we like to call winzip wizards or compile wizards.
The ones that "really care" As you say are only really doing it for donations. I know it is hard to understand in this forum as there are none of the big teams here as none of them are willing to touch Xiaomi Devices. Heck I know I am not even allowed to use one due to my job.
In the end it is up to the dev to add this if they wish but ill let you in on a secret. Most devs are working closely with each other to make this better. There is even a commit that blocks xposed frameworks.
As XDA stand completely behind it and against warez most of the things that this targets are already banned on the site. Things like lucky patcher and freedom. Both are forever banned on the site.
zelendel said:
Have you really ever seen Real developers ask this? No. The only ones that do are the ones that do nothing more really then cherry pick other roms commits. There are very few real developer teams around. The rest are what we like to call winzip wizards or compile wizards.
The ones that "really care" As you say are only really doing it for donations. I know it is hard to understand in this forum as there are none of the big teams here as none of them are willing to touch Xiaomi Devices. Heck I know I am not even allowed to use one due to my job.
In the end it is up to the dev to add this if they wish but ill let you in on a secret. Most devs are working closely with each other to make this better. There is even a commit that blocks xposed frameworks.
As XDA stand completely behind it and against warez most of the things that this targets are already banned on the site. Things like lucky patcher and freedom. Both are forever banned on the site.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very good explanation. Now I see it from that point of view, you are right.
@zelendel:
I certainly have supported and I am prepared to support more app developers who provide me free software (free as in freedom not free beer), and I'm not interested in buying closed source apps from the playstore, so I'm not really affected by this issue, but seriously? Preventing users from running the software they want on their phone? These opinions are grossing me out. Thankfully (and this might have been one of the most important advances in whole history) the creators of the software that most of our Android world is based on, have shown more wisdom and created the GPL, that forces everyone who wants to be part of this world to open source and to free their own variations of it, so thankfully people will always be able to remove components that restrict the user.
This is not a stance to enable privacy. This is a stance to oppose everybody who wants to place technical faculties in my OS that are able to prevent me from running whatever code I want (because at that precise moment, I do no longer own a personal universal computer). If enabling piracy is a side effect of preserving the freedom of an OS, then it's a small price to pay to preserve freedom. Thankfully again, it will always be possible to remove components from GPL software, even for "compiling wizards".
TinkoB said:
@zelendel:
I certainly have supported and I am prepared to support more app developers who provide me free software (with free as in freedom not free beer), and I'm not interested in buying closed source apps from the playstore, so I'm not really affected by this issue, but seriously? Preventing users from running the software they want on their phone? These opinions are grossing me out. Thankfully (and this might have been one of the most important advances in whole history) the creators of the software that most of our Android world is based on, have shown more wisdom and created the GPL, that forces everyone who wants to be part of this world to open source and to free their own variations of it, so thankfully people will always be able to remove components that restrict the user.
This is not a stance to enable privacy. This is a stance to oppose everybody who wants to place technical faculties in my OS that are able to prevent me from running whatever code I want (because at that precise moment, I do no longer own a personal universal computer). If enabling piracy is a side effect of preserving the freedom of an OS, then it's a small price to pay to preserve freedom. Thankfully again, it will always be possible to remove components from GPL software, even for "compiling wizards".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See you are missing one thing. The fact that android is not licensed under the GPL. Only the Android kernel is under the GPL. The rest is apache, which means they can close source any part of the os they want. This is why things like Sense, Touch wiz, Zen, miui and all the others are closed sourced.
Guys whenever you create something with so much hardwork then you expect something in return of it. But if someone stealing those things then obviously you will oppose rather than allow it.
Open source has its own benefit and disadvantages. We have to decide in what way we have to use these things. Developers are protecting their hardwork. And its their right. We can't tell them what to do and what not to do.
zelendel said:
See you are missing one thing. The fact that android is not licensed under the GPL. Only the Android kernel is under the GPL. The rest is apache, which means they can close source any part of the os they want. This is why things like Sense, Touch wiz, Zen, miui and all the others are closed sourced.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah with "most" i was referring to the Linux Kernel, which I consider the most important part, as an environment to run APKs could theoretically be substituted. But even the Apache Licence for the Android project is OK for the purpose of retaining the user freedom, although the GPL would obviously be preferable. The most problematic part as far as I can see is the proprietary framework, but at least there are people willing to tackle that issue, like the μg Project..
@vishal24387:
It's well known, that someone who is giving larger contributions to an important free software project will get hired pretty fast. Please tell me of any disadvantage of Open Source (or more importantly of free/libre software, OpenSource without free licences is problematic of course).
Developers are free to think of ways to protect their software. That must not include having OS developers place restrictions on users who aren't even interested in their software.
A developer who believes that's the right way to protect his software can include those restrictions in his own binaries and use some of the Google API features to identify his paying users. In that case the issue of restricting the users freedom only affects those users who run that kind of non-free software.
TinkoB said:
Yeah with "most" i was referring to the Linux Kernel, which I consider the most important part, as an environment to run APKs could theoretically be substituted. But even the Apache Licence for the Android project is OK for the purpose of retaining the user freedom, although the GPL would obviously be preferable. The most problematic part as far as I can see is the proprietary framework, but at least there are people willing to tackle that issue, like the μg Project..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure how you see that. The license states that they can do anything they want to the source and completely close it off like the privacy guard. They are making it closed sourced and there are many devs working on it to make it even stronger.
If you agree wit it or not really doesnt matter a whole lot. XDA is against warez and will support anything and everything to prevent the use of it. Like the module that disables the privacy guard which is now banned on XDA.
Not sure how you see that. The license states that they can do anything they want to the source and completely close it off like the privacy guard. They are making it closed sourced and there are many devs working on it to make it even stronger.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only Privacy Guard I'm aware of is a free software encryption tool, what component are you referring to specifically?
As long as the Free Software part of Android stays usable, closed source components are not an issue and can be removed. I don't care how many devs are making a closed source component stronger, as long as I can remove it from my system.
As soon as that's no longer an option, there'll definitely be forks to continue to be able to have projects like replicant.
If you agree wit it or not really doesnt matter a whole lot. XDA is against warez and will support anything and everything to prevent the use of it. Like the module that disables the privacy guard which is now banned on XDA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anything and everything? If it's at the cost of the users freedom I'll regret my former donation to XDA and have to hope for it's downfall in the long run, but I'm pretty sure not everybody at XDA shares those drastic opinions.
For the most important and tedious parts, like fixes in drivers that are part of the GPL licenced kernel any work on XDA can be used by those who don't want to use certain other components even if all of XDA would endorse them (and I do not believe that's the case).
TinkoB said:
The only Privacy Guard I'm aware of is a free software encryption tool, what component are you referring to specifically?
As long as the Free Software part of Android stays usable, closed source components are not an issue and can be removed. I don't care how many devs are making a closed source component stronger, as long as I can remove it from my system.
As soon as that's no longer an option, there'll definitely be forks to continue to be able to have projects like replicant.
Anything and everything? If it's at the cost of the users freedom I'll regret my former donation to XDA and have to hope for it's downfall in the long run, but I'm pretty sure not everybody at XDA shares those drastic opinions.
For the most important and tedious parts, like fixes in drivers that are part of the GPL licenced kernel any work on XDA can be used by those who don't want to use certain other components even if all of XDA would endorse them (and I do not believe that's the case).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then what your missing is the new privacy guard which is coded into the base OS which prevents things like freedom, lucky patcher and every warez market known at the time with more being added every day.
Maybe not everyone. Most users in China and India (Where warez are common place) dont really agree with it but all the mods have talked about it and agree Warez is not something XDA has now or ever will support.
This is not kernel based. That is what you are missing. This is coded into the base OS. The part that is not covered by the GPL.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Piracy/comments/3eo8sj/antipiracy_measures_on_android_custom_roms/
Also remember that we are a developer forum. Made for and by developers. So we will back any and everything that rips them off of their rights to protect their software from being pirated.
Related
Ok, I have a great plan (this might have been discussed already) but here's my suggestion:
All Rom developers should charge for their work. I'm thinking maybe 3-5 dollars. and if its still in Work in Progress we can still be charged but don't charge for upgrades. This way the out of work developers can get something for their hard work. I just create images and that takes time. I can't even imagine how much time is spent on the roms.
Believe me I would pay for all you guys roms. Donations are great but not enough to inspire to create more roms or even spend time on them. I don't know if this is possible but you guys deserve a lot more credit.
thats my feelings on this issue.
I agree with you in principle, but it kind of defeats the purpose of open source and XDA, doesn't it?
johnny quest said:
Ok, I have a great plan (this might have been discussed already) but here's my suggestion:
All Rom developers should charge for their work. I'm thinking maybe 3-5 dollars. and if its still in Work in Progress we can still be charged but don't charge for upgrades. This way the out of work developers can get something for their hard work. I just create images and that takes time. I can't even imagine how much time is spent on the roms.
Believe me I would pay for all you guys roms. Donations are great but not enough to inspire to create more roms or even spend time on them. I don't know if this is possible but you guys deserve a lot more credit.
thats my feelings on this issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a flattering sentiment but does rather contradict the core principles behind open source in general. If not for its openness and freely available source I doubt you would see the level of progress there has been in the android community.
I'm sure the devs themselves will chime in. Just my two friendly cents
Sent from my CM7 Tazz using XDA App
its not Necessary but its a nice gesture i dont want anyone feeling obligated ,, times are hard for everyone ,, but thank you
i don't know if you've noticed but most devs have a 'buy me a beer' link where you can donate if you wish. i know if i had a job i'd be donating $20 at a time or so depending on how much i was getting paid. until then its nice to know that even though i can't pay, i can still get the best. Google > Apple. it's not always about the money.
ILikeBubbles said:
i don't know if you've noticed but most devs have a 'buy me a beer' link where you can donate if you wish. i know if i had a job i'd be donating $20 at a time or so depending on how much i was getting paid. until then its nice to know that even though i can't pay, i can still get the best. Google > Apple. it's not always about the money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In most cases everything always comes down to money. Unless your living with your parents still or your younger then it's one thing but still at the end of the day most things come down to money.
I'll agree with you on Google > Apple
I own a Iphone4 and the Droid Eris and I still like the Eris hands down no matter what even though the Iphone4 runs everything very smooth the concept of android is far better than most apple users can ever be able to dream about.
Cheatman1 said:
In most cases everything always comes down to money. Unless your living with your parents still or your younger then it's one thing but still at the end of the day most things come down to money.
I'll agree with you on Google > Apple
I own a Iphone4 and the Droid Eris and I still like the Eris hands down no matter what even though the Iphone4 runs everything very smooth the concept of android is far better than most apple users can ever be able to dream about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
dear god that signature quote made my brain hurt just trying to read it.
Haha your signature is great. It made me laugh pretty hard.
And as for this discussion, I don't think they can MANDATE you pay for anything. Like it has been said, its open source and if people want to donate they will. I wish I had a job so I can donate, and as soon as I get one I know I will be. But for now I'm enjoying the work these guys are doing, and hope it continues.
I mean, we're getting Gingerbread on the Eris thanks to the devs here. That's two versions more than what the Eris was thought to get. That to me is incredible.
Oh yeah, I forgot about the open source. the donate link is nice to have and I am guilty of not using that to show appreciation. I will use it more frequently. The Eris is great but I'm stuck not able to load certain apps because it requires a higher than 2.1 version. I'm up for an update and looking into the Thunderbolt most likely. Hopefully there will be a thread on this phone for Roms in the future.
I agree, there should be a way for ROM makers to get paid for their time. Likely, its illegal or a breach of some sort of contract/agreement/gobbledygook somewhere.
The developer for my favorite Eris ROM's, Tazz is having back issues and can't work, so this very issue is very relevant. I make sure and send him donations whenever possible.
For now, just send your favorite ROM devs donations through the links provided.
It's nice idea that you guys want to give back but honestly if deving was a paid gig I don't think you would have as good as results. I do it myself cause I tinker by nature and like to help other people. You will get a better end product if you have a dev that does this cause he likes it and not just cause he want to make money. Look at the number of useless apps on the market cause people just want to make money. Nothing wrong with making money and I myself sell apps but roms are a different ballgame. Plus rom dev's rarely write code of their own except for the cyanogenmod team. We all use the source available to us or other peoples work. Plus if you got paid for your rom you wouldn't want competition so who would share their work. If work was not shared in this community then android would not be what it is....
GPL violation anyone?
You'd have to include the source code with said paid work, and post said paid work's source code publicly, not disallowing anyone from modifying it or redistributing it. Wouldn't last long.
Plus, if the devs charged, then the CM team would charge them, and the google would charge then......... it would end up being way more than 3-5 bucks.
jadesdan said:
Plus, if the devs charged, then the CM team would charge them, and the google would charge then......... it would end up being way more than 3-5 bucks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
We'd have to throw some cash at the Hero devs too lol, and pretty much everyone that helped them,and on and on
Sent from my GSBv1.2 using XDA App
Good intentions! I am glad some people still think of the devs.
I have donated in the past, and will continue to do so. We are running GB on an Eris now! Without the devs, we would all be on Cupcake and hating it.
I'd like to take a second to thank the devs and the COMMUNITY as well. I have received lots of help here from regular joe's like me that are just looking for the latest and greatest, as well as the devs that make the magic happen.
We should all thank our lucky stars that we have been provided a place to share ideas, get help and help Android and other platforms evolve into new, fascinating and useful apps/OS's.
Thanks to the WHOLE community! I would pay each and every one of you if I could!
If you like something like this enough, why not do it for free? Especially in this kind of work.
There is not a single thing in open source licenses which prohibits people from charging for services rendered; it is a complete misrepresentation - and frankly a disservice to the Open Source community - to state that open source means "no money involved".
Open Source licenses only prohibit distribution of derivative works without also providing source code. As an example, it would be completely legal for someone to set up a paid web site where there is a charge to download the Linux source trees. In this (ridiculous) example, what is being paid for is the service - the license is satisfied because you are providing the source code.
Having said all that, note that "all of android" is not open source; in particular, the Google Apps, (HTC Sense, Motoblur, etc) and certain hardware-specific libraries are proprietary goods - even so-called "Pure AOSP" dev ROMs contain a small number of vendor libraries, which are technically illegal to redistribute.
I suspect that the legitimate owners of those goods turn a blind eye to small amounts of infringement because they can not monetize their legal actions (no blood from a turnip, etc); but also note that when infringement achieves a certain scale (as it did with CM and Google), they will certainly step in - the issue there has little to do with money; it's more about a legal principle of loss of rights due to failure to defend those rights in the face of significant infringement.
Charging people when you are infringing is a pretty sure way to get the attention of the infringed party.
bftb0
I use KaosFroyo on my Eris; I appreciate all of the work that has gone into it, and I have kicked some $$ back to Kaos for his efforts. That said, officially charging for ROMs sounds like a big mess for a bunch of reasons.
First off, how do you actually enforce it? Are we gonna set up some kind of ecommerce website? Do billing and customer service? It'll generate a bunch of tedious work that has nothing to do with actual ROM development, and paying someone else to do it would probably soak up all of the money. And are you going to sue and go after people who pirate it? But if you don't enforce it, then you pretty much have what you have now.
There's also the different expectations for a paid product. Right now, if some newbie can't figure something out and keeps posting stupid questions without reading the FAQ, then people can tell him to STFU/read the FAQ/release the Kraken/etc because it's a free product being developed by guys in their spare time that doesn't earn them much money. Start charging for it and you change that whole equation around - you now have to hold the newbies' hands or they'll scream for a refund and cause all sorts of trouble if they don't get it. Not to mention the liability - we know every now and then phones get bricked and data gets lost doing this stuff. If it's a paid product, then there may be legal liability for that in some markets. Who's gonna sort that out? Expensive lawyers?
Plus the other objections brought up regarding copyright/licensing of the proprietary libraries that are being used to make these ROMs.
Put it all together, and the current system seems like it's the best solution, even though the devs may not be getting as much money as they really deserve. So throw a few more bucks in the bucket for your favorite ROM.
bftb0 said:
There is not a single thing in open source licenses which prohibits people from charging for services rendered; it is a complete misrepresentation - and frankly a disservice to the Open Source community - to state that open source means "no money involved".
Open Source licenses only prohibit distribution of derivative works without also providing source code. As an example, it would be completely legal for someone to set up a paid web site where there is a charge to download the Linux source trees. In this (ridiculous) example, what is being paid for is the service - the license is satisfied because you are providing the source code.
Having said all that, note that "all of android" is not open source; in particular, the Google Apps, (HTC Sense, Motoblur, etc) and certain hardware-specific libraries are proprietary goods - even so-called "Pure AOSP" dev ROMs contain a small number of vendor libraries, which are technically illegal to redistribute.
I suspect that the legitimate owners of those goods turn a blind eye to small amounts of infringement because they can not monetize their legal actions (no blood from a turnip, etc); but also note that when infringement achieves a certain scale (as it did with CM and Google), they will certainly step in - the issue there has little to do with money; it's more about a legal principle of loss of rights due to failure to defend those rights in the face of significant infringement.
Charging people when you are infringing is a pretty sure way to get the attention of the infringed party.
bftb0
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Conap said:
It's nice idea that you guys want to give back but honestly if deving was a paid gig I don't think you would have as good as results. I do it myself cause I tinker by nature and like to help other people. You will get a better end product if you have a dev that does this cause he likes it and not just cause he want to make money. Look at the number of useless apps on the market cause people just want to make money. Nothing wrong with making money and I myself sell apps but roms are a different ballgame. Plus rom dev's rarely write code of their own except for the cyanogenmod team. We all use the source available to us or other peoples work. Plus if you got paid for your rom you wouldn't want competition so who would share their work. If work was not shared in this community then android would not be what it is....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IMHO, though there are many excellent views and points regarding all this posted in this thread, and the original intention was interesting, these two answers are the overall most complete and pertinent.
Way to go, guys!
ufmace said:
I use KaosFroyo on my Eris; I appreciate all of the work that has gone into it, and I have kicked some $$ back to Kaos for his efforts. That said, officially charging for ROMs sounds like a big mess for a bunch of reasons.
First off, how do you actually enforce it? Are we gonna set up some kind of ecommerce website? Do billing and customer service? It'll generate a bunch of tedious work that has nothing to do with actual ROM development, and paying someone else to do it would probably soak up all of the money. And are you going to sue and go after people who pirate it? But if you don't enforce it, then you pretty much have what you have now.
There's also the different expectations for a paid product. Right now, if some newbie can't figure something out and keeps posting stupid questions without reading the FAQ, then people can tell him to STFU/read the FAQ/release the Kraken/etc because it's a free product being developed by guys in their spare time that doesn't earn them much money. Start charging for it and you change that whole equation around - you now have to hold the newbies' hands or they'll scream for a refund and cause all sorts of trouble if they don't get it. Not to mention the liability - we know every now and then phones get bricked and data gets lost doing this stuff. If it's a paid product, then there may be legal liability for that in some markets. Who's gonna sort that out? Expensive lawyers?
Plus the other objections brought up regarding copyright/licensing of the proprietary libraries that are being used to make these ROMs.
Put it all together, and the current system seems like it's the best solution, even though the devs may not be getting as much money as they really deserve. So throw a few more bucks in the bucket for your favorite ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This was a pretty damn good answer, too, if you don't mind me saying.
One of the advantages of owning an Android device is the ability to install a custom ROM and making your device perfect for your tastes. You can’t talk about custom ROMs without mentioning the king of them all, CyanogenMod, which has just surpassed 1 million downloads. Created by Steve “Cyanogen” Kondik, the CyanogenMod team offers up-to-date custom ROMs that extend a phone’s capabilities with added features and utilities. Additionally, CM team member Koushik Dutta has been dabbling into the idea of creating an app store exclusively for root apps. With carriers and Google continuing to police the Android Market, removing tether apps, one click root apps, and emulators, Koush has become increasingly frustrated and originally proposed the idea of a root app store to Amazon, however the company was not interested. The proposed store would be open-source and available to any custom ROM, not just CyanogenMod.
found this on a site. pretty interesting
foxsdaddy67 said:
One of the advantages of owning an Android device is the ability to install a custom ROM and making your device perfect for your tastes. You can’t talk about custom ROMs without mentioning the king of them all, CyanogenMod, which has just surpassed 1 million downloads. Created by Steve “Cyanogen” Kondik, the CyanogenMod team offers up-to-date custom ROMs that extend a phone’s capabilities with added features and utilities. Additionally, CM team member Koushik Dutta has been dabbling into the idea of creating an app store exclusively for root apps. With carriers and Google continuing to police the Android Market, removing tether apps, one click root apps, and emulators, Koush has become increasingly frustrated and originally proposed the idea of a root app store to Amazon, however the company was not interested. The proposed store would be open-source and available to any custom ROM, not just CyanogenMod.
found this on a site. pretty interesting
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Saw koush's post about this on Google+. The idea being that part of the cost of purchased apps go to support CM development. I think its a great way to show Google what they are doing wrong with theirs.
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
Count me in!
Nice...hellz ya CM.
sent from my ICS'd Mopho
I say don't mess with the hornet's nest; keep it underground. If you're smart enough to root and sideload APKs, there's no need for a blackmarket. If you want to help out with CM financially, there are more direct routes.
bigbrown said:
I say don't mess with the hornet's nest; keep it underground. If you're smart enough to root and sideload APKs, there's no need for a blackmarket. If you want to help out with CM financially, there are more direct routes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's the hornets nest?
applanet is back up you all know....../??
---------- Post added at 11:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:41 PM ----------
Kcarpenter said:
Saw koush's post about this on Google+. The idea being that part of the cost of purchased apps go to support CM development. I think its a great way to show Google what they are doing wrong with theirs.
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree that google is doing a lot wrong, but they are doing a lot right too. Don't get me mistaken, I'll be the first to jump on a badmouth google train, something rubbed me wrong with them from the get go: back when they were founded, so I am very critical of them all the time. I also use almost all google services which says something as well, they provide a good product I just don't trust them.
The market has its flaws, but it is very very necessary. If windows distributed most of its software through a controlled repo, it would be nearly virus free like linux, as well as the repositorys system is amont the main things that keeps linux that way. If everyone started using indpedant repos, by human nature they would go the seediest most scandalous repos and add them as the main sources for software get their **** all bugged up and then come to the type of people who visit this site for help, constantly. They put a "use non-market apps" button in the settings menu, that's all they had to do. adding the functionality of that button is basically what jailbreaking an ipod is, and you see all the commotion over that, I give google credit for not having that even though with an open source OS it'd be hard not to, that's still less work we are all doing freeing our hands to use those resources to actually improving functionality of the devices, not just restore all the functionality they have.
But it could still help fund cyanogen. I see your point however, money is the name of the game.
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
This concept sounds similar to the Homebrew community that was available when I had my Palm Pre.
Essentially it was a market that became available when you rooted your phone where you can find both free and for purchase apps.
BigMoose81 said:
This concept sounds similar to the Homebrew community that was available when I had my Palm Pre.
Essentially it was a market that became available when you rooted your phone where you can find both free and for purchase apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well yeah, which is basically what Cydia is for the iphone, most jailbreaks automatically install cydia for you as most people who jailbreak their iphones don't really understand what it is they are doing and wouldn't have a clue what to do after they jailbreak their phone without cydia pointing them in the right direction.
And I certainly see your point craby, I watched Cydia go from basically what applanet is now to an actual financial force to be reckoned with and true competitor with the iStore that comes on iPhones. I think as we start to see dev teams get as organized regimented as the iphone ones this is certainly something that is an option, maybe that time is now. Not that android dev teams are any less talented, they face the same problems that deter many android app developers of portability. You can never be completely sure that something written for an android device will work right on all of them, especially if it isn't completely compartmentalized within dalvik VM or involves any use of native code and the NDK, because all android devices are different and have to comply with a standard. This is amplified by orders of magnitude when dealing with OS development as it is pretty much completely within the realms specified, as Java has to run inside it, although they implement java at such a low level most of android actually is java code. So even though android is open source, which is the very thing that both allows it to even really be hackable the way we do it, but also is purely the only reason that this many big companies can work in tandem without ripping each other to shreds in court so it is very hard to provide a uniform independent OS outside the vendor code and google code, and they aren't providing that code as a charity, they are providing it because they absolutely have to, they don't do anything to ease the process besides what they are obligated to generally. Remember companies in general are the enemy to you having full rights over your property, it's not enough for you to give them money they still want to partially own anything they sell you as well.
At least none of them seem to be as insanely paranoid about independent developer teams as Apple, who releases most of their ios updates simply to patch the exploits they find.
---------- Post added at 02:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:21 AM ----------
I have to add though that similar to apple's invention retail repositories, google has made a huge legacy of being the company that actually figured out how to make money with open source, and possibly saved the movement from dying under the weight of litigation, but it is a double edged sword as now they are kinda trying to run things and there is no way they are going to tell kernel.org people what is and isn't going in the linux kernel, they have been in charge of that stuff for way too long and can't be bought as they had no trouble maintaining the linux kernel before they were infused with all this new android and ubuntu money. We appreciate it google, but back off a little, you're getting yours.
I look forward to this, if it works out.
Would love to see this
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
I am thinking about privately developing an Android ROM built from source for a particular market that I am
thinking of targeting... Like Amazon have done with their Kindle HD built on ICS sources.
Would It be illegal to sell that ROM?
Could I patent/copyright the ROM or parts of it?
Is there any thing I need to consider from a legal perspective?
owen1978 said:
I am thinking about privately developing an Android ROM built from source for a particular market that I am
thinking of targeting... Like Amazon have done with their Kindle HD built on ICS sources.
Would It be illegal to sell that ROM?
Could I patent/copyright the ROM or parts of it?
Is there any thing I need to consider from a legal perspective?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The difference between your case and the Kindle though is that they're selling the hardware, not the software per se. Seems like selling a ROM would be getting in lots of complicated legalese stuff. You know, opening a can of worms.
You can get more information here:
http://source.android.com/
You cant take something thats open source write your own code ontop of it and call it closed source... Google has made that code opensource for a reason and im sure there are tons of legal issues that go with that... And it being Google's proprietary code means you cant sell it unless you buy it off them Im sure...
I'm pretty sure you can't do that. I could be wrong but i think as stated above if your using any of the open sources and then trying to sell it yourself you might be facing some legal issues. Plus would it sell? Are other roms available for that phone if so then why would choose to buy a rom? (just some questions that i would ask myself) Does it make sense to sell it even if you could? I think all the hassle you might go through isn't worth it. Especially if you might face a ton of legal issues.
Ask your self is it right decision to sell something that is based on something that is free and open source.
owen1978 said:
I am thinking about privately developing an Android ROM built from source for a particular market that I am
thinking of targeting... Like Amazon have done with their Kindle HD built on ICS sources.
Would It be illegal to sell that ROM?
Could I patent/copyright the ROM or parts of it?
Is there any thing I need to consider from a legal perspective?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think that it would be illegal. (Although it probably would not sale.
You could patent/copyright parts of it as many OEMs have done this (Like Samsung and Motorola)
Pneuma1985 said:
You cant take something thats open source write your own code ontop of it and call it closed source... Google has made that code opensource for a reason and im sure there are tons of legal issues that go with that... And it being Google's proprietary code means you cant sell it unless you buy it off them Im sure...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
y0yerrj0sh said:
I'm pretty sure you can't do that. I could be wrong but i think as stated above if your using any of the open sources and then trying to sell it yourself you might be facing some legal issues. Plus would it sell? Are other roms available for that phone if so then why would choose to buy a rom? (just some questions that i would ask myself) Does it make sense to sell it even if you could? I think all the hassle you might go through isn't worth it. Especially if you might face a ton of legal issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most, if not all, of the OEMs such as HTC, Samsung, Motorola, and LG incorporate thier own code into thier Android running on thier devices. While the Android code itself is under GPL and other open source classifications, much of the code OEMs put into thier builds is closed source (Sense, TouchWiz, Beats, etc.) and not subject to open source classifications. Therefore these companies DO NOT have to release that code.
The most important part though is that Apple has made a living suing Android OEMs for things they have patented that they claim Android infringes upon and have won some. THey do not attack Google, but the OEMs USING android. You may leave yourself open to legal implications with other companies like Apple.
However, I do not know your skill level, but given that you are asking the question, it seems as though you are just getting into this. Actally writing code and developing ROMs is pretty intense and I would think odds are you are getting much further ahead of yourself than you think.
Good luck to you, but most people on here do it for the fun/hobby and do not make any substantial money from thier efforts.
---------- Post added at 11:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:44 AM ----------
mv_style said:
Ask your self is it right decision to sell something that is based on something that is free and open source.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, ALL THE OEMs making Android devices are doing this.
raptoro07 said:
I don't think that it would be illegal. (Although it probably would not sale.
You could patent/copyright parts of it as many OEMs have done this (Like Samsung and Motorola)
Most, if not all, of the OEMs such as HTC, Samsung, Motorola, and LG incorporate thier own code into thier Android running on thier devices. While the Android code itself is under GPL and other open source classifications, much of the code OEMs put into thier builds is closed source (Sense, TouchWiz, Beats, etc.) and not subject to open source classifications. Therefore these companies DO NOT have to release that code.
The most important part though is that Apple has made a living suing Android OEMs for things they have patented that they claim Android infringes upon and have won some. THey do not attack Google, but the OEMs USING android. You may leave yourself open to legal implications with other companies like Apple.
However, I do not know your skill level, but given that you are asking the question, it seems as though you are just getting into this. Actally writing code and developing ROMs is pretty intense and I would think odds are you are getting much further ahead of yourself than you think.
Good luck to you, but most people on here do it for the fun/hobby and do not make any substantial money from thier efforts.
---------- Post added at 11:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:44 AM ----------
Again, ALL THE OEMs making Android devices are doing this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But once again, most OEMs don't sell Android in itself, but the hardware, with their customized Android version. There's quite a leap between repackaging Android and selling it and selling hardware with your software, based on Android, on it.
You are right about certain parts being closed source though.
You shouldn't develop something that is free and sell it for money. You may run into legal issues and perhaps a cease and desist order from Google when they find out. There's a reason android is open source. If it wasn't for legal issues, I would happily buy it from you if the ROM pretty awesome.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
AW: Develop a ROM and Sell it???
As far as I know Android is published on Apache License 2.0. If I understood the license correctly, you can use / modify / distribute projects based on the code as long as you declare what you used and as long as you distribute the license with your project, too.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
You can develop your own code into Android and sell it.
The problem is no one would buy it. You need much larger than a 1 man show to actually develop software. You may be able to write it yourself, but you can't possibly test it. Which is exactly why it won't sell. Any company who is in the market for a custom Android image would more than likely have their own in house team of coders, and the cost effictive way to move forward would be to have their own guys do it, even if they had to learn.
But self improvement is always great, I'd give it a shot anyway, just don't quit your job!
Google is a huge entity and not a force to be reckoned with.....
Sent from my Fire Kindling A-Pad
In the past, CM has allowed users to opt out of sending their data. It's recently decided to remove the "optout feature" (c'mon, is that really a "feature"), forcing users to eat it.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/0...pting-out-of-cm-stats-cyanogen-says-to-chill/
"Cyanogenmod Will No Longer Allow Opting Out of CM Stats-- Cyanogen Says to Chill"
in response, i kindly made this argument:
"A fundamental issue still exists. If the data is collected via a unique identifier, and it has a timestamp, then it isn't as anonymized as people think. Anyone with a basic understanding of data security knows that. I think the uproar has to do with the reputation of the team as the protectors and defenders of our platform...you give us choice. But when we see behavior that doesn't add up, were naturally going to believe you've used that position in the community to do evil. We understand you want the the data.
What doesn't make sense, and the natural road for us all to go down:
1) is this being used to monetize CM?
2) installation data: to include location, language, device, build version, and carrier, are all things that can be identified using a single, static event report. Why should we be comfortable with an always-collecting, transmitting-in-the-background service? What's the use-case for this? You've said yourself that Google Play apps themselves often collect this data..why is that method insufficient for CM? And why should we have to expect the same from you guys as we do from everyone else. Surely there's a way to collect the necessary data you need with a scalpel, negating the need for a device drag-net like this.
In all seriousness, i trust CM to do the right thing...i just can't tell right now if they've done the lazy thing, and created a service which is omnipresent, omnipotent, running in the background and silently spying on me, just so CM can tell which language my device is running, my general location, my build information, etc.
That's fine, it's simple data, and it's fairly straight forward.
The question is, if you needed that data (which CM says it does), then why are you collecting a much, much more complicated data set, and why won't a simple installation report do? Why won't running for a short period of time...say, 5-7 days do?
Why did they take the Carrier IQ route?
Maybe they want it just so they can have it. As Koushik stated on the google plus post (where he does a great job at assuaging some fears, and creating others):
"---Did you know over half of our users are in China? They just passed the US in terms of CM installation base.
Call it ego surfing, but the data is incredibly useful."
So they're collecting all this data, without a need? It's obvious why it's extremely useful to understand, say....which language most of your users use, etc. But you don't need a 24/7 service to find out what language people use your device in.
Anyways, here's the Google + Post:
https://plus.google.com/103583939320326217147/posts/GwnzKJijBKj
Here, he has, however, provided a screenshot of your data in action, assuaging the fears of most (we never truly get to see what our data looks like after its sent through the mizteereeus pipez of the interwebz, magically transformed, and then spit back out to an analyst), and he even tells you a bit about what data it collects. What he doesn't say, is why on earth submitting the data once, after installation, in a single report wont do, or why a build report once a week, or however often, wont do.
That's the end of my tinfoil hat tirade. Like i said, i love CM, i trust them, but i'm disappointed. The reasons i listed above are arguments made to explain why people are raising hell because of this. I don't believe they'll do anything nefarious, and personally, they can ego=surf with my data all they want. It IS pretty cool. Maybe the move was a tad bit short-sighted though, because they may have gotten a bit out of touch with their users, and their users opinion of them-- and that's what my posts were supposed to do...they were supposed to bring the way I (and other's) think about them more in line with reality.
Edit: It's important to note that, as explained to us by CM, CM Statistics calls home upon reboot. Whether it runs all the time, or just for a nanosecond upon reboot, or 24/7 is important as well, but I'm unable to verify any of this, because my github skills are w34ks4uce. If we had a independent dev who could take a look at CM Stats and then explain exactly (key word) what it was collecting, that'd be über helpful....but it wouldn't mean anything in the long run. Because I was viewing the macroscopic effects of the decision. A comprehensive announcement and explanation wold probably have been prescient, because the information contained in the Google+ post is just as key as the announcement itself-- the stigma of collecting data is far to strong to just say one day-- "sneaky, sneaky--no more opting out".
Nothing has changed here, only the fact that it's enabled by default vs opt-out. The dataset hasn't changed.
Don't use it if you don't like it. They are not spying on you. WITHOUT stats they would have zero visibility to what is actually used. Download data is trash compared to actual usage.
And what if they decide they want to improve Language X translations, but only 10 people use it? Worth it? Or what about Device Y that only a handful of people are still clinging onto? Resources can be used in better ways.
I knew I'd see a post crying about this eventually...
If this thread turns into a flame fest it will be locked
As for data collection...you are using Android right?
Also check the permissions to all those third party apps.
Thanks in advance for keeping this thread civil or ignoring it.
Friendly Neighborhood Moderator
I take my privacy seriously, as I'm sure most of us do. As mentioned previously market apps gain a certain amount of info from us.
Maybe CM should have a free version with no opt out or a pay version with one (key maybe). That should make everyone happy.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium
khaytsus said:
Nothing has changed here, only the fact that it's enabled by default vs opt-out. The dataset hasn't changed.
Don't use it if you don't like it. They are not spying on you. WITHOUT stats they would have zero visibility to what is actually used. Download data is trash compared to actual usage.
And what if they decide they want to improve Language X translations, but only 10 people use it? Worth it? Or what about Device Y that only a handful of people are still clinging onto? Resources can be used in better ways.
I knew I'd see a post crying about this eventually...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This.
Whoooooooo caaaares delete thread
RoOt-[]D [] []V[] []D-BeEr
Solution to all this: OpenPDroid
briand.mooreg said:
I take my privacy seriously, as I'm sure most of us do. As mentioned previously market apps gain a certain amount of info from us.
Maybe CM should have a free version with no opt out or a pay version with one (key maybe). That should make everyone happy.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this is a brilliant idea, regardless of the status of CM Stats. A paid version with a extra feature set would be awesome.
As far as the argument for data like language, region, build, etc. I think we can say conclusively that this could be handled by a installation report, that runs once after installation or upgrade.
The type of data they need doesn't neccesitate a background service, which is why its naturally suspicious.
Sent from my Transformer using XDA Premium HD app
btswein said:
This.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I though is was enabled by default. Is this something the devs choose? Upon installation, i see a "cm statistics is running" banner in notification. Even so, what's changing, is their removing opt out all together.
Sent from my Transformer using XDA Premium HD app
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/35047/
well there you have it:
Commit MessagePermalink
Restore the opt-out for stats.
* Apparently this is a bigger issue for a small number of extremely
vocal users. We should respect their wishes, no matter how off-base
their claims are in this context.
Change-Id: I9eef9a65260ec4e360d398f80d610a198c09c915
Thanks to: khaytsus
for posting the link
khaytsus said:
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/35047/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is there a way we can educate/frame a conversation around how to do this in a way accepting of the vocal crowd? Perhaps an outreach campaign, minimal in effort that might encourage more users to opt in? This is an area where fundamental good can be done. The same people who've been vocal should have no problem explaining what would get them to opt in.
I think this whole thing might have been a brief thing, but if the statistics really help the project, we can all have our cake and eat it too.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using XDA Premium HD app
khaytsus said:
I knew I'd see a post crying about this eventually...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You knew you'd see a post crying about this because of all that data your collecting told you lol!
Just teasin!
I would have just frozen the background service. ...
We rooty types can do that sort of thing now days. ..
And just to prevent the assumption that I missed the point of the OP. ...I didn't, and can only imagine the amount of target data our carriers pull by simply using our device. (See lengthy contract and service agreement of your carrier)...
CM data is small potatoes by comparison. ..and while quite useful to them in the generation of custom firmwares, it's a useless data source for us.
I've freely given cyanogen my data for years. And in return Steve has given me high quality work for my trouble. .....privacy concerns accepted. ....g
The easiest way to prevent CM from getting any data from you is too not install, not really that hard to figure out.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium
Just posting a reminder that any rom posted here has to have the MI store removed from the rom. The app is banned as it provides warez.
You've effectively killed this forum, the only source of ROMs for our device. Thanks.
degrees089 said:
You've effectively killed this forum, the only source of ROMs for our device. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All it takes is having the app removed. Not really hard.
This app has been banned since the beginning of Xiaomi producing miui roms. It's nothing new.
zelendel said:
All it takes is having the app removed. Not really hard.
This app has been banned since the beginning of Xiaomi producing miui roms. It's nothing new.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, if you say that this is so easy, please just give us direct instructions on how to remove this store without getting bootloop.
Go ahead.
domi.nos said:
Well, if you say that this is so easy, please just give us direct instructions on how to remove this store without getting bootloop.
Go ahead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are Tuts on how to get gapps working.
I have never tried myself as these devices are banned from being own at my job so I'm not even allowed to get one. Nor would I ever.
Don't get mad at us. Get mad at them for excluding a warez market in their roms.
zelendel said:
Get mad at them for excluding a warez market in their roms.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
May be I do not know something.
I have tried to look for some warez there - I could not find anything.
anmg said:
May be I do not know something.
I have tried to look for some warez there - I could not find anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same. Some stupid policies and some stupid myths. Perhaps there used to be some sort of warez there accidentally and everyone is still being anal about it. As you can see mods don't really care about this phone. You can see by posts like "I would never get their devices". So childish
usblaidas said:
Same. Some stupid policies and some stupid myths. Perhaps there used to be some sort of warez there accidentally and everyone is still being anal about it. As you can see mods don't really care about this phone. You can see by posts like "I would never get their devices". So childish
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not a matter of childish. I have many reason why I would never own one of their devices and that being the fact that the oem is on my jobs banned list.
Also all you have to do is look at any of the so called. Free apps that are paid apps on the Android market.
Make no mistake it was not accidental at all. China is known for things like this.
As for the mods. We have been around long enough to know the story with them so, no none of use would ever touch one of their devices. But that is pointless as it's up to the users to do something with it.
Also all you have to do is look at any of the so called. Free apps that are paid apps on the Android market
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
any proof please.
anmg said:
any proof please.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can look yourself. Just do a compare between the 2 stores. That was part of the reasons why miui roms were banned for the longest time.
You have to remember that MIUI started here on xda before Xiaomi bought them out.
Warez or not, MI Store sucks ass, but banning ROMs is pointless, MIUI forum is trash, I still don't know how it works, and some ROM's has backdoors and for example, they send paid SMS to vietnam, That sh!t costed me 50 bucks!!!
zelendel said:
It's not a matter of childish. I have many reason why I would never own one of their devices and that being the fact that the oem is on my jobs banned list.
Also all you have to do is look at any of the so called. Free apps that are paid apps on the Android market.
Make no mistake it was not accidental at all. China is known for things like this.
As for the mods. We have been around long enough to know the story with them so, no none of use would ever touch one of their devices. But that is pointless as it's up to the users to do something with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hey, I'm curious about these stories that made you stay away from xiaomi devices. May I ask for more information or maybe links about that? Thank you.
khnoizer said:
hey, I'm curious about these stories that made you stay away from xiaomi devices. May I ask for more information or maybe links about that? Thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you look around the internet you will find all the stories you need. They are alos on the military banned list in the US due to ties with the Chinese military.
zelendel said:
It's not a matter of childish. I have many reason why I would never own one of their devices and that being the fact that the oem is on my jobs banned list.
Also all you have to do is look at any of the so called. Free apps that are paid apps on the Android market.
Make no mistake it was not accidental at all. China is known for things like this.
As for the mods. We have been around long enough to know the story with them so, no none of use would ever touch one of their devices. But that is pointless as it's up to the users to do something with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
zelendel said:
If you look around the internet you will find all the stories you need. They are alos on the military banned list in the US due to ties with the Chinese military.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, but I suppose if we use non MIUI rom such as cm, then these risk of using xiaomi devices is gone right? also, what do you think of Mokee Rom? As it's also made by chinese people, and you said that china is known for "something", is it might also poses similar risks?
khnoizer said:
Thank you, but I suppose if we use non MIUI rom such as cm, then these risk of using xiaomi devices is gone right? also, what do you think of Mokee Rom? As it's also made by chinese people, and you said that china is known for "something", is it might also poses similar risks?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First let me make one thing very clear. I have nothing against Chinese people that make software. You have to understand the Government that runs the country there, to have a small understanding. You see In china they have the right to monitor everything their citizens are doing on the internet. This is part of the reason for the great firewall of china. So spyware, malware and other software that helps in this are normally sponsered by the Military to help in doing just this.
I have never used it myself but as it is an open source based OS it should be good. You can see just what it is doing. The hard part will be the coding translations, as things dont always translate right.
Any non MIUI based rom should be ok. The problem with that is CM is normally buggy and all the roms use the patch rom setup which is never really stable nor is it something I would trust as that is injecting stuff into a rom that I cant VET.
In this day and age one has to be careful with all these new toys that are coming to many markets across the world.
Remember, You get what you pay for. So if something is too good to be true then you have to find the catch.
zelendel said:
First let me make one thing very clear. I have nothing against Chinese people that make software. You have to understand the Government that runs the country there, to have a small understanding. You see In china they have the right to monitor everything their citizens are doing on the internet. This is part of the reason for the great firewall of china. So spyware, malware and other software that helps in this are normally sponsered by the Military to help in doing just this.
I have never used it myself but as it is an open source based OS it should be good. You can see just what it is doing. The hard part will be the coding translations, as things dont always translate right.
Any non MIUI based rom should be ok. The problem with that is CM is normally buggy and all the roms use the patch rom setup which is never really stable nor is it something I would trust as that is injecting stuff into a rom that I cant VET.
In this day and age one has to be careful with all these new toys that are coming to many markets across the world.
Remember, You get what you pay for. So if something is too good to be true then you have to find the catch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great explanation, Thank you, sir.
Um, sorry.. may i know what's happen here and why miui store shouldn't be here?
zelendel said:
First let me make one thing very clear. I have nothing against Chinese people that make software. You have to understand the Government that runs the country there, to have a small understanding. You see In china they have the right to monitor everything their citizens are doing on the internet. [ ... ] .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are right about the store, i was quite surprised when i found paid apps there. This is correct.
But i'm not sure if this is still the case, i saw them a year ago, now i couldn't find the apps,
maybe they've cleaned the store in meantime.
And a script removing apps isn't hard, just search for "updater-script remove apps".
BUT i've tried such script on Sony Xperia P, not in MIUI, i don't know if deleting Mi Store (com.xiaomi.mipicks) would cause bootloop or not.
I know that Mi Store enabled/disabled is region dependent, you can disable it when switching to another region in Beta rom.
But deleting? I know that when i've deleted Updater apk, or changed its permissions, it caused bootloop. Needs to be confirmed.
But with government spying - if you want to be honest - maybe we should ban all ROMs tied with Google, which means all Androids?
Remember about PRISM and Edward Snowden?
American's NSA (National Security Agency) ?
I have nothing to American people, just sayin.
But according to former CIA employee, Edward Snowden, Google joined to the NSA spying program in 14 Jan 2009.
I think that you simply have a choice - either give your personal data to American or to Chinese people. (or both).
You can minimize the risk by disabling for ex. Analytics app... etc.
But saying that chinese are spying... USA govt does the same
And better not looking for Echelon project...
But - the main topic here - yes, it's a good idea to remove Mi Store from roms.
One can always add it himself/herself, there are also other stores, F-droid, Aptoid, there is a choice
American companies aren't communist nor are they guilty of some of the most sever human rights violations in the world.
khnoizer said:
hey, I'm curious about these stories that made you stay away from xiaomi devices. May I ask for more information or maybe links about that? Thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
kocak juga doi.. ditanyak suru kasi bukti malah ngeyel muluk.. emang koplak kalik.. pdhal amrik sama parahnya.. huehuehue..